'11 FL DE/TE Aaron Lynch

#102
#102
Bassmanbruno said:
It's an engineering failure - dumb to believe it was Kelley's fault - unless there is somewhere on the tower that says do not use "insert random wind speed here". Even then - that falls more on ND administration and less on the coaching staff.
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WOW. You see a kid up on a scissor lift with 50 miles an hour winds. The first thing that comes to mind is that thing is going over. If Kelly saw it and did nothing about it he should be 100% ashamed of himself as a human being. Don't have to be a doctor to know when to take an aspirin, don't have to be an engineer to know when something looks like it going to blow over. :crazy:
 
#105
#105
gwgvol said:
WOW. You see a kid up on a scissor lift with 50 miles an hour winds. The first thing that comes to mind is that thing is going over. If Kelly saw it and did nothing about it he should be 100% ashamed of himself as a human being. Don't have to be a doctor to know when to take an aspirin, don't have to be an engineer to know when something looks like it going to blow over. :crazy:
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yeah I guess that's why the University claimed responsibility today in a statement -:crazy:.

It is not the responsibility of a football staff - that is paid to coach football. There are people in paid positions at the university that are responsible for these type of things and civil engineers that are paid to design things that won't fail.

You have no details or knowledge on the situation - you don't know how visible the lift was from where the coaches were standing - anyone one person could have told him to get off - he should've been the one to realize himself that he should have gotten off - he was definitely feeling the worst of the winds up that high and I'm sure he felt it swaying. Any one person nearby could be held responsible with that logic - because I guarantee Chip Kelley and his coaching staff weren't the only ones close to the guy.

You're insane if you think Kelley or anyone actually directly on the staff came up to the kid and told him to film practice. That goes back to administration and managers/etc - it's the university's fault - not the AD or football coaches.
 
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#106
#106
Bassmanbruno said:
yeah I guess that's why the University claimed responsibility today in a statement -:crazy:.

It is not the responsibility of a football staff - that is paid to coach football. There are people in paid positions at the university that are responsible for these type of things and civil engineers that are paid to design things that won't fail.

You're insane if you think Kelley or anyone actually directly on the staff came up to the kid and told him to film practice. That goes back to administration - when is the university's fault - not the AD or football coaches.
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When you're the head of an organization, and something goes wrong, it's your fault. I would be shocked to learn that the kid that died, or someone within the organization that Kelley heads, didn't feel obligated to get that kid on the tower for Kelley. Even if Kelley didn't order the kid on the tower, he should have had the foresight to hire someone with a little bit of common sense to determine when it is and when it is not safe to have college kids on structurally unsound towers filming practice.
 
#107
#107
cardwell said:
When you're the head of an organization, and something goes wrong, it's your fault. I would be shocked to learn that the kid that died, or someone within the organization that Kelley heads, didn't feel obligated to get that kid on the tower for Kelley. Even if Kelley didn't order the kid on the tower, he should have had the foresight to hire someone with a little bit of common sense to determine when it is and when it is not safe to have college kids on structurally unsound towers filming practice.
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Really? hire someone that monitors when it's safe to get on a structure? hahah.

Once again - I see your point - put that is not under the head coach's responsibility. The university has so many worthless employees and managers and administration walking around that likely instructed this kid to tape practice. It falls on them.

Brian Kelley doesn't have to tell someone that they need someone to tape practice - this is a major Div. 1 team we are talking about. It's common sense. They have that set in place BEFORE Kelley was even hired on. He would have nothing to do with it. And that's why the President took responsibility.
 
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#108
#108
Bassmanbruno said:
yeah I guess that's why the University claimed responsibility today in a statement -:crazy:.

It is not the responsibility of a football staff - that is paid to coach football. There are people in paid positions at the university that are responsible for these type of things and civil engineers that are paid to design things that won't fail.

