Recruiting Football Talk VIII

[TheRain]

 

[volsfan_17]

Love this coach! And....I want that hat!

 

[smokeyhuntsgators]

If you want to be surrounded by this braintrust of backwards folks

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My co worker that’s a UGA fan would fit right in with those idiots!!

 

[TrippieRedd]

Got bored so I went and put in every single player we’ve recruited since Heupel has been coach (2022-2025 classes so far) and wanted break it down by position. Yes I know Heupel was here in 21.

Average recruiting ranking by position group:
- QB: .935 (usually top 150 area)
- DL: .9145 (usually around the top 250 area)
- TE: .908(usually top 300 area)
- WR: .906 (usually top 300 area)
- OL: .8956 (usually around the 400 area)
- LB: .8933 (usually in the 400 area)
- RB: .89 (usually around the 450 area)
- Secondary: .8843 (usually in the 550 area)


This includes EVERY player that has committed to us via HS/Portal.

 

[tnvols72]

 

[Enki_Amenra]

I may be more of a UT baseball fan than basketball, at least as long as the baseball team is reigning natty champs. . .

 

[MarcoVol]

Ah yes, this was around the exact time the idiots on here were complaining about the pitching staff and talking about how we were gonna lose.

 

[Dobbs 4 Heisman]

Switch 2-3, and scrap the rest.

Valid point. It's tough to judge bigs vs guards. I just lean towards guards or the more skilled player because of the advantages in terms of free throw shooting late in games. There's a reason even during Shaq's prime the Lakers played through a 21 year old Kobe in late game situations.

 

[Dobbs 4 Heisman]

Oh, you best put Magic in there.

Uh, you forgot Magic Johnson.

I value defense as much as offense. It's why almost everyone on my top 6 were both elite offensive and defensive players. The thing about guys like Magic and Bird is they were not elite lock down defenders. Great offensive players but not difference makers on both sides of the court. Defense is 50% of the game. And if you're just another guy 50% of the game I can't rate you above guys who are difference makers 100% of the game.

 

[Dobbs 4 Heisman]

I just figured based on your previous reasoning that you’d be a LeBron guy

Just admit you like Josh Allen and don’t like Mahomes. That’s all it is.

Nope. I'm a eye test guy. I like Allen because he passes the eye test more than Mahomes. I think he's accomplished stuff at a higher degree of difficulty than Mahomes. It's a tough thing to put a metric on but it's what I believe based on what I've seen.

It's also why I have Aaron Rodgers ahead of Brady despite the huge difference in rings between the two. My eyes won't allow me to rate Brady above Rodgers despite all the winning because when I watched Rodgers play in his prime he was like nobody else while Brady was a dink and dunk machine.

 

[SugarCC]

I value defense as much as offense. It's why almost everyone on my top 6 were both elite offensive and defensive players. The thing about guys like Magic and Bird is they were not elite lock down defenders. Great offensive players but not difference makers on both sides of the court. Defense is 50% of the game. And if you're just another guy 50% of the game I can't rate you above guys who are difference makers 100% of the game.

Bird made the NBA All-Defensive team 3 different times.

And you expect people to take you seriously??

 

[Dobbs 4 Heisman]

You don’t have Bird,Johnson or Russell in there. Your first 3 I agree, after that you lost me.

Offense and Defense matter equally to me. Bird and Magic weren't elite defenders and Russell wasn't an elite offensive player. I won't neglect 50% of the game because someone is really good at the other 50%. Especially when there are others who were elite for 100% of the game.

I have guys like Scottie Pippen and Kevin Garnett in my top 20 for that very reason. They're two of the best defensive players in history and they gave you more on offense than all but the most elite offensive players in history.

You can't neglect defense when rankings NBA players. It's 50% of the game.

 

[Dobbs 4 Heisman]

LeBron at five is insane.

There is no rational objective opinion that puts him no less than 2.

Jokic is also probably the best center of all time already. Bird should be on that list and Kobe is better than Magic yall.

I'm not ranking guys based on how good they were at filling up the stat sheet. Jokic is an embarrassment defensively. His lack of defense is one of the main reasons why the Nuggets aren't an elite team in the league right now despite his otherworldly offensive numbers. Defense is 50% of the game. You can't just neglect it because it isn't as easily tracked as offensive production.

With regard to LeBron, he's only considered #2 all-time based on longevity. Similar to how Kareem used to get ranked. I don't care about longevity when rating players. I'm going by peak ability. How good were you when you were at your best. And I think Kobe Bryant at his best was a better basketball player than LeBron. Comparing bigs to perimeter players is difficult so ranking Wilt and Hakeem above LeBron is more about taste on my part for their games.

 

[SugarCC]

Whenever the greatest basketball players conversation tunes up...if Larry Bird is not in, at least, your top 5...well, I stop listening to anything after that.

 

[Dobbs 4 Heisman]

Bird made the NBA All-Defensive team 3 different times.

