War in Ukraine

#22,153
#22,153
Rasputin_Vol said:
Have I been shy about saying that I hold the US to a higher standard? Of course it is a double standard... if you choose to call it hypocrisy, so be it. But what you can't do is say that I'm lying and not making sound arguments based on the dire conditions this country is in. Desperate times call for desperate measures. This country doesn't have much more time to get its s^^t together.
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Calling for doctors and nurses to be executed and calling all police oathbreakers and such isn’t “desperate measures”. You get yourself worked up so much over BS and conspiracy gobbledygook that you hate literally ever important pillar of American society. You are a kook who gets your “information” from echo chambers and proven bS sources. Then you top it off with a lack of understanding about law, healthcare, politics, business or literally any other topic to promote your anti capitalist anti American BS
 
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#22,155
#22,155
WoodsmanVol said:
Well, you see, like everyone else, I have opinions about what I see and hear. Opinions aren't facts, though they can be based on facts. And since opinions fall into the realm of being personal, I'm free to have them and at times profess them. And I accept there will always be some folks who get bent out of shape because opinions, mine or anyone else's, are at odds with their own opinions. Some others folks have the ability to just say, I disagree with you and let it go at that, or tell why they disagree. You, be all civilized about it instead of waging a verbal or literal war. BTW, I have an opinion that the arms race didn't start at the end of WWI due to nuclear weaponry, but rather began long before that with the invention of the machine gun. Now, let's see where this goes.
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Well, sure, but you'd also acknowledge there are sound and unsound opinions. Your example could be taken even further, that an arms race began once bipeds actually began to pick up stuff and swing them at the end of their arms; that's a logical progression, and benefitted by hindsight. If I say we have a black hole weapon capable of sucking Russia out of the middle of the continent never to be seen again, wouldn't you think that outlandish without substantiation?

We've been treated to Trump the Traitor nonsense for 6 years now; it's going to draw a reaction.
 
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#22,156
#22,156
NCFisher said:
I don't block people.

But c'mon, man, what remotely rational basis persuades you to opine he's selling state secrets and behind government/corporate espionage?
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Well, you see, like everyone else, I have opinions about what I see and hear. Opinions aren't facts, though they can be based on facts. And since opinions fall into the realm of being personal, I'm free to have them and at times profess them. And I accept there will always be some folks who get bent out of shape because opinions, mine or anyone else's, are at odds with their own opinions. Some other folks have the ability to just say, I disagree with you and let it go at that, or tell why they disagree. You know, be all civilized about it instead of just throwing out *insults, waging a verbal or literal war. BTW, I have an opinion that the arms race didn't start at the end of WWI due to nuclear weaponry, but rather began long before that with the invention of the machine gun. Now, let's see where this goes.


*Like IGNORED Rickyvol77's yes men.
 
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#22,157
#22,157
Gandalf said:
While I surely have sympathy for the complete Realpolitik approach, I would desire to leave room for America to be the shining city on a hill. To be "the good" however, first requires that one must be "the wise", for tender hearts must be directed by wise heads. What has too long been the norm, is that selfish, evil heads have manipulated the tender hearts and idle hands for their own mischief-making - and that has led to our misfortune.

"Behold, I send you forth as sheep in the midst of wolves. Be ye therefore wise as serpents and harmless as doves (Matthew 10:16, KJV)."
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We can take my approach and still be that "shining city on the hill" but without massive debt and taxpayers money being wasted. Yeah, I know fantasy on my part but so is the whole "shining city on the hill" idea.
 
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#22,158
#22,158
Rasputin_Vol said:
Maybe some of us need to suffer and learn to appreciate what freedom is. Hell, most people were asleep before COVID, but now you have all of these school board meetings where parents are finally getting involved and you now have some long time liberals sounding like true civil libertarians. Pain and suffering might be the only thing to wake some of you people up.
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I am a bit lost, here. You didn't answer the question. You're having a lot of convos at once, so let's review how you and I got here.
- a reason you admire Putin is his vocal stance against counter culture.
- this is is an important issue.
- important enough the "ends justify the means".
So, does that include extermination of those participating in and promoting counter culture? Suffering =/= extermination.
 
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#22,159
#22,159
Septic said:
It's odd that John Adams as POTUS ratified the Treaty of Tripoli by his signature that stated: "the Government of the United States of America is not, in any sense, founded on the Christian religion."

it's almost like politicians, even founding fathers, will say whatever they need to say to the audience that they're standing in front of.
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The Adams quote doesn't mention Christianity.
 
#22,160
#22,160
Rasputin_Vol said:
I saw that sentence, but what followed sounded more like the same exploitative things we've done since the 1950s. Again, I'm no fan of the Chinese and their domestic policies and their control of a lot of our politicians, but I think their Belt and Road has a bit more mutually beneficial trade going on than exploitation.

If I mischaracterized your comment, my apologies.
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The Chinese belt and road scheme is complete exploitation. They are not investing in these countries out of the goodness of their hearts, they fully expect to get something in return and we need to take a lesson from them.
 
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#22,162
#22,162
Gandalf said:
While I surely have sympathy for the complete Realpolitik approach, I would desire to leave room for America to be the shining city on a hill. To be "the good" however, first requires that one must be "the wise", for tender hearts must be directed by wise heads. What has too long been the norm, is that selfish, evil heads have manipulated the tender hearts and idle hands for their own mischief-making - and that has led to our misfortune.

