2020 Presidential Race

#85,226
#85,226
Another “clarity” post:

I don’t think Trump’s win in the 2016 election was illegitimate.

I do know there is evidence that Russia intervened in the election on his behalf and that his campaign welcomed Russian assistance.

The result of that knowledge is not that I believe the win was illegitimate. That knowledge is simply evidence that he is unfit to hold office because he lacks certain personal attributes such as honesty, character, and empathy that would enable him to put the national interest above his own in any situation.

The 2016 election was not the first, last, or even the most convincing evidence in support of that opinion.
 
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#85,228
#85,228
#85,229
#85,229
MontyPython said:
Here ya go, conspiracy theorists:

Sasse condemns Giuliani's 'wild press conferences': They 'erode public trust'

Sen. Ben Sasse (R-Neb.) offered blistering criticism of a press conference held on Thursday by Rudy Giuliani and other lawyers representing the Trump campaign, warning that they "erode public trust."

"Wild press conferences erode public trust. So no, obviously Rudy and his buddies should not pressure electors to ignore their certification obligations under the statute We are a nation of laws, not tweets," Sasse said in a statement.

"Based on what I've read in their filings, when Trump campaign lawyers have stood before courts under oath, they have repeatedly refused to actually allege grand fraud—because there are legal consequences for lying to judges," Sasse said.

"President Trump lost Michigan by more than 100,000 votes and the campaign and its allies have lost in or withdrawn all five lawsuits in Michigan for being unable to produce any evidence," he added.
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And an illegal investigation of Trump from before he entered office until almost the end of his tenure didn't erode public trust? You guys have some funny takes on things ... including Russian memes as election tampering vs rolling out a never used and questionable vote getting operation - mail it in voting with no real assurance about who the actual voter was.
 
#85,232
#85,232
AM64 said:
And an illegal investigation of Trump from before he entered office until almost the end of his tenure didn't erode public trust? You guys have some funny takes on things ... including Russian memes as election tampering vs rolling out a never used and questionable vote getting operation - mail it in voting with no real assurance about who the actual voter was.
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The legal investigation raised my level of trust.
 
#85,234
#85,234
Orangeslice13 said:
We even discussed it on election night when it happened. We were all here when the counting stopped and were discussing why it happened
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The big count surge in at least one state about the time counting resumed is a little hard to figure. Nobody was counting, but the count increased bit time - seems strange. Doesn't mean anything nefarious happened, but the explanations for all the weirdness aren't very credible.
 
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#85,235
#85,235
AM64 said:
And an illegal investigation of Trump from before he entered office until almost the end of his tenure didn't erode public trust? You guys have some funny takes on things ... including Russian memes as election tampering vs rolling out a never used and questionable vote getting operation - mail it in voting with no real assurance about who the actual voter was.
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(1) Investigation not illegal, and Trump not cleared of wrong-doing;
(2) Russians did tamper with the election per *all* of Trump's own intelligence agencies; and
(3) Mail-in voting has occurred since the 1600's and in large numbers since the 1860s.

Trump lost. The end. Get over it.
 
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#85,236
tvolsfan said:
One last potential hurdle:



Given the importance of Georgia's senate races, I wouldn't b shocked to see some GOP (Trump) pressure on Kemp to hold off on signing the paperwork.
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Looking at the statute I don’t think Kemp has discretion. It’s a ministerial certification. He could do something crazy but I think the remedy would he in court.
 
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#85,239
GoBigOrangeUT said:
Did you finally find the proof of this? All of the other claims have been debunked.
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You have to have access to the records to prove anything. I think Fouci's famous word "anecdotal" evidence applies. It's always going to be anecdotal if no independent party (not political party - independent auditor) can or will do a deep dive into the data. And as somebody pointed out the Publisher's Clearinghouse method of running an election is ripe for fraud. The mailed out ballots may as well have been addressed to "John Doe or Current Occupant" - even more true if you don't bother with even signature matches, as poor a validation as even that is.
 
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#85,240
norrislakevol said:
Mattis and his ilk want perpetual war. It's what they live for.
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No, Mattis and his types want a perpetual line of new toys to play with; they don't really want to get into people being killed to prove that the new toys have limitations. Now the people who make the disposables - ammunition, bombs, rockets, the new big ticket toys, etc, those are the people interested in perpetual war.
 
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#85,242
GoBigOrangeUT said:
I too am married, and a father of 1. At least my child will carry the proof that I have indeed at least once had sex.
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Gotta feel sorry for husbands who didn't have enough sense to have sex before marriage and never learned what it's all about.
 
#85,248
#85,248
titansvolsfaninga said:
I think they pissed off Brad Raffensperger.
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“Working as an engineer throughout my life, I live by the motto that numbers don’t lie." Yeah, working as an engineer doing test and analysis I believe the same. However, I worked even harder to insure the integrity of the data, and I was never opposed to a review of review any phase of the test or the results, and the original untouched data were there for review or reanalysis. Testing in a nuclear plant is similar in some ways to an election - it's a big event because of the time, cost, and implications; it's not the same as plugging your car in for an emissions test and getting an OK ... assuming nobody diddled with the software.
 
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#85,250
Stew Cook said:
After Rudy and Sidney yesterday, who could blame Dominion opting to not sit down for a clown show.

I think "talk to our attorney" is the standard protocol, when expecting to walk into a media spectacle ambush.
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Or... maybe what Powell is alleging is true? One of the things that she mentioned was how anti-Trump the people over that software are. This isn't debated, it is in their own social media posts they have since deleted. One even stating that he made sure that Trump didn't win. That's a real post.

But sure, let's just dismiss it without investigation because we don't want it to be true?
 
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