Missing Malaysia Airlines Jet

#976
#976
Grand Vol said:
That is a pretty scary scenario. Not even a low yield nuke, but a dirty bomb over a major populated area?
Click to expand...

How big is a dirty bomb? Is it so big as to require a 777 for transport rather than using a much, much smaller private aircraft? Just curious...
 
#979
#979
I think a Boeing 777 could mix in nicely with other commercial airlines. Just paint a Fedex or UPS or DHL logo on the side, file a flight plan and you're good to go.
 
#981
#981
InVOLuntary said:
I think a Boeing 777 could mix in nicely with other commercial airlines. Just paint a Fedex or UPS or DHL logo on the side, file a flight plan and you're good to go.
Click to expand...

Would you have to hack the transponders so they don't broadcast the correct ID?
 
#982
#982
Danl said:
Would you have to hack the transponders so they don't broadcast the correct ID?
Click to expand...

Until its found...If you are on a 777 and there is a problem with the iff, assume the crash position and kiss it goodbye.
 
Last edited:
#983
#983
InVOLuntary said:
I think a Boeing 777 could mix in nicely with other commercial airlines. Just paint a Fedex or UPS or DHL logo on the side, file a flight plan and you're good to go.
Click to expand...

When you're not broadcasting signals they'll find out in a hurry somethings up.
 
#985
#985
coug said:
About as quickly as the action they took with this flight right?
Click to expand...

You don't think the authorities would react quickly when an unannounced 777 flies into say American, British, or Israeli airspace? Come on.
 
#986
#986
Danl said:
How big is a dirty bomb? Is it so big as to require a 777 for transport rather than using a much, much smaller private aircraft? Just curious...
Click to expand...

It could be loaded into a smaller aircraft yes. Just thinking of worst case scenarios here.

Size isn't as big a deal with a dirty bomb. Rather how far the radioactive material is spread out.
 
#987
#987
coug said:
About as quickly as the action they took with this flight right?
Click to expand...

They were slow to action with this flight due to where it happenned in the world. I honestly don't believe you would have seen this level of incompetence in North America, most of Europe, or Russia. China has this belief that they are untouchable, so it's easy to see their ego allowing for this incompetence to happen, but I'm betting some heads have rolled and it won't be happenning again. The fact that there is now a known missing 777 out there is going to have every major country on guard, looking for a possible terror attack. There is no advantage of surprise, which is what would be needed to hit a major target. A major target in this case being a well populated city in a country considered a world power. They could possibly pull it off against a lesser developed nation, but if you're hijacking a plane to turn it into a weapon, you would want to hit a major target.

Again, I think it most likely this plane is in the ocean. But looking at it strategically, you cannot rule out the hijacking/use it as a weapon scenario until wreckage is found. The sad thing is, in either scenario, the passengers are most likely dead.
 
#988
#988
Burhead said:
You don't think the authorities would react quickly when an unannounced 777 flies into say American, British, or Israeli airspace? Come on.
Click to expand...

I would like to think so but given this incident it should at the very least make you think twice about it all.

Grand Vol said:
It could be loaded into a smaller aircraft yes. Just thinking of worst case scenarios here.

Size isn't as big a deal with a dirty bomb. Rather how far the radioactive material is spread out.
Click to expand...

True, size isn't as big of a deal with a dirty bomb and the advantages to having a plane like this with it's size, technology, fuel capacity, etc. you basically eliminate a country's lack of intercontinental ballistic capabilites. To add to that the most devastating thought is not to necessarily fly it into a specific point but to simply explode the plane over a very populated area. That would be far worse.

Weezer said:
They were slow to action with this flight due to where it happenned in the world. I honestly don't believe you would have seen this level of incompetence in North America, most of Europe, or Russia. China has this belief that they are untouchable, so it's easy to see their ego allowing for this incompetence to happen, but I'm betting some heads have rolled and it won't be happenning again. The fact that there is now a known missing 777 out there is going to have every major country on guard, looking for a possible terror attack. There is no advantage of surprise, which is what would be needed to hit a major target. A major target in this case being a well populated city in a country considered a world power. They could possibly pull it off against a lesser developed nation, but if you're hijacking a plane to turn it into a weapon, you would want to hit a major target.

Again, I think it most likely this plane is in the ocean. But looking at it strategically, you cannot rule out the hijacking/use it as a weapon scenario until wreckage is found. The sad thing is, in either scenario, the passengers are most likely dead.
Click to expand...

How can you still agree with the idea that the plane crashed in the ocean given all the evidence that's been gathered over the past 9 days though?
 
#989
#989
coug said:
How can you still agree with the idea that the plane crashed in the ocean given all the evidence that's been gathered over the past 9 days though?
Click to expand...

I think it most likely because to me it still remains the easiest scenario to explain its total disappearance.

A 777 is a large plane. It would need a large airstrip to land on. It would most likely have to be remote to guarantee its secrecy. A 777 is a plane that locals not in on any plot would notice. Once on the ground, you'd have to have a large hangar or a very good camoflouge to hide it from aerial view, and I'm guessing several nations, ourselves included, have directed some of our spy satellites into searching for this plane. Based on criteria, they can limit their search to certain land masses and areas, which would make looking for it much easier.

If the plane came down in the ocean, well, the ocean is vast and finding even a large 777 would be like finding a needle in a haystack.

