Official Jon Gruden Thread V

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#5,377
#5,377
gnm53108 said:
Seperate.

You dont want coaches in charge of engineering...you dont want Prof's in charge of football.
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I hear ya, but you've got professors who make chump change while we pay coaches millions of dollars per year.

I don't blame them for being a bit testy about "more focus on football."
 
#5,378
#5,378
bjsvols1 said:
I rarely post on here but I follow it closely. I don't have any real insiders in terms of boosters but I am very much in tune with the Knoxville political scene as well as some inner workings of the university.

What folks have to realize is this goes far deeper than any coach, AD, booster, etc. It is a very deep divide including culture at the university as well as administrative structure. We have a very divided fanbase. My guess is the AD is divided as well but I don't know that. You have a divide between the AD and university that goes back several years to Dr. Crabtree when, after he left, the AD was moved under Cheek and out from the system. These divides haven't gone away and in some cases, due to the whole separation of women's and men's ADs have gotten worse.

Look, Cheek isn't a bad guy and in many respects is doing what he was hired to do - make UT a top academic and research institution. Unfortunately football is secondary there. Really, you can't blame Cheek for that - it was the direction he was given.

Now, all of a sudden, many - trustees, fanbase, boosters, etc. realize the problem has been the culture and focus all along and are trying to change that, but some want the focus to be academics not football. What that means is back to UT being a land grant institution that focuses on educating the citizens of the state first - that is headlined by excellence in athletics. The problem is everyone is divided. The university and AD are in bad financial positions making all this even more difficult. What folks need to realize is that the Debbie Jennings issues are going on every day all across the university. The place is a disaster administratively. One of the solutions for athletics is separating the AD from the university like UGA and UF into it's own separate organization. It's been on the table for a while but never seems to be at the forefront. My guess is that is what is going on now.

So, in summary of this book, fans have to be patient. This goes further than any coach or any one administrator. It's not so much about standards - they can get enough athletes in school. It's about support, control, and everyone being on the same page. Whether it's Gruden being a possibility that's made this urgent, who knows, but it's a conversation that has been needed for a long time. It's about uniting everyone involved as much as anything. Leadership is a problem and has been for years. Until that changes, it doesn't matter who the coach is or might be. We're going to see what the Governor and Dipietro are made of with this. It's their job to make all this work, but based on what I know of how things are run financially over there, I'm not optimistic those in charge know or understand the real problems.

My guess is the boosters want a big time coach, but control and support is going to be a major issue. Even if Gruden wants to come here and the boosters will pay him, why would he want to deal with this crap? Also, IMO, Hart has made things worse because he's the classic good ole boy, which is the last thing this university needs and what they need to rid themselves of.
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1) Thanks for the great insight.

2) What a disaster.
 
#5,379
#5,379
bjsvols1 said:
I rarely post on here but I follow it closely. I don't have any real insiders in terms of boosters but I am very much in tune with the Knoxville political scene as well as some inner workings of the university.

What folks have to realize is this goes far deeper than any coach, AD, booster, etc. It is a very deep divide including culture at the university as well as administrative structure. We have a very divided fanbase. My guess is the AD is divided as well but I don't know that. You have a divide between the AD and university that goes back several years to Dr. Crabtree when, after he left, the AD was moved under Cheek and out from the system. These divides haven't gone away and in some cases, due to the whole separation of women's and men's ADs have gotten worse.

Look, Cheek isn't a bad guy and in many respects is doing what he was hired to do - make UT a top academic and research institution. Unfortunately football is secondary there. Really, you can't blame Cheek for that - it was the direction he was given.

