Martin really isn't that bad

#126
#126
whocaresgobobcats said:
yeah, good coaches have those bad games every now and then.


Zo has good games every now and then. I guarantee he has been out-coached more times than not at UT


and no one has really ever said Pearl is a great x and o coach.
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How does he having a winning record, but has been out coached more times than not? Doesn't make sense.
 
#127
#127
Stoked4Zo said:
How does he having a winning record, but has been out coached more times than not? Doesn't make sense.
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There is a difference between being outcoached, but not outperformed.

Hence why being a good X-O's coach isn't part of the entire coaching package. Your ultimate goal is to get your kids to perform at a high enough level to win.
 
#129
#129
Nice try OP but your pushing a little.

First, Coach K was fixing to lose his job at Duke. They were already established before his arrival and the only thing that likely saved his job was beating Jordan and the Tar Holes in the ACC Tournament (previously being swept during the regular season).

Next, Calhoun coached at NorthEastern not Northwestern. He went to the tournament 4 times (auto bids) coached a first round draft pick and is the winningest coach in the history of that program. Then at UCONN, he took a team that went 9-19 to 20-14. Calhoun, being a preivous high school coach at a school where it didn't matter as much, would not be held to the same standards.

College sports is a bigger deal now than it was then with tv contracts and the big money. Not the same.
 
#130
#130
Also, I'd like to point out that any realistic fan wouldn't be calling for Martin's head until this season. 3 seasons, with this class, is plenty of time to take a step back and see what direction your program is going in. If Martin doesn't make the tournament this year, he doesn't deserve his job. Massive injuries to several key players is the only thing that should give him another chance if he misses the tournament.
 
#131
#131
Shaun1985 said:
Also, I'd like to point out that any realistic fan wouldn't be calling for Martin's head until this season. 3 seasons, with this class, is plenty of time to take a step back and see what direction your program is going in. If Martin doesn't make the tournament this year, he doesn't deserve his job. Massive injuries to several key players is the only thing that should give him another chance if he misses the tournament.
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Respectfully, from a school who got rid of a good coach in the hopes of having a great one, "Pump the brakes Cowboy." UT plays good basketball, and seems to be improving. All those victories over Billy Donovan have to count for something.
 
#132
#132
SEC-GoalTenda said:
Respectfully, from a school who got rid of a good coach in the hopes of having a great one, "Pump the brakes Cowboy." UT plays good basketball, and seems to be improving. All those victories over Billy Donovan have to count for something.
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Who are u talking about?
 
#133
#133
Shaun1985 said:
Nice try OP but your pushing a little.

First, Coach K was fixing to lose his job at Duke. They were already established before his arrival and the only thing that likely saved his job was beating Jordan and the Tar Holes in the ACC Tournament (previously being swept during the regular season).
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I might be pushing it, but your argument is invalid. My point was that these coaches were mediocre in their beginning tenure at these schools, they developed into better coaches through experience. Duke I wouldn't say was a powerhouse; until Coach K arrived Duke had only been an NCAA runner-up twice, no national championship teams, and were sporadically doing well in the NCAA tournament. It wasn't until Coach K arrived that he put Duke on the powerhouse map.

If Coach K was fixing to lose his job, he obviously turned the program around to a tip-top tournament team within 5 years of being there.


Shaun1985 said:
Next, Calhoun coached at NorthEastern not Northwestern. He went to the tournament 4 times (auto bids) coached a first round draft pick and is the winningest coach in the history of that program. Then at UCONN, he took a team that went 9-19 to 20-14. Calhoun, being a preivous high school coach at a school where it didn't matter as much, would not be held to the same standards.
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Good call on NE and not NW, misread that. It took Jim Calhoun eight years to reach his first NCAA tournament appearance at Northeastern and never made it past the second round. At Connecticut, it took him 3 years to make his first tournament appearance. I guess you can argue to argue, but it's hard to deny that it took time to develop into these powerhouse coaches.

Calhoun coached his first team that went 9-19 and the second year they went 20-14. Kind of like how Martin coached up his guys his first year here?
 
#134
#134
iKrager said:
I might be pushing it, but your argument is invalid. My point was that these coaches were mediocre in their beginning tenure at these schools, they developed into better coaches through experience. Duke I wouldn't say was a powerhouse; until Coach K arrived Duke had only been an NCAA runner-up twice, no national championship teams, and were sporadically doing well in the NCAA tournament. It wasn't until Coach K arrived that he put Duke on the powerhouse map.

If Coach K was fixing to lose his job, he obviously turned the program around to a tip-top tournament team within 5 years of being there.



