'15 FL QB/WR/DB (anything he wants) Torrance Gibson

[Catbone]

Sigh

 

[Volosaurus rex]

I think with the running back stable we're building 30-35 is too many. I'd rather see 25-30 and more rushing attempts.

Butch and Co threw the ball a lot more at CM than at cincy, probably cause of Dan LeFevour being a beast. Their last two seasons they were in the 25-30 passes and 35-40 rushes range.

They also ran the ball more effectively from the quarterback position with Lefevour at the helm than they did at Cincinnati. I believe that the real take home message from a statistical analysis of pass/run ratios during Butch's tenure is that he prefers to use the quarterback as a ball carrier much more frequently than we saw during the first half of last year. On the other hand, Dobbs' numbers, if projected over the course of a full season, would have tallied roughly 500 yards, which is more than any Tennessee quarterback has rushed for in a single season since Jimmy Streater. Now, Butch may tweak the tendencies illustrated in the following data, given just how punishing SEC defense tend to be when given the opportunity to unload on quarterbacks, but consider these stats:

Cincinnati (2010-2012):
2012: Munchie Legaux 55-335 6.1 ave. 4 tds.
Brendon Kay 48-306 6.4 ave. 2 tds.
Total: 103-639 yds. 6 tds.

2011: Zach Collaros 84-234 2.8 ave. 8 tds.
Munchie Legaux 41-185 4.5 ave. 2 tds.
Total: 125-419 yds. 10 tds.

2010: Zach Collaros 121-202 1.7 ave. 4 tds.
Chazz Anderson 19-80 4.2 ave. 0 tds.
Total: 140-282 yds. 4 tds.

Central Michigan (2007-2009):
2009: Dan Lefevour 183-713 3.9 ave. 15 tds.

2008: Dan Lefevour 168-592 3.5 ave. 6 tds.

2007: Dan Lefevour 188-1122 6.0 ave. 19 tds. (Incidentally, Lefevour also passed for 3652 yds. and 27 tds. that year.).

Collectively, his starting quarterbacks at Cincinnati tallied 1340 yards rushing and 20 touchdowns; Lefevour rushed for 2427 yards and 40 tds at CMU. If his 2007 numbers had been achieved at a major college program, I dare say that he would have been in the Heisman Trophy race.

Perhaps these data illustrate why Gibson would be such a coveted weapon in Butch's arsenal. Gibson would enable him to truly stretch the field from sideline to sideline.

 

[VolSteve]

After reading the last 8-10 pages it seems I see a theme. LV and anyone else who posts an opinion that says they don't believe Gibson is the greatest thing to come along since toilet paper replaced corn cobs is attacked as if they were the worst imbecile in the land. Reminds me of how anyone who disagrees with Obama's policies must be a racist according to certain media outlets/pundits. The fact he has been downgraded from a 5* QB to a 4* athlete and the suspension from his HS team for a "pattern of behavior" should cause even the most loyal of the TG supporters reason to be a little cautious. Overlooking those issues and his lack of passing prowess and continuing to repeatedly post of how great he is while attacking those who have a different view is to me worse than anything LV has said.

 

[eazyTD]

After reading the last 8-10 pages it seems I see a theme. LV and anyone else who posts an opinion that says they don't believe Gibson is the greatest thing to come along since toilet paper replaced corn cobs is attacked as if they were the worst imbecile in the land. Reminds me of how anyone who disagrees with Obama's policies must be a racist according to certain media outlets/pundits. The fact he has been downgraded from a 5* QB to a 4* athlete and the suspension from his HS team for a "pattern of behavior" should cause even the most loyal of the TG supporters reason to be a little cautious. Overlooking those issues and his lack of passing prowess and continuing to repeatedly post of how great he is while attacking those who have a different view is to me worse than anything LV has said.

So we should be cautious of Gibson because now he has 4* rating as an ATH on Rivals?

Funny you mention star ratings when Jauan Jennings is also a 4* ATH and is easily a bigger project at QB than Gibson, yet LV is perfectly fine with Jennings and Charlie High 2.0 as our 2015 QBs LOL.

