Gun control debate (merged)

#19,877
#19,877
luthervol said:
In 1955 there were 560,000 people detained in mental health facilities when the total US population was 171.7 million, (3.6 per thousand) That same ratio today would see 1,085,000 people housed in mental health facilities.
Click to expand...

Mail order firearms weren’t banned until 1968 and from his post.

By the mid-1960s in the U.S., many severely mentally ill people had been moved from psychiatric institutions to local mental health homes or similar facilities. The number of institutionalized mentally ill patients fell from its peak of 560,000 in the 1950s to 130,000 by 1980.”
Click to expand...

Even through the 1980s it was easier to by a firearm than it is now.
 
  • Like
Reactions: GroverCleveland
#19,878
#19,878
hog88 said:
Mail order firearms weren’t banned until 1968 and from his post.



Even through the 1980s it was easier to by a firearm than it is now.
Click to expand...
That ratio from the 80's would still be equivalent to 300,000 today.
What are we even debating? I got distracted.
Bottom line is we have far more mentally ill people walking the streets and far more guns in circulation.
I don't think those two facts are even debatable.

I will add that a mentally ill person today has a much higher likelihood of going on a shooting rampage than did the exact same type of mentally ill person 50 years ago.
 
Last edited:
#19,880
#19,880
OHvol40 said:
For the average person, which one would be easiest? Read about, practice at, experiment with, and then successfully execute making a home made bomb… or buy a gun and some ammo and start shooting people?
Click to expand...
Ban guns. Problem solved.
 
#19,883
#19,883
OHvol40 said:
Anyone who was slightly bothersome could be “committed” indefinitely by their family. No treatment, no diagnosis, just locked up. That was a big part of it.
Click to expand...
The peak was 560,000 institutionalized. I doubt many of these shooters are bad enough to be institutionalized. Usually they were patients who literally couldnt operate in the open world. These shooters are usually fairly normal, in their ability to live in society, until they start shooting. It would only be the ones who a history of violence that got locked away.

A Brief History of Mental Illness and the U.S. Mental Health Care System
 
#19,884
#19,884
luthervol said:
We do have a gun problem.
Click to expand...

You can keep saying it but it won’t change a hard fact .. guns don’t kill people , a stick laying in your yard will never jump up in the air and beat you until you give it money . We have a people problem . Change minds of the people and you won’t have to worry about the tools they use .
 
  • Like
Reactions: InVOLuntary, SlipKidVol and mr.checkerboards
#19,885
#19,885
0nelilreb said:
You can keep saying it but it won’t change a hard fact .. guns don’t kill people , a stick laying in your yard will never jump up in the air and beat you until you give it money . We have a people problem . Change minds of the people and you won’t have to worry about the tools they use .
Click to expand...
That's just such a ridiculous argument. I think it has been universally accepted since Adam and Eve (for the believers out there) that there has always been and will always be people problems. That's simply a function of humanity.
The next level is looking at reasons why there are people problems and trying to take steps to make them as few and harmless as possible. Part of that process is looking at the tools which problem people use to harm others. Society must weigh the positives those tools bring to society against the negatives and make rational and reasonable choices as to how best to keep the positives while reducing the negatives.
 
#19,888
#19,888
luthervol said:
That ratio from the 80's would still be equivalent to 300,000 today.
What are we even debating? I got distracted.
Bottom line is we have far more mentally ill people walking the streets and far more guns in circulation.
I don't think those two facts are even debatable.

I will add that a mentally ill person today has a much higher likelihood of going on a shooting rampage than did the exact same type of mentally ill person 50 years ago.
Click to expand...

I am saying that it was even easier to obtain a firearm in the 70s through mid 90s than it is today and there wasn't regular mass shootings by the mentally ill. The numbers from OHvol's post prove this.
 
#19,890
#19,890
0nelilreb said:
You can keep saying it but it won’t change a hard fact .. guns don’t kill people , a stick laying in your yard will never jump up in the air and beat you until you give it money . We have a people problem . Change minds of the people and you won’t have to worry about the tools they use .
Click to expand...

We have also have a much higher percentage of gun ownership in the past without the rise in mass murder events.
 
  • Like
Reactions: InVOLuntary
#19,891
#19,891
hog88 said:
I am saying that it was even easier to obtain a firearm in the 70s through mid 90s than it is today and there wasn't regular mass shootings by the mentally ill. The numbers from OHvol's post prove this.
Click to expand...
I said that a mentally ill person today has a much higher likelihood of going on a shooting rampage than did a similar mentally ill person 40 years ago.
 
#19,892
#19,892
luthervol said:
That's just such a ridiculous argument. I think it has been universally accepted since Adam and Eve (for the believers out there) that there has always been and will always be people problems. That's simply a function of humanity.
The next level is looking at reasons why there are people problems and trying to take steps to make them as few and harmless as possible. Part of that process is looking at the tools which problem people use to harm others. Society must weigh the positives those tools bring to society against the negatives and make rational and reasonable choices as to how best to keep the positives while reducing the negatives.
Click to expand...

False. The only thing to do is look at why theses particular people are a problem.
 
  • Like
Reactions: InVOLuntary
#19,896
#19,896
hog88 said:
That we agree on. Now lets research the why to that and not punish the law abiding for it.
Click to expand...
There are a number of reasons why and no one is for punishing law abiding citizens but they are for making the environment safer for law abiding citizens. Maybe a slight inconvenience for the common good.....but isn't that what society is all about.
 
#19,897
#19,897
luthervol said:
That's just such a ridiculous argument. I think it has been universally accepted since Adam and Eve (for the believers out there) that there has always been and will always be people problems. That's simply a function of humanity.
The next level is looking at reasons why there are people problems and trying to take steps to make them as few and harmless as possible. Part of that process is looking at the tools which problem people use to harm others. Society must weigh the positives those tools bring to society against the negatives and make rational and reasonable choices as to how best to keep the positives while reducing the negatives.
Click to expand...

So you are saying god should have just made all the jaw bones disappear so Cain wouldn’t be tempted to kill anymore of his family ? You are ridiculous.
 
#19,900
#19,900
luthervol said:
There are a number of reasons why and no one is for punishing law abiding citizens but they are for making the environment safer for law abiding citizens. Maybe a slight inconvenience for the common good.....but isn't that what society is all about.
Click to expand...

If more restrictive gun legislation makes law abiding citizens safer why are they being killed in mass shooting events more now than when access to guns was easier?
 
  • Like
Reactions: UT_Dutchman and LouderVol
New posts
You must log in or register to reply here.
Advertisement





Back
Top