I think evidence certainly supports(at this time) something sinister was afoot, but I'm guessing the pilots or hijackers ran out of options and eventually fuel, and the plane came down in the ocean. For all we know, this could have been a test run for a future op and the plan all along was for the plane to crash, killing all on board. It might have been a way for a terror cell to obtain intel for something more sinister to come. I don't really know. I just think it would be incredibly hard to hide an intact 777 on land.

I could be wrong though. Maybe some more familiar with the plane can elaborate.
 
#990
#990
Weezer said:
I think it most likely because to me it still remains the easiest scenario to explain its total disappearance.

A 777 is a large plane. It would need a large airstrip to land on. It would most likely have to be remote to guarantee its secrecy. A 777 is a plane that locals not in on any plot would notice. Once on the ground, you'd have to have a large hangar or a very good camoflouge to hide it from aerial view, and I'm guessing several nations, ourselves included, have directed some of our spy satellites into searching for this plane. Based on criteria, they can limit their search to certain land masses and areas, which would make looking for it much easier.

If the plane came down in the ocean, well, the ocean is vast and finding even a large 777 would be like finding a needle in a haystack.

I think evidence certainly supports(at this time) something sinister was afoot, but I'm guessing the pilots or hijackers ran out of options and eventually fuel, and the plane came down in the ocean. For all we know, this could have been a test run for a future op and the plan all along was for the plane to crash, killing all on board. It might have been a way for a terror cell to obtain intel for something more sinister to come. I don't really know. I just think it would be incredibly hard to hide an intact 777 on land.

I could be wrong though. Maybe some more familiar with the plane can elaborate.
Click to expand...

So for now you're sticking with Occam's Razor.

I don't think it's as hard as people are making it out to be to hide a plane like this, especially given preperation and planning. I think we trick ourselves into thinking that because this is 2014 and we're fairly technologically advanced with our satellites, radars, GPS, cell phones, and cameras that we assume every square foot of the planet is under surveillance all the time. Where In fact nothing could be further from the truth. The world is a big place after all.
 
  • Like
Reactions: 1 person
#991
#991
Danl said:
Would you have to hack the transponders so they don't broadcast the correct ID?
Click to expand...

No. You just turn it off. You can input your own code as well. In America though that draws alarms. Aircraft are assigned a transponder code by a computer called HOST for each flight plan they file (if not IFR aircraft). If another plane has the same code and are in the same air space alarms will sound. I have seen it before where a small airplane didnt change it's transponder code and we had conflicting alerts on our radar scopes.
 
#992
#992
99.9% chance this plane is sitting in Davy Jones locker right now.

I've seen mention that the plane took "evasive maneuvers". I also see speculation that it could have flown for X amount of hours. I believe that assumption is on a normal fuel burn at cruising speeds. If they were jerking the plane around as the radar data shows continuously that puppy never made it to land.
 
#993
#993
Danl said:
Would you have to hack the transponders so they don't broadcast the correct ID?
Click to expand...

I'm not sure on a large commercial plane but on small planes the transponders don't transmit a unique identifier for that particular plane. ATC tells you what to sqwak, you change the transponder code manually and then you are able to be identified by ATC. Large commercial planes my be different.
 
#994
#994
FLVOL_79 said:
99.9% chance this plane is sitting in Davy Jones locker right now.

I've seen mention that the plane took "evasive maneuvers". I also see speculation that it could have flown for X amount of hours. I believe that assumption is on a normal fuel burn at cruising speeds. If they were jerking the plane around as the radar data shows continuously that puppy never made it to land.
Click to expand...
But why did they take it to 45,000 feet? Wouldn't that kill everyone on board not using oxygen within just a minute or so? This seems too well thought out for it not to have made it to land.
 
#996
#996
davethevol said:
But why did they take it to 45,000 feet? Wouldn't that kill everyone on board not using oxygen within just a minute or so? This seems too well thought out for it not to have made it to land.
Click to expand...

I am pretty sure with cabin pressurization the planes can fly at 45,000 feet. If the pressure was too low I can see people passing out. If they flew like that for a while it would kill people. I flew on a helicopter at about 10,000 feet with zero pressurization and I remember slowly fading out of consciousness when I stayed off the oxygen for a while.
 
#997
#997
FLVOL_79 said:
I am pretty sure with cabin pressurization the planes can fly at 45,000 feet. If the pressure was too low I can see people passing out. If they flew like that for a while it would kill people. I flew on a helicopter at about 10,000 feet with zero pressurization and I remember slowly fading out of consciousness when I stayed off the oxygen for a while.
Click to expand...

One of the news shows said that the ceiling for the 777 was lower than 45000 feet. One theory I saw floated around was they took it to 45000 for a few min to kill the passengers. The crew would wear the supplemental oxygen.

Another expert said the radar data they are using to form the altitude changes was not accurate.
 
#999
#999
davethevol said:
But why did they take it to 45,000 feet? Wouldn't that kill everyone on board not using oxygen within just a minute or so? This seems too well thought out for it not to have made it to land.
Click to expand...

It wouldn't kill the pax, some business jets have a service ceiling of >50k ft. Remember that the plane is pressurized, they are not breathing atmospheric oxygen. If that were the case they'd be dead at >~26k feet without acclimatization.

I would imagine the commercial jet would be difficult to fly at >40k ft due to the air density though.
 
New posts
You must log in or register to reply here.
Advertisement





Back
Top