 

[Vols4us]

Perhaps these data illustrate why Gibson would be such a coveted weapon in Butch's arsenal. Gibson would enable him to truly stretch the field from sideline to sideline.

Well stated. It is a no lose situation to bring TG in as a QB if his personal conduct is cleaned up. The worst that happens is he clearly fails to get it done and shifts to receiver - where there is little doubt he can excel. I am tired of folks going with the draftable QB thing as the most important criteria. That stuff ain't bringing us wins.

I prefer pass first guys - but this is the college game and the dual threat guys can win big at it. TG is a special talent that can be molded into what they need IMO.

 

[Bruce Wayne]

After reading the last 8-10 pages it seems I see a theme. LV and anyone else who posts an opinion that says they don't believe Gibson is the greatest thing to come along since toilet paper replaced corn cobs is attacked as if they were the worst imbecile in the land. Reminds me of how anyone who disagrees with Obama's policies must be a racist according to certain media outlets/pundits. The fact he has been downgraded from a 5* QB to a 4* athlete and the suspension from his HS team for a "pattern of behavior" should cause even the most loyal of the TG supporters reason to be a little cautious. Overlooking those issues and his lack of passing prowess and continuing to repeatedly post of how great he is while attacking those who have a different view is to me worse than anything LV has said.

Since you quoted that can I get a link from his coach sayin that the reason for his suspension is a "pattern of behavior"?

 

[VolSteve]

So we should be cautious of Gibson because now he has 4* rating as an ATH on Rivals?

Funny you mention star ratings when Jauan Jennings is also a 4* ATH and is easily a bigger project at QB than Gibson, yet LV is perfectly fine with Jennings and Charlie High 2.0 as our 2015 QBs LOL.

Try not to twist my words... Thank you. I believe my comments were clearly a reflection that it is entirely reasonable not to see him as the best QB choice and to have an opinion that does not see him as such. I never mentioned Charlie High so your shots are off target. Try again.

 

[eazyTD]

Try not to twist my words... Thank you. I believe my comments were clearly a reflection that it is entirely reasonable not to see him as the best QB choice and to have an opinion that does not see him as such. I never mentioned Charlie High so your shots are off target. Try again.

Um, you're defending LV and he's stated over and over and over and over again that he wants Jennings and Charlie High Jr over Torrance Gibson. I'm not twisting anything.

And LOL at you for bringing Obama and race into a discussion in recruiting.

 

[eazyTD]

And before anyone gets the wrong idea about what I said about Jennings, I'll say that I think that kid is gonna be a great player for UT at whatever position he plays.

I'm just saying that anyone that sees Jennings as less of a QB project than Torrance Gibson is either biased or needs glasses.

 

[LebanonVolunteer]

So we should be cautious of Gibson because now he has 4* rating as an ATH on Rivals?

Funny you mention star ratings when Jauan Jennings is also a 4* ATH and is easily a bigger project at QB than Gibson, yet LV is perfectly fine with Jennings and Charlie High 2.0 as our 2015 QBs LOL.

I was never sold on TG being a good choice at QB long before his "issues" went public. Most on here know that. His * rating was never part of it for me. Yes, I am perfectly fine rolling with Jennings at QB for 2015 because he decided to pull the trigger 1st. I felt we should take 1 QB in 2015 even if it was a "project" type QB. Matt Williams as a walk-on of course would not bother me at all. I suppose if TG wants to walk on, I would be fine with that as well. He keeps it up and a walk-on spot may be all he is offered anywhere. JMO

 

[LebanonVolunteer]

And before anyone gets the wrong idea about what I said about Jennings, I'll say that I think that kid is gonna be a great player for UT at whatever position he plays.

I'm just saying that anyone that sees Jennings as less of a QB project than Torrance Gibson is either biased or needs glasses.