You have no details or knowledge on the situation - you don't know how visible the lift was from where the coaches were standing - anyone one person could have told him to get off - he should've been the one to realize himself that he should have gotten off - he was definitely feeling the worst of the winds up that high and I'm sure he felt it swaying. Any one person nearby could be held responsible with that logic - because I guarantee Chip Kelley and his coaching staff weren't the only ones close to the guy.

You're insane if you think Kelley or anyone actually directly on the staff came up to the kid and told him to film practice. That goes back to administration and managers/etc - it's the university's fault - not the AD or football coaches.
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An engineering failure? Seriously? That type of lift is not meant to be used in 50 mph winds. Period.
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#109
#109
holdemvol said:
An engineering failure? Seriously? That type of lift is not meant to be used in 50 mph winds. Period.
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That's why I said engineering failure or systematic/logistic issue - seriously?

There obviously should have been some warning or restrictions on use of the lift - that were likely ignored.
 
#110
#110
Bassmanbruno said:
Really? hire someone that monitors when it's safe to get on a structure? hahah.

Once again - I see your point - put that is not under the head coach's responsibility. The university has so many worthless employees and managers and administration walking around that likely instructed this kid to tape practice. It falls on them.

Chip Kelley doesn't have to tell someone that they need someone to tape practice - this is a major Div. 1 team we are talking about. It's common sense. They have that set in place BEFORE Kelley was even hired on. He would have nothing to do with it. And that's why the President took responsibility.
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So you think that ND football practices are filmed from angles and positions set by the administration rather than the head coach? My best guess is that most D1 head coaches are Type-A control freaks that dictate what is filmed, where it is filed from, and how it is filmed.
 
#111
#111
cardwell said:
So you think that ND football practices are filmed from angles and positions set by the administration rather than the head coach? My best guess is that most D1 head coaches are Type-A control freaks that dictate what is filmed, where it is filed from, and how it is filmed.
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Now you're just reaching there. Even if that were the case - this kid has likely had this job for awhile and someone came before him - and someone came before him - and I guarantee the coaching staffs didn't appoint these kids to do this. Like I said - this is a big D1 football program we're talking about - they have people on staff to wipe every coach and players ass after he takes a dump. They don't mess with these smaller details.
 
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#112
#112
Bassmanbruno said:
Now you're just reaching there. Even if that were the case - this kid has likely had this job for awhile and someone came before him - and someone came before him - and I guarantee the coaching staffs didn't appoint these kids to do this. Like I said - this is a big D1 football program we're talking about - they have people on staff to wipe every coach and players ass after he takes a dump. They don't mess with these smaller details.
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Ok - then who on the staff was responsible for determining whether 21 year old kids should climb up ghetto towers in 50 mph winds. And to whom does that staff person report?
 
#114
#114
cardwell said:
Ok - then who on the staff was responsible for determining whether 21 year old kids should climb up ghetto towers in 50 mph winds. And to whom does that staff person report?
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Probably some random manager/logistics/systematics guy or volunteer who would cream his pants to get the opportunity to be associated with the football team (likely similar to the kid who agreed to tape practices). I don't have the details obviously.

But it is clearly far-fetched to believe Kelley has to baby sit 85 scholarship players + walk ons + coaching staff + random managers/ball boys/water boys/photographers/video guys/logistic and systematic guys/etc/etc list goes on and on. People are hired within the AD or university to do these chores so the coaches can actually have the time to do their real job they are paid to do.

I'm not sure this is worth arguing though - the President already came out and claimed responsibility and didn't fault Kelley. Whoever the kid reports to is likely closer to the president of the university than Brian Kelley to be honest. Brian Kelley probably had never even spoken to or even noticed the kid before.
 
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#115
#115
Like I said before, it is, ultimately, the Head Football coach's call and responsibility.

Here's what a responsible Coach, Jim Tressel of the Ohio State Buckeyes said, prior to the same Wind Storm that took the life of the Kid from Notre Dame

“I don’t know if we’ll be inside or out,” Tressel told Ohio reporters 24 hours before the Notre Dame tragedy. “It looks a little nasty. I worry about our cameramen, their well-being up there 50 feet in the air.”

and he proceeded to practice inside.
 
