War in Ukraine

#86,151
#86,151
Reading that Ukraine will agree to a 30 day ceasefire and we have resumed military aid and intelligence sharing in the meantime. Good first step if the Russians agree and both sides abide by it.
 
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#86,152
#86,152
lawgator1 said:
Reading that Ukraine will agree to a 30 day ceasefire and we have resumed military aid and intelligence sharing in the meantime. Good first step if the Russians agree and both sides abide by it.
Click to expand...

That has about as much chance of happening as Biden being able to find his way back home.

The longer and more Trump gets involved the more he owns it.
 
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#86,154
#86,154
Ritzwatch said:
This is fantastic news if it happens. Now, on to Russia....we will see....

Click to expand...


They've already said a crease fire with no real solution serves no purpose, so they would have to reverse their previous position which does nothing but allow the Ukrainians to reinforce. A crease fire with an agreement or pending agreement, sure, no agreement... that isn't going to probably happen and for obvious reasons.

The Ukraine would agree with it because it keeps the war going and they know the Russians would never agree to anyway.

https://www.reddit.com/media?url=https://i.redd.it/nvmygkca04oe1.jpeg
 
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#86,155
#86,155

Ukraine 'agrees to a 30-day Ceasefire' with Russia as Trump Lifts Pause on military aid and intelligence sharing​


Ukraine has agreed to a 30-day ceasefire with Russia as President Donald Trump lifts a pause on military aid and intelligence sharing to the country.

The agreement, under intense pressure from the U.S. side, now puts the ball in Moscow's court, Secretary of State Marco Rubio told reporters at the conclusion of a day of talks.

The Trump administration now plans to present the temporary ceasefire offer to Moscow, which has raised a series of demands including the removal of President Volodymyr Zelensky and a prohibition on Ukraine joining the NATO alliance for ending the war.

'We´re going to tell them this is what's on the table. Ukraine is ready to stop shooting and start talking. And now it'll be up to them to say yes or no,' Rubio said.

'Ukraine has agreed to it, and hopefully Russia will agree to it,' Trump said. He even indicated Zelensky was welcome back to the White House when asked.

It went on to say Trump and Zelensky agreed to 'conclude as soon as possible' an agreement on the minerals deal.

Witkoff is now planning a trip to Moscow, where he is set to face President Vladimir Putin's demands and could meet Putin – a turnaround from the diplomatic isolation Putin faced just weeks ago.

www.dailymail.co.uk

Ukraine 'agrees to 30-day ceasefire' with Russia as Trump lifts pause

Ukraine has agreed to a 30-day ceasefire with Russia as President Donald Trump lifts a pause on military aid and intelligence sharing to the country.
www.dailymail.co.uk www.dailymail.co.uk
 
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#86,157
#86,157
lawgator1 said:
He will deserve it if it sticks, not just 30 days off and then right back at it.
Click to expand...

He would deserve it even if the Russians agreed to 1 day of crease fire, the proposal makes zero sense which is why it was previously ruled out. The Russians will negotiate a solution but there is no reason in this instance to have a cease fire absent a solution.

7e1e4a85-1e43-43b1-9824-5ef2c1b5296d_text.gif


(I take it as a first step but this is still kind of a waste of time, parties can sit down and talk a real solution right now... no cease fire is needed)
 
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#86,158
#86,158
LSU-SIU said:
They've already said a crease fire with no real solution serves no purpose, so they would have to reverse their previous position which does nothing but allow the Ukrainians to reinforce. A crease fire with an agreement or pending agreement, sure, no agreement... that isn't going to probably happen and for obvious reasons.

The Ukraine would agree with it because it keeps the war going and they know the Russians would never agree to anyway.

https://www.reddit.com/media?url=https://i.redd.it/nvmygkca04oe1.jpeg
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Yes, like I said, on to Russia.....then let's see where we are. If the killing, spending and conquering (efforts) stop, FANTASTIC! Long way to go from here to there, but at least there is more hope than there was last week.

lawgator1 said:
He will deserve it if it sticks, not just 30 days off and then right back at it.
Click to expand...
I actually meant the prospect of peace/cease-fire - I hadn't even considered anything about Trump/the Nobel. I am not as enamored by that prize as others may be; I just want people killing people to stop, I don't care who gets the credit. (Pollyanna-ish though that may be.)
 
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#86,159
#86,159
lawgator1 said:
He will deserve it if it sticks, not just 30 days off and then right back at it.
Click to expand...

I wouldn't put any money on Putin holding to a ceasefire.

Institute for the Study of War

Some peace deals lead to peace, others to more war. The Minsk II deal aimed to end Russia’s limited invasion of Ukraine in 2015 but instead laid the groundwork for the full-scale Russian invasion in 2022. The United States must learn from the Minsk deal o
www.understandingwar.org www.understandingwar.org

 
#86,160
#86,160
Ritzwatch said:
Yes, like I said, on to Russia.....then let's see where we are. If the killing, spending and conquering (efforts) stop, FANTASTIC! Long way to go from here to there, but at least there is more hope than there was last week.
Click to expand...

