4-2-5 D?

#27

LittleVol

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#27
I like it. Opportunity to match your talent to the scheme in the LBs and safeties, whether a hybrid guy like Tamarion McDonald or a bruiser like Bryson Eason.

I wish we could've held on to Key Lawrence long enough for Banks to at least make his sales pitch.
DeNiko Slaughter beat him out in camp.

He's no slouch. And it was entirely unfair for Ansley to ask him to cover Shi Smith one on one as a true freshman. NFL veterans will have trouble with that same task next season
 
#30

spyfish007

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#30
Those of you saying that we have been running this the majority of the time under Pruitt need to learn what the 3-4 is. 3-4 vs 11 personnel or 20 with an H back frequently looks like a 4-2-5 but isn't. A lot of the time, in today's game your outside linebackers in the 3-4 and either flexed, apexed, or walked down. Against 12 personnel or 22 personnel it can even look like the old school 52 or 53. It just depends on the set.
The 4-2-5 has a couple of schools of thought which are interesting. A couple of guys play it as a cover two hybrid with the safety playing at 7 yards as basically an extra linebacker. It can be really confusing to qbs to identify coverages when this style is played. It really helps against inside zone teams. We also frequently got abused against the slant and traditionally, the middle safety in the 4-2-5 is supposed to rob this route and the other two safeties play cover two behind.
I tend to agree. For me the biggest thing is to evaluate what happens post snap and not get to focused on the alignment pre snap.
 
#32

jwilliams

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#32
Just musing here... maybe Pruitt's failure on defense is more a testament to Saban's abilities. Pruitt never had to install that defense from scratch, teaching it to players who have never been in it. Saban did that for him.
 
#33

93AllvolSc

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#33
I tend to agree. For me the biggest thing is to evaluate what happens post snap and not get to focused on the alignment pre snap.
I couldn’t disagree more . We preach alignment / assignment . My kids have probably heard me say that phrase more than anything else I’ve ever said In Their life. All defenses are designed by nature to stop or take away from the offense something they are trying to accomplish. With a 4-2-5 it allows you to line up to multiple fronts and situations and create advantages. For instance if they go trips to the boundary on 1st -10 we apex the overhang to split between 2-3 and play the flats. If they are bunch on this formation we use the overhang to x or press #2 to take away the slant and bubble. However let’s say it’s 3rd and 1 and they come out balanced . We walk both overhangs down and plug all 6 lanes on the front . But none of this happens or works post snap. They have to know where to line up and what their assignments are to be successful and attack.
 
#34

spyfish007

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#34
I couldn’t disagree more . We preach alignment / assignment . My kids have probably heard me say that phrase more than anything else I’ve ever said In Their life. All defenses are designed by nature to stop or take away from the offense something they are trying to accomplish. With a 4-2-5 it allows you to line up to multiple fronts and situations and create advantages. For instance if they go trips to the boundary on 1st -10 we apex the overhang to split between 2-3 and play the flats. If they are bunch on this formation we use the overhang to x or press #2 to take away the slant and bubble. However let’s say it’s 3rd and 1 and they come out balanced . We walk both overhangs down and plug all 6 lanes on the front . But none of this happens or works post snap. They have to know where to line up and what their assignments are to be successful and attack.
I think you missed my point. I might not have been clear enough. How the defense looks at snap does not mean that is where or what the defense is actually running. You can push the OLBs up in a 3-4 scheme to make it look like 5-2. Follow?
 
#35

ATLVols

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#35
Linebacker was a strength of our defense until the possible transfers. I guess having less linebackers will help with any attrition we experience at that position.
 
#37
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#37
I couldn’t disagree more . We preach alignment / assignment . My kids have probably heard me say that phrase more than anything else I’ve ever said In Their life. All defenses are designed by nature to stop or take away from the offense something they are trying to accomplish. With a 4-2-5 it allows you to line up to multiple fronts and situations and create advantages. For instance if they go trips to the boundary on 1st -10 we apex the overhang to split between 2-3 and play the flats. If they are bunch on this formation we use the overhang to x or press #2 to take away the slant and bubble. However let’s say it’s 3rd and 1 and they come out balanced . We walk both overhangs down and plug all 6 lanes on the front . But none of this happens or works post snap. They have to know where to line up and what their assignments are to be successful and attack.
Exactly. So much more than than a 4-2-5, 3-4, 4-3.... you can run one of those defenses all day but you don’t know how to align properly and match coverage and front together then your screwed.
 
