Who were the exceptional LV passers of the past?

#1

stllvf

StlLVF Saw first game in 1976
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#1
A subject I don't believe has ever been discussed.

Caitlin Clark's reputation as a passer is regularly discussed on all media but I don't believe I've ever had other players been assessed for that skill?

not just assists, for they only count if the recipient scores, being fouled and made free throws don't count. not just point guards,

aside I remember the first LVs who tried a behind the back pass in the era of PHS; it took risk, and the player was a recipient of a stare. (smile)
 
#2
#2
Certainly Candace Parker. Hornbuckle could be an exciting passer, too. Those teams were defense-first but in retrospect those are two of the best passers I can think of in LV history.

Horston's passing was super impressive, even if her teammates often weren't ready and the passes lead to a turnover.

I always loved Burdick's smooth game, and her passing was part of that.

It feels taboo to mention her name around here, but Evina Westbrook had great vision and passing, too.
 
#3
#3
Certainly Candace Parker. Hornbuckle could be an exciting passer, too. Those teams were defense-first but in retrospect those are two of the best passers I can think of in LV history.

Horston's passing was super impressive, even if her teammates often weren't ready and the passes lead to a turnover.

I always loved Burdick's smooth game, and her passing was part of that.

It feels taboo to mention her name around here, but Evina Westbrook had great vision and passing, too.
Kara Lawson and Lori Moore
 
#4
#4
Certainly Candace Parker. Hornbuckle could be an exciting passer, too. Those teams were defense-first but in retrospect those are two of the best passers I can think of in LV history.

Horston's passing was super impressive, even if her teammates often weren't ready and the passes lead to a turnover.

I always loved Burdick's smooth game, and her passing was part of that.

It feels taboo to mention her name around here, but Evina Westbrook had great vision and passing, too.
Semeka Randle
 
#5
#5
A subject I don't believe has ever been discussed.

Caitlin Clark's reputation as a passer is regularly discussed on all media but I don't believe I've ever had other players been assessed for that skill?

not just assists, for they only count if the recipient scores, being fouled and made free throws don't count. not just point guards,

aside I remember the first LVs who tried a behind the back pass in the era of PHS; it took risk, and the player was a recipient of a stare. (smile)
This is a great and underappreciated topic! Thanks for starting the thread, @stllvf!

I'd love to know how top programs--with all their graduate assistants and huge SSDs full of video--track and grade passes. So many factors go into making an effective pass, regardless of whether it turns into an assist in the stats.

Great passers at this level are not just accurate (putting the ball within a 6-inch window of where the receiver needs to catch it), and they don't just anticipate where their teammate and the defenders are going to be. They also cultivate ways to manipulate defenders away from the anticipated passing lane--or at least get their weight shifted the wrong way. That could include eye fakes (no fake lashes comments--you know who you are!), shoulder turns, faking a pass in another direction, appearing to set up for a shot, even just relaxing or glancing toward the bench can be enough.

A great pass is usually set up several moves in advance. In the course of a game, it may be set up a quarter in advance. That's why basketball is such a great game--there's no end to the number of levels at which it can be played!

Great passers are also calculating how spin is going to effect the handling of their pass. A strong arm can whip a long bounce pass into a player running the lane or baseline, but you have to allow more space between the player and the basket because it's going to take him/her an extra moment to take the spin off the ball and gain control of it before they can manipulate it into a shot or extra pass. I've even seen side-spin used to thread the ball along the baseline, past a defender before angling into the post player!
----
Sorry--didn't mean to bloviate. I just wanted to make sure everyone appreciates all that goes into making a great pass, things that may not show up on TV, that won't show up in stats, or yield easily to a grading system.

Truly, for the Maravich's, Stockton's, Bird's, Nash's, and Magic's of the game--and the elite LVs whose names get noted in this thread--passing is an art of deception and execution.
 
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#6
#6
Marciniak added some flare to her efficiency at passing. Some of the more efficient passers in a half court game were Jolly, Head, Marsh, and Warlick. Agree that Loree Moore was fast and efficient. I would have liked to have seen Lauren Avant play longer for the Lady Vols as well as Cait McMahan.
 
#8
#8
re Bruised Orange's response. The full-court pass that is just out of the range of the intended recipient. We know the 3-point percentage that is acceptable, and I'm sure the turnover against the player is recorded as a missed-pass, and of course the recipient not attuned for such a pass. Horston was such a passer. DeShields was a great passer IMO and the recipients were not always prepared for her strong entry passes.

One of the Fever players talked about for the first time her cuts toward the basket included being prepared for a pass from Clark that she had never experienced prior in her career.

last comment, are other college players trying to learn the Clark level skill, or is she just have the exceptional quarter-back skill that only a few athletes, basketball, football, tennis have?
 