I have said multiple times I see Jennings and Gibson as very similar QBs today. Both would need ALOT of work to be ready to play at Tennessee in the next 2-3 years. Taking (2) QBs who may not actually end up playing QB is a huge risk and could affect future options at QB. When Jennings committed, for me it would have closed the door on Gibson. If that makes me "crazy", call in the white coats. lol:

Also "Charlie High 2.0" Matt Williams would be a walk-on now IMO. He would add depth and would not take a spot in an already small class. The real funny thing is I'd wager a pretty hefty sum that in a 7 on 7 event, Williams would not be moved to WR. TIFWIW.

 

[VolSteve]

Um, you're defending LV and he's stated over and over and over and over again that he wants Jennings and Charlie High Jr over Torrance Gibson.

Try again. I am defending his (LV's) right to have an opinion different from yours and others who think no one has a right to disagree that TG is the greatest QB on the board.

 

[LebanonVolunteer]

Since you quoted that can I get a link from his coach sayin that the reason for his suspension is a "pattern of behavior"?

It has been mentioned several times he has been suspended from the "team" more than once now. It was also posted his teammates don't care for him. They may not want him back from the sound of it. Add to that the school suspension and him may needing to look for another school and IF the reports are accurate, IMO an argument for "pattern of behavior" has been pretty well established.

 

[LebanonVolunteer]

Try again. I am defending his (LV's) right to have an opinion different from yours and others who think no one has a right to disagree that TG is the greatest QB on the board.

I tried to be reasonable and mention that IF Jaylond Woods does not get his grades in order that TG could be our #2 WR in 2015. :dunno:


Of course that would mean passing on McCleskey and I'm not sure I like that idea now that I am pondering it. :zeitung_lesen:

 

[Vols4us]

And before anyone gets the wrong idea about what I said about Jennings, I'll say that I think that kid is gonna be a great player for UT at whatever position he plays.

I'm just saying that anyone that sees Jennings as less of a QB project than Torrance Gibson is either biased or needs glasses.

Based on the highlights I have watched - I agree. I also believe Jennings is a high quality, talented player that can be molded as well. But he is not playing QB to the level of TG at this point per the highlights.

As to take or no take - this one is where I depart from LV's approach. I believe you take multiple highly talented guys that you believe can be developed into quality QB's each and every year. At least 2 per year until you have a stable full and they start transferring out or switching to receiver. That is not the case at UT currently and it has been a huge sore spot for years. No competent QB stable gave us Tyler Bray. Bray in no way shape or form was a quality SEC QB. But he was the best we had on the field if not as a leader. And we got the worst period of UT football ever when combined with bad D.

I never want to see anything like that again. If you want playmakers to come you better have the QB picture addressed with ample talent.

 

[Bruce Wayne]

It has been mentioned several times he has been suspended from the "team" more than once now. It was also posted his teammates don't care for him. They may not want him back from the sound of it. Add to that the school suspension and him may needing to look for another school and IF the reports are accurate, IMO an argument for "pattern of behavior" has been pretty well established.

I'm aware of what's been reported but he acted as if that were a direct quote. Also I'd like more evidence that his teammates don't care for him or want him back. I'm seeing a lot of forum rumors and not a lot of quotes from the football or school staff. I'd like to get a link to actual sites as we've all seen many times the "reporters" at 247 and rivals often mishandle stories in a rush to be first rather than gather and check their facts first.

People have jumped to a lot of conclusions about this kid and these situations when we haven't really had any details released or detailedstatements from the coaching staff or administration that I've seen. If I've missed them, I'd love to read them.

 

[LebanonVolunteer]

I'm aware of what's been reported but he acted as if that were a direct quote. Also I'd like more evidence that his teammates don't care for him or want him back. I'm seeing a lot of forum rumors and not a lot of quotes from the football or school staff. I'd like to get a link to actual sites as we've all seen many times the "reporters" at 247 and rivals often mishandle stories in a rush to be first rather than gather and check their facts first.

People have jumped to a lot of conclusions about this kid and these situations when we haven't really had any details released or detailedstatements from the coaching staff or administration that I've seen. If I've missed them, I'd love to read them.

