A boy named Trayvon Martin is shot and killed by neighborhood watch goon

#1,252
#1,252
Looks like, from the DA's statement, that the only thing they are using to bring the charges is "GZ should have listened to the 911 operator". If that is it and they are just going to try and "convince" the judge all of the rest of what they "think" happened, then there probably will not even be a trial.
If the prosecutor has new evidence that no one but she knows yet.....all bets are off
I say there will be a trial, as there is too much pressure for there not to be, but no conviction. DA has doubled down on the 2nd degree and I do not see how, from what we know at this point, they can make that stick.
 
#1,253
#1,253
YorkVol said:
Long way to go, but I think chances are slim for a conviction on 2nd degree murder. I could see him get convicted for something much less, i.e. negligent homicide.
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or I just read a story this morning in the tribune, and a man in Chicago was convicted of illegal possesion of a firearm, and wasn't convicted of manslaughter after he shot a teen in his driveway
 
#1,254
#1,254
Vercingetorix said:
You are minding your own business walking through a neighborhood and suddenly a guy with a gun starts aggressively following you. You are terrified and defend yourself. How the hell is that "flipping"?

I have no problem with guns; I have no problem with defending yourself. But Occam's Razor is pretty clear about what happened here. Zimmerman initiated the whole thing. It's absolute horseshat that he should be able to claim self-defense when the whole confrontation was his own damn doing.

Trayvon Martin apparently stood his ground, as Florida law encourages you to do. Too bad all he had was a pack of candy.
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According to the 911 tape Trayvon ran. Zimmerman was on the phone with 911 person for several minutes after he said Trayvon ran.

As far as 'aggressively following' part, this is what salespeople do all day. Someone followed me down my street last week and tried to sale me a newspaper. I dont like it sometimes, but anyone can follow anyone in public.
 
#1,255
#1,255
vols-1 said:
According to the 911 tape Trayvon ran. Zimmerman was on the phone with 911 person for several minutes after he said Trayvon ran.

As far as 'aggressively following' part, this is what salespeople do all day. Someone followed me down my street last week and tried to sale me a newspaper. I dont like it sometimes, but anyone can follow anyone in public.
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According to GZ he ran, which is still not illegal. Plus it was cold and rainy, which makes it smart. But still none of us know the truth.
 
#1,257
#1,257
Vercingetorix said:
You are minding your own business walking through a neighborhood and suddenly a guy with a gun starts aggressively following you. You are terrified and defend yourself. How the hell is that "flipping"?

I have no problem with guns; I have no problem with defending yourself. But Occam's Razor is pretty clear about what happened here. Zimmerman initiated the whole thing. It's absolute horseshat that he should be able to claim self-defense when the whole confrontation was his own damn doing.

Trayvon Martin apparently stood his ground, as Florida law encourages you to do. Too bad all he had was a pack of candy.
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Defending yourself doesnt mean beat the s*** out of him. And this "kid" was 6'3. Hardly looks like a kid if he had his hood up at night.
 
#1,262
#1,262
KoachKrab127 said:
Trayvon Martin Case Sent To State Attorney's Office Amid Growing Tension, Questions About Police Probe

Seventeen year old Trayvon Martin was walking home from a store as a neighborhood watch clown, 26 year old George Zimmerman called 911 and reported a "suspicious individual." Cops told Zimmerman not to confront the teen, but Zimmerman did, then shot and killed him. Police have not arrested Zimmerman, who claims self defense. The only things Martin had were a bottle of iced tea and a bag of skittles. A witness claims she heard Trayvon yell for help, then heard a gun shot. Police investigation has been HORRIBLE. The article talks a lot about that failure.
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Nerd-Vol said:
That's really screwed up.


I am sure many around here will say the boy had it coming, or blame liberal media.
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:eek:k:
 
#1,265
#1,265
#1,267
#1,267
Something that bothers me is the obvious push by most major media outlets and others to spin the story in a certain way - the one that would cause the most controversy and, therefore, the one that would cause the most income to the media outlets and others.