Now, all of a sudden, many - trustees, fanbase, boosters, etc. realize the problem has been the culture and focus all along and are trying to change that, but some want the focus to be academics not football. What that means is back to UT being a land grant institution that focuses on educating the citizens of the state first - that is headlined by excellence in athletics. The problem is everyone is divided. The university and AD are in bad financial positions making all this even more difficult. What folks need to realize is that the Debbie Jennings issues are going on every day all across the university. The place is a disaster administratively. One of the solutions for athletics is separating the AD from the university like UGA and UF into it's own separate organization. It's been on the table for a while but never seems to be at the forefront. My guess is that is what is going on now.

So, in summary of this book, fans have to be patient. This goes further than any coach or any one administrator. It's not so much about standards - they can get enough athletes in school. It's about support, control, and everyone being on the same page. Whether it's Gruden being a possibility that's made this urgent, who knows, but it's a conversation that has been needed for a long time. It's about uniting everyone involved as much as anything. Leadership is a problem and has been for years. Until that changes, it doesn't matter who the coach is or might be. We're going to see what the Governor and Dipietro are made of with this. It's their job to make all this work, but based on what I know of how things are run financially over there, I'm not optimistic those in charge know or understand the real problems.

My guess is the boosters want a big time coach, but control and support is going to be a major issue. Even if Gruden wants to come here and the boosters will pay him, why would he want to deal with this crap? Also, IMO, Hart has made things worse because he's the classic good ole boy, which is the last thing this university needs and what they need to rid themselves of.
Click to expand...
This may be the best post in all of these threads. Thank you. My guess is this is more accurate than any of the insider posts about Gruden.
 
#5,380
#5,380
Escape Goat said:
I love Phil, but no way would he make a good AD. I would love to see him around the program in some capacity, but not in the final decision making process of any kind. The game passed him by. His friendships and loyalties did him in. And for the record I jump on people that make "Phil" jokes. Those posters are garbage in my eyes. Just telling you my opinion.
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I respect your opinion I know phil lost it a little bit those last couple of years and got lazy but he could have brought it back in my eyes JMO I think he always had the Good interest in the program though and yes like you I don't like the Fulmer bashers
 
#5,383
#5,383
DeepSpringsVol said:
I just revisited. Who is in this meeting & about what? Can you bump the post or explain.
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I've only heard rumors of it here, but I believe it to be a BOT meeting. Speculation that some of the characters in this drama to he present.
 
#5,384
#5,384
bjsvols1 said:
So, in summary of this book, fans have to be patient. This goes further than any coach or any one administrator. It's not so much about standards - they can get enough athletes in school. It's about support, control, and everyone being on the same page. Whether it's Gruden being a possibility that's made this urgent, who knows, but it's a conversation that has been needed for a long time. It's about uniting everyone involved as much as anything. Leadership is a problem and has been for years. Until that changes, it doesn't matter who the coach is or might be. We're going to see what the Governor and Dipietro are made of with this. It's their job to make all this work, but based on what I know of how things are run financially over there, I'm not optimistic those in charge know or understand the real problems.

My guess is the boosters want a big time coach, but control and support is going to be a major issue. Even if Gruden wants to come here and the boosters will pay him, why would he want to deal with this crap? Also, IMO, Hart has made things worse because he's the classic good ole boy, which is the last thing this university needs and what they need to rid themselves of.
Click to expand...

The problem is that we don't have time to be patient. Opportunity may be knocking with Gruden at the door, and we are so effing busy tripping over our own two feet that we can't answer the effing door.

Now, it is quite possible that this is all part of the plan. Maybe the large boosters are using this to get exactly what they want on the hill--not just Gruden as HFC, but also the chancellor and AD they want, as well as the reporting duties of the AD.

Leaking all of this to the public, with Gruden being the carrot, sure does give them support to do whatever it takes to bring him in.

If this is not the case, though, we are in for more football futility. It is amazing what the mismanagement of this program has done. It has effectively reduce a nationally competitive program to a pile of rubble in less than 8 years. Astonishing.
 
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#5,386
#5,386
FearlessFreep said:
This administration shakeup talk isn't giving me confidence in the future of the program.

