President That Has Damaged Liberty the Most?

#26
#26
n_huffhines said:
Wait until you get cancer and they tell you that you can't smoke pot, and your doctors replace 1 natural drug with 5 man-made drugs to treat the side effects of your chemo. Ironically, in turn the drugs typically produce their own negative side effects.

Wait until you are found with a large sum of cash and a cop decides to confiscate it without PC.

We're free to an extent, but liberty is definitely on the decline. The POTUS had an American citizen assassinated/murdered this year. PATRIOT Act. TSA. Raw Milk. Hemp. We can't buy from Cuba. Etc. We're not as free as we'd like to think.
Click to expand...

Show me that it's truly on the decline. People act like the US is at a low point in its history when it comes to its people having freedom, but in reality it's pretty much the opposite. If you're going to tell me it's so much worse, you have to first prove that we had those liberties in the past in the first place.

You can already eliminate the first 180-200 years of US history.
 
#27
#27
gsvol said:
Wilson's worst effort was the federal reserve act that he snuck through on Christmas eve when most senators had gone home for the holidays.

The income tax was part of that infamous bill but wasn't really enforced until FDR came to office and the really rich peope put their money in untaxable trusts, thus insuring a feudalistic system that seperates the wealthy from the not so wealthy for as long as the fed act and it's 300+ amendments exist.

One of the progeny of those who own us lock stock and barrel through the central banking system that was much opposed by the founding fathers and Jackson, Lincoln and McKinley and others, bragged that only one man in a million could understand it and there would be no objection from that sector because those people would be beholden to the system for their livelihood.

I don't understand why one man in a million doesn't understand the system but so far I havn't found anyone on this site who does, go figga.

Anther thing that apparently isn't understood is the 'consumer protection act', otherwise known as the dud fwank bill. (another bill that strengthens the federal reserve act)

The most important thing about that bill is that whenever the next financial crisis comes, (and it is sure to come sooner or later, probably sooner), congress will not have to be consulted about a bailout, the dud fwank bill insures that those entities that are deemed to be too big to fail, ie the fed and the international central banking system, will automatically be bailed out.

Smaller regional bankers are NOT protected and therefore can't take the risks the central banks can and are screaming bloody murder but the media, (owned by the same interests that own the central banking system) are deaf to such protests.

What really really REALLY tees me off is that it virtually enslaves my grandchildren through taxes, not to mention it is a slap in my face and to every other reasonably intelligent American who cherishes freedom.






Well he didn't steal the silverware like Hitlery did!








Ranking the five worst since Ford.

1. Obama
2. Carter
3. Clinton
4. Bush II
5. Bush I

Clinton could easily top the list except that when he tried to ram through hitlerycare, he produced a backlash that enabled the republican'ts to take control of congress, (thus the national purse strings) for the first time in fifty years. (unfortunately they fumbled the ball inside the five under Bush II.)
Click to expand...

Very nice post GS. :hi:
 
  • Like
Reactions: 1 person
#28
#28
UTRavens = no-one here is going to make an attempt to give a piece by piece seminar on American History so you can catch up. HOWEVER, I will point out the obvious: over the last 10 years, most of our daily transactions have become internet based and thus easily monitored by the gov. That's a decline in liberty in my opinion. There's that thing called email. Used to be we wrote letters that showed up in the snail mail unopened and still private. Not anymore. There is gigantic software out there used by the gov that is in all probability monitoring this thread as we exchange ideas. That makes me comfortable. NOT.
 
#29
#29
Professor Nono said:
UTRavens = no-one here is going to make an attempt to give a piece by piece seminar on American History so you can catch up. HOWEVER, I will point out the obvious: over the last 10 years, most of our daily transactions have become internet based and thus easily monitored by the gov. That's a decline in liberty in my opinion. There's that thing called email. Used to be we wrote letters that showed up in the snail mail unopened and still private. Not anymore. There is gigantic software out there used by the gov that is in all probability monitoring this thread as we exchange ideas. That makes me comfortable. NOT.
Click to expand...