I'd imagine you won't get much direct info from the coaches as they may not want to throw the kid under the bus. Also doing so then taking him back at some point could be an issue. The fact he was actually removed from the team and school obviously says there is/was a pretty major issue. I suppose it eventually comes down to does the kid meet the criteria CBJ says he has for recruiting "high character" kids. I would think that would be especially true for the QB as he is the leader of your team.

 

[Bruce Wayne]

I'd imagine you won't get much direct info from the coaches as they may not want to throw the kid under the bus. Also doing so then taking him back at some point could be an issue. The fact he was actually removed from the team and school obviously says there is/was a pretty major issue. I suppose it eventually comes down to does the kid meet the criteria CBJ says he has for recruiting "high character" kids. I would think that would be especially true for the QB as he is the leader of your team.

We had a kid get suspended from the team and school for throwing gum in someone's hair in high school.. Not exactly a felony, it's also spring so a suspension from the team isn't the biggest issue, that's why I am waiting before I crucify the kid... If details get out and it's something awful then fine pass on the kid, but I find it annoying that people are dismissing this kid and his character without details.

 

[eazyTD]

Try again. I am defending his (LV's) right to have an opinion different from yours and others who think no one has a right to disagree that TG is the greatest QB on the board.

Well TG is the #1 QB on UT's board, that should be obvious to everyone even cynics like you and LV.

Tennessee– “They didn’t take a quarterback this year, and talking to coach (Butch) Jones, he told me the reason they didn’t take one is because I’m his quarterback and he wanted to only take me. I’m his guy, his quarterback. He wants me to be his No. 1 guy.”

That's a quote from Gibson about 2 months ago. Since you're so sure he's not the #1, would you care to share any quotes from Gentry, Francois or Jones saying that Butch has told them that they are his #1 QB? opcorn:

 

[VolSteve]

I'd imagine you won't get much direct info from the coaches as they may not want to throw the kid under the bus. Also doing so then taking him back at some point could be an issue. The fact he was actually removed from the team and school obviously says there is/was a pretty major issue. I suppose it eventually comes down to does the kid meet the criteria CBJ says he has for recruiting "high character" kids. I would think that would be especially true for the QB as he is the leader of your team.

Exactly. Also there are legal restrictions on making public comments on school discipline. Sometimes you have to make assumptions based on evidence available. Kicked off the team and maybe the school is pretty strong evidence of something that is seriously wrong.

 

[unioncityvol]

If it were up to LV we'd have taken Caleb Kinlaw last spring/summer and stopped recruiting D. Scott. This year he wants us to turn down T. Gibson in hopes some guy named Williams walks on.

He doesn't get it.

Bruin Light?

 

[Bruce Wayne]

Exactly. Also there are legal restrictions on making public comments on school discipline. Sometimes you have to make assumptions based on evidence available. Kicked off the team and maybe the school is pretty strong evidence of something that is seriously wrong.

Kicked off the team?? Link that one. Suspensions and being kicked off are two different things.

 

[LebanonVolunteer]

Well TG is the #1 QB on UT's board, that should be obvious to everyone even cynics like you and LV.

Tennessee– “They didn’t take a quarterback this year, and talking to coach (Butch) Jones, he told me the reason they didn’t take one is because I’m his quarterback and he wanted to only take me. I’m his guy, his quarterback. He wants me to be his No. 1 guy.”

That's a quote from Gibson about 2 months ago. Since you're so sure he's not the #1, would you care to share any quotes from Gentry, Francois or Jones saying that Butch has told them that they are his #1 QB? opcorn:

I may have missed something but how is TG "CBJ's QB and he only wanted to take me", yet Jennings is already committed and onboard at QB? I suppose we could ignore that and roll with TG's quotes as the gospel.

 

[LebanonVolunteer]

Bruin Light?

Bruin's a good guy and brought a lot to the board. Hopefully at some point he returns.

 

[NashVOL93]

Never in a million years thought I would say this, but I actually would be interested to see what Bruin thinks about all of this and about LV's numbers crusade.