Good call on NE and not NW, misread that. It took Jim Calhoun eight years to reach his first NCAA tournament appearance at Northeastern and never made it past the second round. At Connecticut, it took him 3 years to make his first tournament appearance. I guess you can argue to argue, but it's hard to deny that it took time to develop into these powerhouse coaches.

Calhoun coached his first team that went 9-19 and the second year they went 20-14. Kind of like how Martin coached up his guys his first year here?
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Powerhouse was a poor choice of words on my part but I would say Duke was way more of an established program than Tennessee. They were already a 1,000 win program by then, final fours, conference titles and several good players. Clearly, K has made the program a powerhouse but they were still solid before him. As for him "about" to lose his job, I read an article about two months ago that talked about Duke before Coach K. If I could find it, I'd share it. Basically, it talked about how Foster was just a couple of years out from the NCAA Championship game to jump ship to South Carolina. Basically, the guy turned the program around to be pretty decent and then Coach K came in and laid an egg. He was getting smoked by UNC every year and ive I'm not mistaken, he posted a losing ACC record his first two years and broke even the third year. They talked about how beating a North Carolina team in the tournament that was led by Jordan put a lot of faith in the boosters and fans and then of course his success picked up.

As for Calhoun, he came into the Northeastern program as a highschool coach. They had little or no expectations and he made them pretty decent. Obviously he's a HOF coach and I understand the comparisons but I don't think any of those situations are even close to Martin's.
 
#135
#135
I'd say Coach K's is closer to Martin's situation and if those reports are true about K than 3 years is perfect. Do you think he deserves to lose his job if he doesn't make the tournament this season with that roster? Three years, IMO, is plenty of time at any program unless they were leveled by NCAA violations.
 
#136
#136
Shaun1985 said:
I'd say Coach K's is closer to Martin's situation and if those reports are true about K than 3 years is perfect. Do you think he deserves to lose his job if he doesn't make the tournament this season with that roster? Three years, IMO, is plenty of time at any program unless they were leveled by NCAA violations.
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Oh if Martin doesn't make it this year, he should be gone. No reason to not make it with this year's roster and avoiding injuries. No reason at all.
 
#140
#140
Spartacavolus said:
It won't die. One of two people will make a thread immediately depending if the next game is won walking it up/halfcourt motion offense or pushing pace/attacking early.
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Yeah I know and it'll probably come from people yelling it was just one game after the loss, even though the win will be just one game. Funny how that works.

Edit: that was directed at if we win walking it up.
 
#141
#141
BadJerry20 said:
Yeah I know and it'll probably come from people yelling it was just one game after the loss, even though the win will be just one game. Funny how that works.

Edit: that was directed at if we win walking it up.
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But all the analysis has been stimulating lol
 
#142
#142
BadJerry20 said:
Yeah I know and it'll probably come from people yelling it was just one game after the loss, even though the win will be just one game. Funny how that works.

Edit: that was directed at if we win walking it up.
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Bad thing is if we lose it'll be 1 million times worse.
 
#144
#144
Chris4Vols22 said:
More reasonable than writing off the whole season after the first game.
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I don't think anyone wrote the season off but were venting after a really bad first game. It was the most disappointing first game I have ever watched. I really don't think Xavier is that good of a ball club and thought we would roll them by double digits. I definitely thought if we lost, Xavier would have to play a heck of a game. Xavier played bad and still led us by 8-9 most of the game.
 
#145
#145
volbeast33 said:
I don't think anyone wrote the season off but were venting after a really bad first game. It was the most disappointing first game I have ever watched. I really don't think Xavier is that good of a ball club and thought we would roll them by double digits. I definitely thought if we lost, Xavier would have to play a heck of a game. Xavier played bad and still led us by 8-9 most of the game.
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That's what happens when you start 1 for 17 from the floor and finish 7 of 19 from the foul line. You can complain as much as you want about Martin, but if the players hit 35% from the field and made 50% of the foul shots, they win by 10. Simple as that.
 
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#146
#146
whobethis16 said:
That's what happens when you start 1 for 17 from the floor and finish 7 of 19 from the foul line. You can complain as much as you want about Martin, but if the players hit 35% from the field and made 50% of the foul shots, they win by 10. Simple as that.
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And if a frog had wings he wouldn't bump his butt on the ground every time he jumped.
 
#147
#147
whobethis16 said:
That's what happens when you start 1 for 17 from the floor and finish 7 of 19 from the foul line. You can complain as much as you want about Martin, but if the players hit 35% from the field and made 50% of the foul shots, they win by 10. Simple as that.
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Volbeast just likes to hate for no reason :p
 
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