Then get rid of your credit cards and internet. The "monitoring" is a product of the automation and technology. Companies monitor more than the gov't does. And for me, I have no problem if they are, nothing to hide.
 
  • Like
Reactions: 2 people
#30
#30
UTRavens said:
Show me that it's truly on the decline. People act like the US is at a low point in its history when it comes to its people having freedom, but in reality it's pretty much the opposite. If you're going to tell me it's so much worse, you have to first prove that we had those liberties in the past in the first place.

You can already eliminate the first 180-200 years of US history.
Click to expand...

The last major gain in freedom was the Equal Rights Act (I believe that's the title). So in my opinion, the 50 years since have been a net decline.

I have to prove to you that we used to be able to use hemp, keep our hard-earned cash, live PATRIOT Act-free, etc.? Weed wasn't legal in the 60s, but FBI agents weren't raiding the homes of sick people back then. The law is the same, but stricter enforcement = less freedom.
 
Last edited:
#31
#31
Just the simple fact that we pay more in taxes and are burdened by debt means we are less free.
 
  • Like
Reactions: 2 people
#34
#34
Doesn't change the fact that we still pay more quite a bit now than we have historically. They collect more in revenue yet end up putting us on the hook for more debt? Eminent domain. EPA overreach. This is not freedom.
 
#35
#35
n_huffhines said:
Doesn't change the fact that we still pay more quite a bit now than we have historically. They collect more in revenue yet end up putting us on the hook for more debt? Eminent domain. EPA overreach. This is not freedom.
Click to expand...

OK. So, is there a better alternative, like another country that is more "free" with more "liberty"? Or is the US still the best of the best?
 
#36
#36
It's hard to say definitively, but we rank like 8th or 9th in economic freedom.
 
#39
#39
Obama

Executive Orders? Preparations to seize control?
If you think Obama is not the most dangerous man to ever inhabit the White House, if you think you know all the executive orders he has signed, if you think this upcoming election doesn't matter that much and YOU are willing to gamble away your vote on a third party candidate, read on.....THIS IS SICK! We are in trouble, we have an enemy within and he is out to destroy everything we know!! His framework is built right before our eyes!!!

Look into the executive orders he has issued in the last three and a half years. This was found in an article in Western Journalism that scares the hell out of me and should frighten all of us. Get out the vote in November folks!!! This guy is dangerous...

A Comprehensive List Of Obama's Worst Executive Orders
JUNE 15, 2012 BY LAURIE ROTH

There have been over 900 Executive Orders put forth from Obama, and he is not even through his first term yet. He is creating a martial law 'Disney Land' of control covering everything imaginable. Some of the executive orders he has signed recently have been exposed thanks to 'Friends of Conservative Action Alerts.' They have compiled a choice list of 'Emergency Powers, Martial law executive orders': Get your headache medication out while you still can without a prescription.

* Executive Order 10990 allows the Government to take over all modes of transportation and control of highways and seaports.
* Executive Order 10995 allows the government to seize and control the communication media.
* Executive Order 10997 allows the government to take over all electrical power, gas, petroleum, fuels, and minerals.
* Executive Order 11000 allows the government to mobilize civilians into work brigades under government supervision.
* Executive Order 11001 allows the government to take over all health education and welfare functions.
* Executive Order 11002 designates the Postmaster General to operate a national registration of all persons.
* Executive Order 11003 allows the government to take over all airports and aircraft, including commercial aircraft.
* Executive Order 11004 allows the Housing and Finance Authority to relocate and establish new locations for populations.
* Executive Order 11005 allows the government to take over railroads, inland waterways, and public storage facilities.
* Executive Order 11049 assigns emergency preparedness function to federal departments and agencies, consolidating 21 operative Executive Orders issued over a fifteen-year period.
* Executive Order 11051 specifies the responsibility of the Office of Emergency Planning and gives authorization to put all Executive Orders into effect in times of increased international tensions and economic or financial crisis.
* Executive Order 11310 grants authority to the Department of Justice to enforce the plans set out in Executive Orders, to institute Industrial support, to establish judicial and legislative liaison, to control all aliens, to operate penal and correctional institutions, and to advise and assist the President.
* Executive Order 11921 allows the Federal Emergency Preparedness Agency to develop plans to establish control over the mechanisms of production and distribution of energy sources, wages, salaries, credit, and the flow of money in U.S. financial institutions in any undefined national emergency. It also provides that when the president declares a state of emergency, Congress cannot review the action for six months.