I guess its a first step, but it just seems like a waste of time. At this rate, it will take parties about 2 decades to get an actual approved agreement. I mean why fly everyone to SA to talk about a 30 day cease fire that parties know won't be agreed upon?

https://www.reddit.com/r/UkraineRus.../ru_pov_lavrov_that_ceasefirepeacekeepers_in/
 
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#86,162
#86,162
LSU-SIU said:
I guess its a first step, but it just seems like a waste of time. At this rate, it will take parties about 2 decades to get an actual approved agreement. I mean why fly everyone to SA to talk about a 30 day cease fire that parties know won't be agreed upon?
Click to expand...


It is interesting to me that they have not been multilateral talks. I can imagine why, but that suggests an uphill battle looms.
 
#86,163
#86,163
BeardedVol said:
I wouldn't put any money on Putin holding to a ceasefire.

Institute for the Study of War

Some peace deals lead to peace, others to more war. The Minsk II deal aimed to end Russia’s limited invasion of Ukraine in 2015 but instead laid the groundwork for the full-scale Russian invasion in 2022. The United States must learn from the Minsk deal o
www.understandingwar.org www.understandingwar.org

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Why did we not send peace keepers into Ukraine when Russia started to build up troops on the border? Isn't that the whole idea of the UN crap?
 
#86,166
#86,166
Sandman 423 said:
Why did we not send peace keepers into Ukraine when Russia started to build up troops on the border? Isn't that the whole idea of the UN crap?
Click to expand...

We should have armed Ukraine to the teeth in November of 2021 when we knew without a doubt that Putin was planning to invade, instead of waiting for Putin to do so.
www.the-independent.com

US ‘warns Europe that Russia could invade Ukraine’, as troops mass near border

Biden administration concerned Moscow could make ‘serious mistake’
www.the-independent.com www.the-independent.com
 
#86,167
#86,167
lawgator1 said:
It is interesting to me that they have not been multilateral talks. I can imagine why, but that suggests an uphill battle looms.
Click to expand...

Because the Comedian has already laid conditions that are not realistic in nature, why have talks if one side is not being realistic and has pre-conditions to talking i.e. return of capture lands?

Of course, the Comedian will accept this because it does nothing but help the Ukrainians to rearm and time to build defenses. (They already know its will be rejected) I guess its a first step but it really isn't, the Russians should just say... if we are going to sit down and talk... let's just sit down and talk.
 
#86,168
#86,168
LSU-SIU said:
Because the Comedian has already laid conditions that are not realistic in nature, why have talks if one side is not being realistic and has pre-conditions to talking i.e. return of capture lands?

Of course, the Comedian will accept this because it does nothing but help the Ukrainians to rearm and time to build defenses. (They already know its will be rejected)
Click to expand...

Conditions like not bombing hospitals and apartment buildings?
 
#86,169
#86,169
LSU-SIU said:
Because the Comedian has already laid conditions that are not realistic in nature, why have talks if one side is not being realistic and has pre-conditions to talking i.e. return of capture lands?

Of course, the Comedian will accept this because it does nothing but help the Ukrainians to rearm and time to build defenses. (They already know its will be rejected)
Click to expand...
I guess we will find out how much the Trump card is worth.
 
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#86,170
#86,170
Sandman 423 said:
I guess we will find out how much the Trump card is worth.
Click to expand...

The only card that I see with the Russians is Trump could remove sanctions on them. Its all I got, that is the only card. The Ukrainians and Europeans really have no cards, not really.

This was 8 hours ago, the Russians know this is a long-term affair and it could take longer than 2029 (a new administration).
https://www.reddit.com/r/UkraineRus...dont_be_too_quick_to_believe_the_us/#lightbox

The longer Trump is involved, the more it becomes his **** show, imo. He should have just lost everyone's phone number.

The neocons setup up a doozy, no easy off-ramp... a good chance the Russians have to just keep going.
 
#86,172
#86,172
LSU-SIU said:
Because the Comedian has already laid conditions that are not realistic in nature, why have talks if one side is not being realistic and has pre-conditions to talking i.e. return of capture lands?

Of course, the Comedian will accept this because it does nothing but help the Ukrainians to rearm and time to build defenses. (They already know its will be rejected) I guess its a first step but it really isn't, the Russians should just say... if we are going to sit down and talk... let's just sit down and talk.
Click to expand...
the Russians have been just as unreasonable.

complete demilitarization of Ukraine?
Russian approved leaders?
Russia getting a right of refusal for any Ukrainian FP moving forward?
Partial or total occupation of Ukraine? with Russia having the ability to enforce its own laws in Ukraine?
One sided trade deals that exclude anyone outside of Russia?
 
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#86,175
#86,175
LouderVol said:
the Russians have been just as unreasonable.

complete demilitarization of Ukraine?
Russian approved leaders?
Russia getting a right of refusal for any Ukrainian FP moving forward?
Partial or total occupation of Ukraine? with Russia having the ability to enforce its own laws in Ukraine?
One sided trade deals that exclude anyone outside of Russia?
Click to expand...
I suspect some of that will change if the US gets a mineral deal and puts US civilian and commercial interests on the ground.

But at the end of the day, Ukraine is never getting that land back. They need to just take what is left and move on. It's mean, but reality.

And the west needs to stop trying to use Ukraine as a proxy at Russia's border. The US would be pissed too if Russia installed a proxy regime in MX or Canada and started arming up.
 
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