There are pictures of an unsmiling, more portly Zimmerman in a previous mugshot for an earlier arrest for either resisting arrest with non-violence or resisting arrest with violence. It makes a difference to me whether it there was violence or not. The only problem is that we all know that police will charge with the most and worst and then the case will be resolved for something less. We just can't tell from the public record at the moment. Also, Zimmerman apparently had a falling out with a girlfriend and both of them had orders of protection taken against each other for domestic violence. But, if anyone on here has ever been down to Knox County Circuit Court IV on Thursday, every Tom, Dick and Harriet in the county is down there getting a order of protection taken out because they are freely handed out whether the allegations are true, exaggerated or untrue. So what is the truth in the Zimmerman domestic violence allegation - it makes a difference to me but we just can't tell from the public record at this point.

Further, there are pictures out there of Trayvon with a grill in his teeth. Alleged pictures of a Trayvon tattoos. An alleged picture of Trayvon flipping a bird (s). An alleged twitter entry by Trayvon under the name "@NO_LIMIT_NIGGA." A suspension from school for pot. Perhaps a juvenile record for violence and/or burglary charges. All of this while he is 17. All this makes a difference to me but I just can't tell what is true and what is not true. If Trayvon was just a kid minding his own business walking home on the sidewalk eating skittles, that's one thing. But if Trayvon was trespassing by walking between houses, sporting a grill, not walking directly home but apparently checking out the homes of others with a hoodie hiding his face, that's another thing.

It also makes a difference if Trayvon was beating Zimmerman's head on the pavement when the shooting occurred. The sidewalk can be a deadly weapon and defendants have been charged with aggravated assault and/or attempted murder, and convicted, for this very act.

You know what needs to happen? Both of the complete records of these individuals need to be opened to the public for inspection - dismissals, juvenile or whatever.
 
#1,268
#1,268
vol_in_il said:
he was big enough to get zimmerman down and crack his head open
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Mighty mothers find superhuman strength to lift 1,400kg car off run over schoolboy | Mail Online

People can do amazing things when they're backed into a corner. If two girls can lift a car that weighs a ton, surely a kid can fend off a man if he feels threatened.

You say Trayvon was "big enough". I say Zimmerman was a big enough wuss. Having to shoot an unarmed kid half your size because you can't physically defend yourself says more about Zimmerman's toughness than the kids size. I'm guessing that's one of the reasons he didn't make it as a cop and chose to harass people for no reason in his spare time.

I imagine the fight went something like this... www.youtube.com/watch?v=dg5YlFBQYJE. The little guy did it after breaking his hand on the first punch too. People can overcome handicaps when they have no other choice. Could be the case for Trayvon. He felt threatened and his natural instincts to survive kicked in.

All we know for certain is, he was unarmed and a guy twice that had been following him, shot him. This doesn't happen if the guy stops spending his time in a car looking for crime that's never going to happen. It's not like cops just look for burglars breaking into houses and waiting for someone to rob a gas station. People call to report it. The odds of actually seeing a crime being committed around a neighborhood is virtually non-existant. Playing superhero is for people with mental problems. Seeing as he shot an unarmed kid for walking through a neighborhood, I'm assuming he has some.
 
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#1,269
#1,269
The_Orange_Pearl said:
Mighty mothers find superhuman strength to lift 1,400kg car off run over schoolboy | Mail Online

People can do amazing things when they're backed into a corner. If two girls can lift a car that weighs a ton, surely a kid can fend off a man if he feels threatened.

You say Trayvon was "big enough". I say Zimmerman was a big enough wuss. Having to shoot an unarmed kid half your size because you can't physically defend yourself says more about Zimmerman's toughness than the kids size. I'm guessing that's one of the reasons he didn't make it as a cop and chose to harass people for no reason in his spare time.