It is more than clear that Obama is planning for the total control and takeover of America via Martial Law. Food, energy, transportation, work, banking, and health.he has it covered.

While Obama is busy pulling executive orders out of the sky to control everything inside our country, he has been issuing executive orders to force us to submit to international regulations instead of our Constitution.

Sher Zieve exposed this in one of her recent articles. Damn the U.S. Constitution, damn the American people and damn U.S. sovereignty.

We must send faxes, emails, and make calls to all congressman and demand they stop Obama's perverted, extreme, and Unconstitutional abuse of Executive Orders. It is time to demand our elected leaders start protecting America, our sovereignty, and our Constitution. So far, they seem to be protecting the Obama - Marxist takeover plans peppered with a little U.N. and Islam.
 
#41
#41
I admit no research was done and I copied and pasted off a e-mail so a "F" is well deserved. Tanks for the link and correction. With that being said it doesn't change that fact that Obama has made America worse since he's been office.
Posted via VolNation Mobile
 
#43
#43
UTRavens - I can't tell if you are being sarcastic or not. Please respond with the following:

1) Yes, I'm being sarcastic you idiot

2) No, I'm friggin serious.

That way I know whether we have to scrap it out or not. Thanks, Prof.
 
#44
#44
Zetter said:
Obama

Executive Orders? Preparations to seize control?
If you think Obama is not the most dangerous man to ever inhabit the White House, if you think you know all the executive orders he has signed, if you think this upcoming election doesn't matter that much and YOU are willing to gamble away your vote on a third party candidate, read on.....THIS IS SICK! We are in trouble, we have an enemy within and he is out to destroy everything we know!! His framework is built right before our eyes!!!

Look into the executive orders he has issued in the last three and a half years. This was found in an article in Western Journalism that scares the hell out of me and should frighten all of us. Get out the vote in November folks!!! This guy is dangerous...

A Comprehensive List Of Obama's Worst Executive Orders
JUNE 15, 2012 BY LAURIE ROTH

There have been over 900 Executive Orders put forth from Obama, and he is not even through his first term yet. He is creating a martial law 'Disney Land' of control covering everything imaginable. Some of the executive orders he has signed recently have been exposed thanks to 'Friends of Conservative Action Alerts.' They have compiled a choice list of 'Emergency Powers, Martial law executive orders': Get your headache medication out while you still can without a prescription.

* Executive Order 10990 allows the Government to take over all modes of transportation and control of highways and seaports.
* Executive Order 10995 allows the government to seize and control the communication media.
* Executive Order 10997 allows the government to take over all electrical power, gas, petroleum, fuels, and minerals.
* Executive Order 11000 allows the government to mobilize civilians into work brigades under government supervision.
* Executive Order 11001 allows the government to take over all health education and welfare functions.
* Executive Order 11002 designates the Postmaster General to operate a national registration of all persons.
* Executive Order 11003 allows the government to take over all airports and aircraft, including commercial aircraft.
* Executive Order 11004 allows the Housing and Finance Authority to relocate and establish new locations for populations.
* Executive Order 11005 allows the government to take over railroads, inland waterways, and public storage facilities.
* Executive Order 11049 assigns emergency preparedness function to federal departments and agencies, consolidating 21 operative Executive Orders issued over a fifteen-year period.
* Executive Order 11051 specifies the responsibility of the Office of Emergency Planning and gives authorization to put all Executive Orders into effect in times of increased international tensions and economic or financial crisis.
* Executive Order 11310 grants authority to the Department of Justice to enforce the plans set out in Executive Orders, to institute Industrial support, to establish judicial and legislative liaison, to control all aliens, to operate penal and correctional institutions, and to advise and assist the President.
* Executive Order 11921 allows the Federal Emergency Preparedness Agency to develop plans to establish control over the mechanisms of production and distribution of energy sources, wages, salaries, credit, and the flow of money in U.S. financial institutions in any undefined national emergency. It also provides that when the president declares a state of emergency, Congress cannot review the action for six months.