#38

GreyWolf1129

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#38
4-2-5 if you have DE's or DT's who can get to the QB. You have to, have to, create pressure either at the point of the pass (QB), or point of the reception (WR/TE/RB). So if you can create pressure with 4, then it's 4-2-5.

If not, then it's 3-3-5. Here, you concede the pass rush, and focus on using 3 LB's/Hybrids to shut down the 5-7 yard range between the hashes, and trust the back 5 to cover the rest of it. This is an oversimplification...there are too many nuances and details to cover here...but that's the basic idea.

I have no idea what UT will field, or how well they will play it. But I do think that, for the first time since Lane Kiffin set foot on UT's campus, we have a coaching staff that is going to bring a winning attitude and strategy to Volunteer Football. As an aside, I think Lane pissed away a chance to do great things at UT. That being said, I think Coach Heupel has the opportunity to make us all glad that it played out the way it did. It hinges on too many factors and variables to list here, but I do believe that we've (finally) got a HC who knows how to win, and has proven it at his previous jobs. Let's hope he raises the bar at UT. If he does, he'll have his pick of players, and coaches, within 3 years. If so, UT is back. On the national level.

Like it or not, he's our coach. If you're a true Vol fan, or a VFL, then...like me...you're hoping he comes out of the gate like a dog with its' ass on fire. So...

Go Vols.
 
#39
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#39
I think you missed my point. I might not have been clear enough. How the defense looks at snap does not mean that is where or what the defense is actually running. You can push the OLBs up in a 3-4 scheme to make it look like 5-2. Follow?
I’m pretty sure he follows but just to be clear... all these 3-4 4-2 3-3 1-5 whatever you want to call it, it is just what you categorize players as.. you can call it a 4-2 and the opposing offense might call it a 3-3 depending on how the define positions and rules for those positions. The important thing is.... where are the overhangs and what are they doing?
 
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#41
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#41
Every defense is basically a 4-2-5 the body types are mending so much that it’s starting to blend all together. We will be 3-4 in our base I would assume but if your not multiple then your dead in today’s game. Really more important what we are doing in the back end as far as man match zone match then anything else.
“then what”?
 
#46

spyfish007

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#46
I’m pretty sure he follows but just to be clear... all these 3-4 4-2 3-3 1-5 whatever you want to call it, it is just what you categorize players as.. you can call it a 4-2 and the opposing offense might call it a 3-3 depending on how the define positions and rules for those positions. The important thing is.... where are the overhangs and what are they doing?
That is a very fair point. So many athletic players stretch the traditional definitions of various roles. If you go back to my original point the discussion was really different.
 
#47

93AllvolSc

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#47
I think you missed my point. I might not have been clear enough. How the defense looks at snap does not mean that is where or what the defense is actually running. You can push the OLBs up in a 3-4 scheme to make it look like 5-2. Follow?
No I understand what your saying. Disguising defenses are effective. My observations the last 2 seasons. We had way too many blown or missed assignments on defense. Multiple times this year i saw our Lb’s in particular miss run fits and back out in the flats. You can run the most elaborate schemes you want but too but if the Jimmy’s and Joe’s don’t know x’ and O’s your gonna get smoked . Think of it this way you can enter a Ferrari in a go cart race but if the drivers blind your gonna lose. All of this was so frustrating this year cause we had a HC that wouldn’t play other Qb’s cause they supposedly didn’t have a grasp of the playbook yet we kept trying to run defensive schemes that left players esp the back end confused and out of position.
 
#49

RockyTopTexas

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#49
I’m pretty sure he follows but just to be clear... all these 3-4 4-2 3-3 1-5 whatever you want to call it, it is just what you categorize players as.. you can call it a 4-2 and the opposing offense might call it a 3-3 depending on how the define positions and rules for those positions. The important thing is.... where are the overhangs and what are they doing?
Thank you lol like do people know who sham is? Alonte off the edge?
 

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