I imagine the fight went something like this... www.youtube.com/watch?v=dg5YlFBQYJE. The little guy did it after breaking his hand on the first punch too. People can overcome handicaps when they have no other choice. Could be the case for Trayvon. He felt threatened and his natural instincts to survive kicked in.

All we know for certain is, he was unarmed and a guy twice that had been following him, shot him. This doesn't happen if the guy stops spending his time in a car looking for crime that's never going to happen. It's not like cops just look for burglars breaking into houses and waiting for someone to rob a gas station. People call to report it. The odds of actually seeing a crime being committed around a neighborhood is virtually non-existant. Playing superhero is for people with mental problems. Seeing as he shot an unarmed kid for walking through a neighborhood, I'm assuming he has some.
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Crimes do happen and this is the reason neighborhood watches exit. It's also the reason cops patrol...just in case they can catch someone in the act. Your statement here is wickedy wickedy wack.
 
#1,270
#1,270
The_Orange_Pearl said:
Mighty mothers find superhuman strength to lift 1,400kg car off run over schoolboy | Mail Online

People can do amazing things when they're backed into a corner. If two girls can lift a car that weighs a ton, surely a kid can fend off a man if he feels threatened.

You say Trayvon was "big enough". I say Zimmerman was a big enough wuss. Having to shoot an unarmed kid half your size because you can't physically defend yourself says more about Zimmerman's toughness than the kids size. I'm guessing that's one of the reasons he didn't make it as a cop and chose to harass people for no reason in his spare time.

I imagine the fight went something like this... www.youtube.com/watch?v=dg5YlFBQYJE. The little guy did it after breaking his hand on the first punch too. People can overcome handicaps when they have no other choice. Could be the case for Trayvon. He felt threatened and his natural instincts to survive kicked in.

All we know for certain is, he was unarmed and a guy twice that had been following him, shot him. This doesn't happen if the guy stops spending his time in a car looking for crime that's never going to happen. It's not like cops just look for burglars breaking into houses and waiting for someone to rob a gas station. People call to report it. The odds of actually seeing a crime being committed around a neighborhood is virtually non-existant. Playing superhero is for people with mental problems. Seeing as he shot an unarmed kid for walking through a neighborhood, I'm assuming he has some.
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Maybe Trayvon was the 'wuss' for grabbing for the gun. Two seconds later and Trayvon would not have been unarmed. Zimmerman was not going to wait around and see what Trayvon was going to do with the gun when he got it.
 
#1,273
#1,273
House Democrats said Tuesday they will offer an amendment to push to overturn stand-your-ground self-defense laws in states like Florida.

House to vote on Trayvon amendment - Washington Times

My question is if this passes then could they deny federal funds to states that allow self-defense?

Federal money shouldn’t be spent supporting states with laws that endanger their own people,” said Reps. Raul Grijalva of Arizona and Keith Ellison of Minnesota, the two Democrats who are offering the legislation.
 
#1,274
#1,274
myrobbins7 said:
House Democrats said Tuesday they will offer an amendment to push to overturn stand-your-ground self-defense laws in states like Florida.

House to vote on Trayvon amendment - Washington Times

My question is if this passes then could they deny federal funds to states that allow self-defense?

Federal money shouldn’t be spent supporting states with laws that endanger their own people,” said Reps. Raul Grijalva of Arizona and Keith Ellison of Minnesota, the two Democrats who are offering the legislation.
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So they're going to try and pass this law before if even goes to trial? What happens if it goes to trial and Zimmerman is found innocent or acquitted are they going to overturn the law?
 
#1,275
#1,275
volfan6782 said:
So they're going to try and pass this law before if even goes to trial? What happens if it goes to trial and Zimmerman is found innocent or acquitted are they going to overturn the law?
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Of course they wouldn't overturn it (IMO) "never let a good crisis go to waist" Hrmmm, now where have I heard that?
 
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