2-Top 25(22) final rankings in a row!!!!!

#76
#76
'Boro-vol said:
For me that's answered by the 8.7 career average. That's who he is as a coach....and while that's not bad, it's not what gets Tennessee where it is supposed to be. As proven, it's not adequate for winning the East, which is the first step to anything worthwhile.

I don't buy the 6 year timeframe any more than I buy the Best Coach in America statement. Both are coachspeak...one of which is designed to limit expectations.
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How long did it take Dabo at Clemson to win the national championship?

And let's not pretend in his 8 years at the helm that the ACC has been as heavy as the SEC.

See also: ''Clemsoning". That was a term created to illustrate a talented team falling short of expectations.
 
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#77
#77
not necessarily a "Butch" guy...try to be positive and realistic about the game, as well as skeptical about the ridiculous comparisons and adulation for coaches who are losing the same type of matchups....or worse.

Finishing 9-4 and ranked is a win...not the one we all wanted or anticipated, but better than a lesser alternative.

Opportunity definitely squandered this year - no valid reason to lose to SCAR, nor Vandy. They are probably better than most of us want to give credit, but not at the same level as our VOLS. I also don't think the East is necessarily "down"...if so, maybe the whole SEC is. Every East team, 'cep our VOLS and SCAR (ouch), split w/ their West opponents.

Out the gate; this team looked soft, unmotivated and undisciplined - must say, this did come as a surprise to me. As outmatched as they may have been the previous 2 years they played hard for 4 quarters, and last year's squad took it to every opponent...'cep Arkansas.

Injuries are not a catch-all excuse, but the magnitude can/does/will have an effect at some point. Whether it's one guy out of position at the wrong time or missing a key assignment....going into the 3rd and 4th deep at key positions along the entire D did have an impact.

I've read multiple opinions, "insider" tidbits, etc. on various topics the past few months. I don't think Jones is incompetent, nor content w/ this season's results. He may be an slightly above average coach, like the majority in CFB. I do agree that he does need to get his staff in order and take control of future teams if there is going to be improvement in product on the field...and more importantly...wins.
 
#79
#79
daj2576 said:
How long did it take Dabo at Clemson to win the national championship?

And let's not pretend in his 8 years at the helm that the ACC has been as heavy as the SEC.

See also: ''Clemsoning". That was a term created to illustrate a talented team falling short of expectations.
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Clemson does not have nearly the same winning pedigree or fan expectations as a powerhouse SEC team. You cannot possibly compare what happened at Clemson to Tennessee. If Dabo were at a school like Tennessee he could have been competing for titles in year 2.

If that was confusing, my point was that it should be much much much easier to recruit and win at Tennessee than at Clemson. What Dabo did at Clemson is nothing short of astonishing. If he did that at Tennessee is would be considered just returning UT to its place among the top teams in the country and not as big a deal.
 
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#80
#80
'Boro-vol said:
Understood...thanks.

Posting opinions here can make one understandably paranoid.
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Haha, ya think?

The psychological aspect of this place is the most interesting to me. Although at times I find it frustrating.
 
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#82
#82
daj2576 said:
How long did it take Dabo at Clemson to win the national championship?

And let's not pretend in his 8 years at the helm that the ACC has been as heavy as the SEC.
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Why on earth are we comparing Butch Jones to one of the current elite coaches in CFB? He won his division year 1. Won the ACC year 3...at Clemson....not FL St, not Bammer, not FL, not OH St, not Michigan...not even TN....freakin Clemson. He's won 5 division titles, 3 conference titles, and a National Championship.

Butch is 2-2 against Vandy.
 
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#83
#83
daj2576 said:
How long did it take Dabo at Clemson to win the national championship?

And let's not pretend in his 8 years at the helm that the ACC has been as heavy as the SEC.

See also: ''Clemsoning". That was a term created to illustrate a talented team falling short of expectations.
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I don't judge Butch by National Championships. I never look for or expect that. Win the East when you are supposed to....baby steps...the rest will take care of itself if it's supposed to.

As far as Dabo is concerned, look at the teams he's now beaten. OSU, Oklahoma, Alabama, Florida State....We can go on. Butch hasn't beaten a West team in 4 years...not one.

My expectations are not unreasonable.
 
#84
#84
salutethehill said:
We're not having this conversation if Butch's first 3 years were...

Year 1: 9-5 - Win the Division
Year 2: 6-7
Year 3: 10-4 - Win the Conference

...like Dabo's ("everyone" thought he sucked) were.
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Dabo doesn't play Alabama every year, but if it makes you happy, keep on feeling negative about everything.
 
#85
#85
JCP201 said:
Dabo doesn't play Alabama every year, but if it makes you happy, keep on feeling negative about everything.
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I am...positive...that your post about everyone thinking Dabo sucked was fabricated in your head.

And no, he doesn't play Bammer every year, but if he did, he'd do a whole heck of a lot better than WE do.
 
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#86
#86
JCP201 said:
Dabo doesn't play Alabama every year, but if it makes you happy, keep on feeling negative about everything.
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You don't have to beat Alabama to win the East. This year you only had to beat a sub .500 Vandy or USC.