And you expect people to take you seriously??

That's why he's in my 7-12 range and above Magic in my all-time rankings. I never said Bird was a bad defender like say Jokic right now. I just said he wasn't elite. And 3 defensive selections is nice but lacking compared to the likes of Jordan, Kobe, and even LeBron.

I love Bird. Think he's become super underrated with time. But he's not above those 6 in my eyes because they impacted the guy slightly more on both ends of the court. FTR Shaq also made only 3 all-defensive teams but he's a big and bigs are more impactful defensively than perimeter player. He was also more dominant offensively in my eyes.

It's not a slight to say Bird isn't top 6. If I said he had no argument for being top 10. That would be a slight. But rating Jordan, Kobe, Wilt, Hakeem, LeBron, and Shaq ahead of him isn't insulting.

 

[***RoadVol***]

Do any of you have a pit bull? Do they just want to lay right on top of you wherever you are?

Yes and yes

 

[Enki_Amenra]

Yes and yes

 

[DD4ME]

Reminds me of Popeyes chicken sandwich. They had a huge pop from a social media mistake by chick Fila, and they leveraged that to sell a ton of new franchises....most of which are losing money now that the Popeyes flash in the pan has passed.

What hurt Popeyes is they can never deliver timely service or consistent food. Lol the only fast food I have known people to wait an hour for. That is unsustainable.

 

[DD4ME]

Do any of you have a pit bull? Do they just want to lay right on top of you wherever you are?

I have a mutt with some pitt in it and they are comically clingy. Mine is attached to my wife like that third boob we joked about. (*)(pb)(*)

For a tough breed they are delicate souls too. I can only imagine what a pure bred is like.

 

[OGbabyaviVol]

How can you not love this dude?! He is a treasure. We are lucky to have him. Sounds like it would take a whole lot to pull him away from TN. Maybe a MLB position would be only thing that could do it.

 

[Devo182]

Career advice needed:

I'm internally applying for a position (vertical promotion).

I'm in finance, so I have access to salary pay documents. I know exactly what the last 2 folks in the position would be getting bumped up to for 2025.

My question is - should I be asking for that level of pay...or is it better to overshoot and let them drop down to that level potentially (or just get paid more than prior folks)? OR might I end up shooting myself in the foot vs a lowballing candidate asking significantly less?

There's no easy answer I suppose, but hoping someone has had an experience in this situation.

 

[TrippieRedd]

How can you not love this dude?! He is a treasure. We are lucky to have him. Sounds like it would take a whole lot to pull him away from TN. Maybe a MLB position would be only thing that could do it.

Lucky for us Tony doesn’t seem like the type thst would mesh well in the MLB.

He’s definitely a kids coach rather than dealing with divas.

 

[BigOrangeTrain]

Got bored so I went and put in every single player we’ve recruited since Heupel has been coach (2022-2025 classes so far) and wanted break it down by position. Yes I know Heupel was here in 21.

Average recruiting ranking by position group:
- QB: .935 (usually top 150 area)
- DL: .9145 (usually around the top 250 area)
- TE: .908(usually top 300 area)
- WR: .906 (usually top 300 area)
- OL: .8956 (usually around the 400 area)
- LB: .8933 (usually in the 400 area)
- RB: .89 (usually around the 450 area)
- Secondary: .8843 (usually in the 550 area)


This includes EVERY player that has committed to us via HS/Portal.

This shows that QB ain’t all it. So those who say well only if our QB play was better blah, blah, blah. The OL fruiting is woefully behind the QB recruiting.

 

[BigOrangeTrain]

How can you not love this dude?! He is a treasure. We are lucky to have him. Sounds like it would take a whole lot to pull him away from TN. Maybe a MLB position would be only thing that could do it.

I know Arkansas fans were cocky after we win the NC that they were gonna swoop in and take Tony V away. They bragged about the Walmart and Tyson chicken money.

Love Tony V. I hope he is here for a long time.

 

[vol9799]

Career advice needed:

I'm internally applying for a position (vertical promotion).

I'm in finance, so I have access to salary pay documents. I know exactly what the last 2 folks in the position would be getting bumped up to for 2025.

My question is - should I be asking for that level of pay...or is it better to overshoot and let them drop down to that level potentially (or just get paid more than prior folks)? OR might I end up shooting myself in the foot vs a lowballing candidate asking significantly less?

There's no easy answer I suppose, but hoping someone has had an experience in this situation.

My advice, having been on both sides, is to triangulate where they would be, what the market avg is for that position, and what % increase it would represent for you currently.
Internal candidates are sometimes hindered by the whole % increase negotiating tactic from their company, but knowing where the external market is gives you the ability to counter that (assuming the market supports what you want).
As for negotiating tactics, as long as you aren't unreasonably high and provided you feel good about your value, I wouldn't go low out of fear of a lowball. Other strong candidates will know their worth as well and aren't likely to give the company a materially cheaper option.
jmho