In essence if half of this is true, we're royally screwed.
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I don't think even half is true. If you believe even half of what is in this thread, our program is in real trouble. Simply not the case. Cheek won't block the hire of a new coach and he won't interfere with getting one. People are just looking for someone to blame when we don't get Gruden.
 
#5,387
#5,387
The Waco Kid said:
I hear ya, but you've got professors who make chump change while we pay coaches millions of dollars per year.

I don't blame them for being a bit testy about "more focus on football."
Click to expand...

Could it be that coaches performance impacts the immediate bottom line while professors performance impacts the long term bottom line?

I challenge Cheek to see how long he likes his role if UT were to not have an athletic program...or a less than prominent one...it would be like ETSU all over again...ridiculous tuition hikes, no football, and less than stellar educational programs that center mostly around one area of study...nursing.
 
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#5,389
#5,389
I posted this quote last night from Hubbs and will repost it again today........


But it's very interesting to note that Tennessee's annual Board of Trustees meeting is upcoming next weekend, and there are some key topic points that will have both direct and indirect impact on UT's athletics department.

First, there is the review of a "performance and retention" plan for executive officers. That includes many, from Jimmy Cheek on down.

Additionally, and perhaps of more importance, is this: There is a proposed amendment of the UT-UTFI affiliation and services agreement to change the reporting line for athletics departments personnel in Knoxville. Right. Layman's terms: UTFI is the abbreviation for the University of Tennessee Foundation Incorporated. So, either more unilateral control will be granted to the athletic department development, or athletic development would be totally absorbed under its wing. Presently, the Athletic Department is listed as a separate office.


hubbs
 
#5,390
#5,390
Scotty's Flat Top said:
Why academics and athletics should be two separate institutions.
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Academics doesn't get residual $$$$$ when the stadium looks like this.

0EABE0D4.jpg
 
#5,394
#5,394
EZE said:
The problem is that we don't have time to be patient. Opportunity may be knocking with Gruden at the door, and we are so effing busy tripping over our own two feet that we can't answer the effing door.

Now, it is quite possible that this is all part of the plan. Maybe the large boosters are using this to get exactly what they want on the hill--not just Gruden as HFC, but also the chancellor and AD they want, as well as the reporting duties of the AD.

Leaking all of this to the public, with Gruden being the carrot, sure does give them support to do whatever it takes to bring him in.

If this is not the case, though, we are in for more football futility. It is amazing what the mismanagement of this program has done. It has effectively reduce a nationally competitive program to a pile of rubble in less than 8 years. Astonishing.
Click to expand...

Yup!
 
#5,397
#5,397
Boro, it's also not just about the slice of the $$$ pie to academics from the AD. That is the issue though, from what I know. The problem is that there is a huge disagreement over who has what, who does what, who is owed what, etc.

The big line that UT was one of the few self supporting ADs in the country for a long time, from what I have heard, is not totally true. The university supports the AD in many, many ways that hasn't always been financially recorded or made known, basically just so the AD could throw out this great statement of how it was self supporting. That university moves money around like nothing I've ever seen. They waste like nothing I've ever seen, which is saying a lot for me. Sure the AD gives millions to the university for scholarships. However, at the end of the day, it's basically a wash.

The financial issues are the elephant in the room that no one wants to tackle directly or talk about, but are always the hidden reasons for everything. The entire university needs to get their act together or someone (the media) needs to expose them.
 
#5,398
#5,398
P.S. - If you haven't watched the following, it is mandatory viewing to get some much-needed perspective.
[youtube]http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=3I9UsfDZLyQ[/youtube]
 
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#5,399
#5,399
The Waco Kid said:
I hear ya, but you've got professors who make chump change while we pay coaches millions of dollars per year.

I don't blame them for being a bit testy about "more focus on football."
Click to expand...

Two separate sources of revenue. When the football program is paying professors from the same source, let me know. Professors make well enough.
 
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