Nice strawman argument though.
 
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#88
#88
JCP201 said:
Dabo doesn't play Alabama every year, but if it makes you happy, keep on feeling negative about everything.
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Keep bringing up Alabama as if they are unstoppable. Ole Piss beat them Twice. OLE PISS! Tennessee has had ample opportunity to beat them in the past and ruin their season and for one reason or another failed. And every other team in the SEC is easily beatable with the right head coach. The SEC east is maybe the easiest division in all of football to win.

Alabama is not the reason we can't perform like Clemson. Butch Jones is the reason.
 
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#90
#90
MWAVolfan said:
Clemson does not have nearly the same winning pedigree or fan expectations as a powerhouse SEC team. You cannot possibly compare what happened at Clemson to Tennessee. If Dabo were at a school like Tennessee he could have been competing for titles in year 2.
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well...that's a stretch.

1. Clemson isn't a slouch of a program...take a closer look. Up and down years through their history (sound familiar?), and they've been pretty competitive since the Charlie Pell had a brief stint before going to UF.

Dos. Depends on where you stand/sit; if you aren't from SC, parts of NC and GA you may not realize many love the tigers, and their football.

d. Dabo took his lumps too, first HC gig so maybe he gets a pass, but it'd take more than 2 years for him to establish his program and get his players. Whose to say his entire staff would follow? They're as much a reason for his success as the man himself.
 
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#92
#92
MWAVolfan said:
Keep bringing up Alabama as if they are unstoppable. Ole Piss beat them Twice. OLE PISS! Tennessee has had ample opportunity to beat them in the past and ruin their season and for one reason or another failed. And every other team in the SEC is easily beatable with the right head coach. The SEC east is maybe the easiest division in all of football to win.

Alabama is not the reason we can't perform like Clemson. Butch Jones is the reason.
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You don't get that we are basically a West team playing in the East, and we have played every best team (except this year) in the West since Butch has been here and always the National Championship team.

This year was our chance, and we blew it, but we also had major injuries, beat Florida/Georgia and finished 9-4.

Like I said, you can be negative, I'm not.. I think ACC was an easier conference until this year. I also know Butch isn't getting fired with a winning record. Let's see how his changes work before we put him on the hot seat and cause another three year tail spin.
 
#93
#93
JC61 said:
well...that's a stretch.

1. Clemson isn't a slouch of a program...take a closer look. Up and down years through their history (sound familiar?), and they've been pretty competitive since the Charlie Pell had a brief stint before going to UF.

Dos. Depends on where you stand/sit; if you aren't from SC, parts of NC and GA you may not realize many love the tigers, and their football.

d. Dabo took his lumps too, first HC gig so maybe he gets a pass, but it'd take more than 2 years for him to establish his program and get his players. Whose to say his entire staff would follow? They're as much a reason for his success as the man himself.
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Clemson would not be considered the same caliber program as Tennessee (before the debacle of the last few years). If you asked anyone which school would it be easier to win and compete at I would be hard pressed to think anyone would say Clemson. Clemson isn't a bad program but they are not a top 10 program, and as UT is. They are closer to North Carolina football than to Tennessee football.
 
#95
#95
'Boro-vol said:
Not true at all. That narrative just holds absolutely no water. I keep hearing this line of thinking from the Pro-Butch faction and I just shake my head. We love the team, and long for leadership that we feel is worthy of the opportunity. That's all. Top 20-25, with this team, in this year, is underachievement. It was right there....and the opportunity was lost to a prima donna's trot and muddle finger to his team and a historic number of injuries. It's an achievement after the last 8-10, but an underachievement based upon my wishes for the season.
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Lol...fyp
 
#96
#96
JCP201 said:
You don't get that we are basically a West team playing in the East, and we have played every best team (except this year) in the West since Butch has been here and always the National Championship team.

This year was our chance, and we blew it, but we also had major injuries, beat Florida/Georgia and finished 9-4.

Like I said, you can be negative, I'm not.. I think ACC was an easier conference until this year. I also know Butch isn't getting fired with a winning record. Let's see how his changes work before we put him on the hot seat and cause another three year tail spin.
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First off I'm not negative. I'm real and truthful. Second it's a fallible argument to assume a "three year tail spin" due to hiring a new coach. Did Florida has a 3 year tail spin when it hired Spurrier? How about when they hired Meyers or McElwain? Hell, Muschamp was more successful than UT was. How was OSUs tailspin when they hired Meyers or Tressel? Oh yeah, no tailspin. What about the tailspin Michigan endured last year? Oh yeah.... Never mind.
 
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#98
#98
MWAVolfan said:
Tennessee has failed to beat any team from the west. Even the crappy ones. Alabama is not the reason we suck.
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ARkansas was the only "crappy" team from the west and they were hyped like we were this year. When we played Texas AM we were number 4 in he country, and we took them to OT at their house. The rest finished in the top five.
 
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#100
#100
Due respect to the Butchinistas in this thread but I seriously doubt anyone wouldn't be willing to make a Butch for Dabo trade right now whether you'd admit it or not.
 
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