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#9
#9
[...]
last comment, are other college players trying to learn the Clark level skill, or is she just have the exceptional quarter-back skill that only a few athletes, basketball, football, tennis have?
A player can test and develop those unique passing skills in pickup games or community leagues. But I wonder how many school or amateur development league coaches are going to allow even a special player to attempt those kinds of passes in practice or in a game? That's the Catch 22: you have to prove it before you're allowed to do it. And it's still a turnover if your pass is "perfect" but isn't handled by your teammates.

@Coach Jumper may wanna weigh in on that thought.

I think that's why Pat looked at tricky passes as unnecessary risks, confident that patience, sound passing, and better screen running would eventually create a clean shot or an open back cut. But the game was also more static back then. (Remember how much difficulty we had for years just getting the ball cleanly into the low post from the wing? 😫)

Candace might have been our most effective passer, if only because from outside her length gave her better vision and clearance for making overhead passes through narrow openings.

Over time, I think Clark will prove to be the women's Kobe or Steph Curry, raising the mental ceiling on how the game can be played. But that also means a lot of good lower-level coaches are going to have to endure lesser talents who are convinced they can play that game, but are bringing more flash than substance.
 
#10
#10
the reason you don't remember standouts is BC the prior generation took what we "look for" today... as "showy" basketball in the past.

Behind the back, pocket-passes and no-looks,,,
Female players were almost ridiculed for something like that in a game

So passers, ala CC, weren't tolerated.
it was no different with Holly or Jollie,,,both of them frowned on showtime players
This is why Kim will be successful,,,,this is the first top-tier team to play this brand of basketball,,,and there are more CC's out there just waiting to be found

My golden rule on this subject was,,,
"if it ain't part of your practice,,,, it ain't part of your game"
 
#13
#13
the reason you don't remember standouts is BC the prior generation took what we "look for" today... as "showy" basketball in the past.

Behind the back, pocket-passes and no-looks,,,
Female players were almost ridiculed for something like that in a game

So passers, ala CC, weren't tolerated.
it was no different with Holly or Jollie,,,both of them frowned on showtime players
This is why Kim will be successful,,,,this is the first top-tier team to play this brand of basketball,,,and there are more CC's out there just waiting to be found

My golden rule on this subject was,,,
"if it ain't part of your practice,,,, it ain't part of your game"

One of the few exceptions to that "showy" passing being kinda frowned upon was ODU's Ticha Penicheiro. She dazzled at all levels of play.
 
#15
#15
If we interpreted "exceptional" to mean "efficient" (as opposed to "flashy"), the answer would be Dawn Marsh. By a wide margin.

She leads in both career totals (+250) and apg (+1) over the next nearest LV.
 
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#16
#16
Efficiency is skewed slightly by the supporting cast. If they aren't catching or finishing, the pass is invalidated.

Holly, Lawson, Bobbitt were all efficient. Michelle M up there as well.

Go Lady Vols.
 
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#17
#17
Re Dawn Marsh, during her four years I was fortunate to sit on the third row directly behind the bench. If/when she made a errant pass leading to a turn - over, without my needing to embellish she would glance at the Coach, wondering if she would soon be on the bench. I could call it subtle but an awareness.

At one of the alumni games some years later - she was a hs coach - I referenced my observation and she concurred of the importance of needing to have full-court vision. (smile)
 
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#18
#18
Efficiency is skewed slightly by the supporting cast. If they aren't catching or finishing, the pass is invalidated.

Holly, Lawson, Bobbitt were all efficient. Michelle M up there as well.

Go Lady Vols.

Kellie is in top ten, too. As you say, she benefited from her supporting cast.

I'm sure that some of our more athletic guards could have executed some stunningly flashy passes if they had been unleashed in a running offense with a premium placed on high-volume shooting.

Also, as you said, efficiency depends upon the recipient finishing. Likewise, the flashiest passes are inefficient if not delivered with accuracy, timing, precision, appropriate power tailored to teammates' skills, etc.

Joe Milton could impressively sling a football a mile, but that didn't mean he was the best passer.
 
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#20
#20
If we were to ever have a thread that asked who the TOUGHEST pg we ever had was, it would definitely be Kellie Jolly. She was also among the most deeply competitive.

I don’t think she gets enough credit for having come back, in less than 3 months, from a totally obliterated ACL injury to play late in the same season. Her going through hell and back to play again inspired her flailing teammates to greatness. When Kellie ran out onto the floor to play again, against all odds, her presence was the absolute difference-making toughness and mental focus that brought Tennessee the national championship.

Kellie would not be denied, and she absolutely willed that team to the championship.

If I live to be 300 I’ll never forget that, and never stop appreciating her sacrifice. What a competitor!!!!
 
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