It is more than clear that Obama is planning for the total control and takeover of America via Martial Law. Food, energy, transportation, work, banking, and health.he has it covered.

While Obama is busy pulling executive orders out of the sky to control everything inside our country, he has been issuing executive orders to force us to submit to international regulations instead of our Constitution.

Sher Zieve exposed this in one of her recent articles. Damn the U.S. Constitution, damn the American people and damn U.S. sovereignty.

We must send faxes, emails, and make calls to all congressman and demand they stop Obama's perverted, extreme, and Unconstitutional abuse of Executive Orders. It is time to demand our elected leaders start protecting America, our sovereignty, and our Constitution. So far, they seem to be protecting the Obama - Marxist takeover plans peppered with a little U.N. and Islam.
Click to expand...

For the sake of discussion, say Obama is really planning the imposition of martial law & starting a dictatorship, what the hell would calling our congressmen, senators, etc accomplish?
 
#45
#45
Seriously - an open debate about this kind of thing can get you arrested and put in a loony bin - ie - that marine dude that got a visit from the FBI.
 
#46
#46
Professor Nono said:
UTRavens - I can't tell if you are being sarcastic or not. Please respond with the following:

1) Yes, I'm being sarcastic you idiot

2) No, I'm friggin serious.

That way I know whether we have to scrap it out or not. Thanks, Prof.
Click to expand...

1
 
#48
#48
UTRavens said:
The whole "damaged liberty" thing is so overblown. I still have the freedom to live a normal life, voice my opinions and enjoy what society has to offer. No amount of partisan fear mongering is going to change that.

If I want to have less freedom, I'll go back to pretty much any period in American history that isn't the present day.
Click to expand...

Must have a position at teat #1 or #2. Definitely not the hind teat.


Yeah, me too. My sarcasm meter wasn't even jiggling. However, with some of his other posts, I think his answer of #1 is probably sarcastic.
 
Last edited:
#49
#49
n_huffhines said:
Just the simple fact that we pay more in taxes and are burdened by debt means we are less free.
Click to expand...

When The U.S. Paid Off The Entire National Debt (And Why It Didn't Last) : Planet Money : NPR

Agree, I wish I we could go back to the 1830s when we didn't have a national debt and there was so much freedom.

Freedom abound in the 1830s...yes 30 years before the Civil War, America was the example of freedom...slaves were free to not die, women free to cook anything they were told by their husbands. Children were free to put in long hours at the textile mills...

Stay string my brotha, fight the oppression...let's join together in song for the struggle


Swing lowww sweet chariot - coming forth to carry me homeeeee
 
#50
#50
Since we are freer than we were in 1830 we shouldn't aspire to increase freedom. Got it.

BTW, We still have slavery today, it's just practiced by government.

1850 - Under a slavery system slaves worked and their reward was just a fraction of the product of their labor, against their will. Consider that food and shelter were actually very large expenses for workers in 1850.

Today - We keep just a fraction of the product of our labor, against our will.

Someone will likely freak out and act like I'm saying they are one and the same. We're generally treated very nicely as slaves. It's not the same kind of slavery, but it's slavery. Slavery to the state. If you don't think it is, try to keep all the money you earn and see what happens. They'll do you worse than a whipping.
 
Last edited:
New posts
You must log in or register to reply here.
Advertisement

Back
Top