"Behold, I send you forth as sheep in the midst of wolves. Be ye therefore wise as serpents and harmless as doves (Matthew 10:16, KJV)."
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That is a well written post. Almost poetic.

America cannot pour from an empty cup. To be the shining city for others, we need to be a shining city for ourselves. I cannot say we do that.
 
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#22,163
#22,163
Rasputin_Vol said:
Where is this same energy when the US is doing the exploiting and war making?
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I’m not defending the US doing it either. But I’m also NOT the one dismissing an invasion against a sovereign country, killing innocent people as justified and actively cheering for Putin to “beat the West”
 
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#22,164
#22,164
Rickyvol77 said:
Ignore a sovereign country’s wishes for self determination?
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For the last time, this isn't about self-determination because both the US and Russia are heavily involved there. Why Russia is involved is completely understandable since they share a border and a long history. The question is why does the US care so much? What does a regional dispute in Eastern Europe have to do with America?
 
#22,165
#22,165
Rasputin_Vol said:
For the last time, this isn't about self-determination because both the US and Russia are heavily involved there. Why Russia is involved is completely understandable since they share a border and a long history. The question is why does the US care so much? What does a regional dispute in Eastern Europe have to do with America?
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For the last time both Russia and the US have interfered yes I get that. But only one invaded a sovereign country’s borders and started killing innocent people here. There is no legitimate reason for Russia’s “de nazification” invasion and the fact you continue to cover for a fascist anti freedom violent dictator as well as admittedly actively cheering for him to “beat the West” shows who and what you really are
 
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#22,167
#22,167
NCFisher said:
Well, sure, but you'd also acknowledge there are sound and unsound opinions. Your example could be taken even further, that an arms race began once bipeds actually began to pick up stuff and swing them at the end of their arms; that's a logical progression, and benefitted by hindsight. If I say we have a black hole weapon capable of sucking Russia out of the middle of the continent never to be seen again, wouldn't you think that outlandish without substantiation?
We've been treated to Trump the Traitor nonsense for 6 years now; it's going to draw a reaction.
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I acknowledge what is true, whether about myself or anyone else. You're welcome. I should have said the arms race in the modern sense, but OK, sticks and stones kicked it off if "the modern sense" is ignored. Regarding Trump, what you call nonsense isn't in my view. And he brought it on himself with all the documented lies, bigotry, and bragging about a lot of it. You LOVE the man, I don't, but oddly, I don't hate him either. I actually pity him because both karma and God have a way of penalizing the unrepentant evil-doers. And like the one-third who followed Lucifer, they'll get their reward in the end, though I don't rejoice in this as it'd make me thrice as bad as them both. Meanwhile:
rock-on-smiley-emoticon.gif
 
#22,170
#22,170
Rickyvol77 said:
Calling for doctors and nurses to be executed and calling all police oathbreakers and such isn’t “desperate measures”. You get yourself worked up so much over BS and conspiracy gobbledygook that you hate literally ever important pillar of American society. You are a kook who gets your “information” from echo chambers and proven bS sources. Then you top it off with a lack of understanding about law, healthcare, politics, business or literally any other topic to promote your anti capitalist anti American BS
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The doctors, medical professionals and bureaucrats that were knowingly withholding care to people based on their vaccination status do not deserve anyone's pity. They deserve to burn in hell.
 
#22,171
#22,171
Rasputin_Vol said:
For the last time, this isn't about self-determination because both the US and Russia are heavily involved there. Why Russia is involved is completely understandable since they share a border and a long history. The question is why does the US care so much? What does a regional dispute in Eastern Europe have to do with America?
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When you and I first discussed this topic, you agreed Ukraine had the right to defend itself from Russia. Did your opinion change as you digested more information?
Also, Russian and American involvement in Ukraine does not preclude them from determining they don't want Russia invading.
 
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#22,173
#22,173
Rasputin_Vol said:
You are naive if you think the present system can be fixed at this point.
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Ok comrade Ivandjiiski. Better just drink your poison now and end it all before the West’s politicians, doctors, lawyers, business CEOs, police and army and all your other “enemies” come to your house to track you down and vaxx you 😂😂😂 But don’t forget to keep lapping it up for an actual KGB guy who not only killed innocent civilians, he curtailed actual personal freedoms and you have said you support him and root for him vs the West
 
#22,174
#22,174
McDad said:
When you and I first discussed this topic, you agreed Ukraine had the right to defend itself from Russia. Did your opinion change as you digested more information?
Also, Russian and American involvement in Ukraine does not preclude them from determining they don't want Russia invading.
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Remember when ZeroHedge told him Russia wasn’t invading so he said it wouldn’t happen then switched it to “the west tricked Putin into it” 😂😂😂😂
 
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#22,175
#22,175
Rickyvol77 said:
For the last time both Russia and the US have interfered yes I get that. But only one invaded a sovereign country’s borders and started killing innocent people here. There is no legitimate reason for Russia’s “de nazification” invasion and the fact you continue to cover for a fascist anti freedom violent dictator as well as admittedly actively cheering for him to “beat the West” shows who and what you really are
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He can’t distinguish between a customer checking out at the cash register with a cashier, and a person pointing a gun at the cashier.

Except of course, the gun holder is a hero.
 
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