#116
#116
lylsmorr said:
yes it is. Kelly wanted the practice filmed and insisted on practice being outside.
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No - sorry - it isn't his responsibility and it's ignorant to think that. Should he feel guilty? Sure - I probably would - but he can't be in charge of everything.
 
#117
#117
Bassmanbruno said:
No - sorry - it isn't his responsibility and it's ignorant to think that. Should he feel guilty? Sure - I probably would - but he can't be in charge of everything.
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It's not ignorant and the more you say it doesn't make you more right. He ultimately made the decision of the kid going up in that lift to film it. Accept it.
 
#118
#118
I4Jay said:
Like I said before, it is, ultimately, the Head Football coach's call and responsibility.

Here's what a responsible Coach, Jim Tressel of the Ohio State Buckeyes said, prior to the same Wind Storm that took the life of the Kid from Notre Dame

“I don’t know if we’ll be inside or out,” Tressel told Ohio reporters 24 hours before the Notre Dame tragedy. “It looks a little nasty. I worry about our cameramen, their well-being up there 50 feet in the air.”

and he proceeded to practice inside.
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And boom. End of discussion.
 
#119
#119
lylsmorr said:
It's not ignorant and the more you say it doesn't make you more right. He ultimately made the decision of the kid going up in that lift to film it. Accept it.
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That's so dumb. Listen to what you're saying. The kid didn't have to go onto the lift. The kid works for someone other than Brian Kelley - and him and whoever he reports to should've had the common sense not to get up there - or find somewhere safer to film from.

I'm sure the first thing Brian Kelley is thinking of is where we should put the camera guy just in case the wind is a factor. He has the right to practice outside in bad conditions if he wants to and feels it will better prepare his team.

Kelley doesn't have the time to deal with all the logistics. Once again - this is a major Div. 1 football program. THEY HAVE PEOPLE TO DO THESE THINGS AND THEY ARE IN PAID POSITIONS so that the coaches can do their jobs effectively. Whoever was in charge of the camera guy - should have made sure he was on something that was safe to film on - rather than a lift that isn't being used how it's intended to be used.
 
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#120
#120
Bassmanbruno said:
Probably some random manager/logistics/systematics guy or volunteer who would cream his pants to get the opportunity to be associated with the football team (likely similar to the kid who agreed to tape practices). I don't have the details obviously.

But it is clearly far-fetched to believe Kelley has to baby sit 85 scholarship players + walk ons + coaching staff + random managers/ball boys/water boys/photographers/video guys/logistic and systematic guys/etc/etc list goes on and on. People are hired within the AD or university to do these chores so the coaches can actually have the time to do their real job they are paid to do.

I'm not sure this is worth arguing though - the President already came out and claimed responsibility and didn't fault Kelley. Whoever the kid reports to is likely closer to the president of the university than Chip Kelley to be honest. Chip Kelley probably had never even spoken to or even noticed the kid before.
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First of all Chip doesn't coach ND, Brian does. Secondly, if you think the kid reported to someone closer to the president than the head coach you really don't have a clue. Dude was part of the FOOTBALL programs film department.
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#122
#122
holdemvol said:
First of all Chip doesn't coach ND, Brian does. Secondly, if you think the kid reported to someone closer to the president than the head coach you really don't have a clue. Dude was part of the FOOTBALL programs film department.
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That was clearly sarcasm - but it's hard to make that too clear on a message board without writing it was sarcasm. Point is - he isn't closely associated with either - and it's not the HC's responsibility or even close to it. He should have never been allowed to tape practice from a lift in the first place - bad weather or good weather - and that falls on the university - not the staff - I highly doubt the coaching staff went and picked out that lift for him to film from.
 
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#123
#123
some of you are wackos.

anyway, the ND president issued a statement today saying BK would not be fired and will lead the football program in the future.

that is all.
 
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