2016 Election Thread Part Deux

#8,052
#8,052
lawgator1 said:
Big immigration speech by Amnesty Don coming up Wednesday.

I'm going out on a limb: 1) Build wall; 2) Mexico pays for it; 3) illegal immigrants with felony charges, or misdemeanor charges involving drugs or violence, will be deported "immediately."

He still will offer some namby pamby b.s. on his earlier commitment to forcing all illegals out, then his backtracking and saying no to that, and then his backbacktracking on that and saying he will.

This will be followed by Pence and the new woman, what's her name, going on the talk shows and ignoring the questions about it and just saying he's been consistent throughout. Which he has not.
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:snoring::snoring::snoring:
 
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#8,056
#8,056
lawgator1 said:
Big immigration speech by Amnesty Don coming up Wednesday.

I'm going out on a limb: 1) Build wall; 2) Mexico pays for it; 3) illegal immigrants with felony charges, or misdemeanor charges involving drugs or violence, will be deported "immediately."

He still will offer some namby pamby b.s. on his earlier commitment to forcing all illegals out, then his backtracking and saying no to that, and then his backbacktracking on that and saying he will.

This will be followed by Pence and the new woman, what's her name, going on the talk shows and ignoring the questions about it and just saying he's been consistent throughout. Which he has not.
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Trump is indeed trying to moderate his immigration position. Anyone saying he hasn't isn't being honest with the situation. I believe it's a pretty dirty thing to do given how many people voted for him for just this issue.
 
#8,058
#8,058
DC_Vol said:
Trump is indeed trying to moderate his immigration position. Anyone saying he hasn't isn't being honest with the situation. I believe it's a pretty dirty thing to do given how many people voted for him for just this issue.
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Anybody that thought he was going to deport 11 million immigrants forcibly is higher than I am right now. Let's secure the damn border and make everify the law of the land, no citizenship for existing illegals but allow them to continue to work and pay into the system. Elongate welfare and healthcare for illegals and they'll leave on their own..
 
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#8,060
#8,060
FLVOL69 said:
Anybody that thought he was going to deport 11 million immigrants forcibly is higher than u am right now. Let's secure the damn border and make everify the law of the land, no citizenship for existing illegals but allow them to continue to work and pay into the system. Elongate welfare and healthcare for illegals and they'll leave on their own..
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I don't disagree with you, but he's slowly moderating his position. I wonder where else he will do this?
 
#8,062
#8,062
DC_Vol said:
I don't disagree with you, but he's slowly moderating his position. I wonder where else he will do this?
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I'll take that risk, Hillary will flip the Supreme Court and raise taxes while importing an additional one million Muslim immigrants, no thanks, I'll take my chances with Trump
 
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#8,064
#8,064
FLVOL69 said:
I'll take that risk, Hillary will flip the Supreme Court and raise taxes while importing an additional one million Muslim immigrants, no thanks, I'll take my chances with Trump
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Yeah, I won't be voting for Hillary. Trump is still a huge unknown, and I'm not going to ignore his policy shifts just because he's running against a far worse candidate. His past leaves a lot of room for doubts on how strong his principles really are. I think we will see more shifting as the general election draws closer.
 
#8,070
#8,070
It's amazing that trump has made it this far on a platform of protectionism. Is there idea more liberal than the type of control over the market that trump is seeking?

Trump: companies should only be able to hire documented workers.
Free market: you have no right to tell others who they can hire

Trump: i won't allow businesses to leave this country
Free market: you have no right to tell others what to do with their business

Trump: we should raise the minimum wage
Free market: you have no right to tell others what to do with their business

Trump: if it benefits the majority, you should be forced to sell your land to private companies
Free market: are you sure this isn't the socialist party's candidate?
 
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#8,071
#8,071
Vol8188 said:
It's amazing that trump has made it this far on a platform of protectionism. Is there idea more liberal than the type of control over the market that trump is seeking?

Trump: companies should only be able to hire documented workers.
Free market: you have no right to tell others who they can hire

Trump: i won't allow businesses to leave this country
Free market: you have no right to tell others what to do with their business

Trump: we should raise the minimum wage
Free market: you have no right to tell others what to do with their business

Trump: if it benefits the majority, you should be forced to sell your land to private companies
Free market: are you sure this isn't the socialist party's candidate?
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While I despise Trump as much as you, one thing that grieves me about our politics is the false corollary that was drawn between conservatism and the free market, especially over the last two to three decades. How did this happen? There is hardly anything "conservative" about the free market. The free market is another liberal utopianist project. As soon as conservatives can move on from such magical thinking, rid themselves of the race tribalists in their ranks, and stop thinking that man once walked with dinosaurs, we should be good to go.

More Bismarkian conservatism (minus its reactionary monarchism and rigid classism) and less Adam Smith and Jerry Falwell.
 
#8,072
#8,072
volprof said:
While I despise Trump as much as you, one thing that grieves me about our politics is the false corollary that was drawn between conservatism and the free market, especially over the last two to three decades. How did this happen? There is hardly anything "conservative" about the free market. The free market is another liberal utopianist project. As soon as conservatives can move on from such magical thinking, rid themselves of the race tribalists in their ranks, and stop thinking that man once walked with dinosaurs, we should be good to go.

More Bismarkian conservatism (minus its reactionary monarchism and rigid classism) and less Adam Smith and Jerry Falwell.
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lol you consider free market economics to be "magical thinking"? And yes, the free market and smaller government is very conservative. There's nothing liberal about Austrian Economics
 
#8,073
#8,073
Vol8188 said:
lol you consider free market economics to be "magical thinking"? And yes, the free market and smaller government is very conservative. There's nothing liberal about Austrian Economics
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There is absolutely nothing conservative about the free market and smaller government. That's some post-1950 Republican Party nonsense.

And, yes, the free market is magical thinking, akin to communist utopias. They both have good intentions and some positive thoughts on society, but neither is actually sustainable in real life. The two are actually two sides of the same coin. Communism is the tyranny of authoritarianism, while libertarianism is the tyranny of freedom. Both are well-intentioned originally but will lead to overwhelming violence and injustice in practice.

I suppose a limited libertarianism could work just fine, but libertarians are just like anyone else: they'll eventually just want more.
 
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