War in Ukraine

#20,002
#20,002
Rasputin_Vol said:
Then explain why they didn't grab Kazakhstan 2 months ago?
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They have the demographic time bomb there just as the Kremlin has in other post-Soviet states if they chose to use it. I find it smart that Stalin and other Soviet leaders placed sizable Russian minority groups in the non-Russian republics of the USSR. I'm sure it was by design so that if the USSR ever broke up the future Russian nation could use those minorities as weapons to encroach upon the newly independent countries under the guise of "Protecting Russian speakers" when needed.
 
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#20,003
#20,003
Rasputin_Vol said:
You are not looking at the fact that the Russians had protested NATO expansion since 1991 and the west had made assurances to them that they were not going to expand east. Then, in 1999, you had the first expansion of NATO that broke that promise with the Visegrad group countries. Then later the Baltics and Poland.

At the time of this interview, Georgia was being led by a snake and western puppet named Mikhail Saakashvili. This guy was planted into Georgia for the purpose of bringing that country into the fold next. By this time, this is When Putin expressed his concerns for the last time before acting on it in 2008. Then in 2013, the US State Department set their eyes on Ukraine. At the time of that interview, Ukraine wasn't a target for Russia, but it was clearly a target for the US.

Nothing Putin said in that interview was duplicitous or erroneous. At the time, he was more focused on Georgia and likely felt that if he made his move in Georgia that the US and NATO would back off. Obviously, that wasn't the case.

And interesting thing about that snake Saakashvili, after he left Georgia, he ended up somehow working in the Ukrainian govt for a while. The guy is an American asset and a troublemaker.

Lastly, the Nazis in Ukraine have been there for over 80 years... they just didn't show up in 2014. But the US did start funding them in an effort to be a subversive force in Ukraine.
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Nazis in the Ukraine for 80 years? Man they must be getting old by now. Even if they were only 20 at the end of WWII, they must be pushing 100 now. Don’t sound very threatening to me 😁
 
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#20,011
#20,011
apevol said:
All these regions seeded with expatriated "ethnic russians" just happen to start having independence movements when its the right time, don't you think?

He stated Crimea was not a target and there was no ethnic conflict in Ukraine, unlike Georgia.

Five years later and the CIA has Ukrainian nazis committing genocide? Come on. These places had thousands of influential people sent to exile, worked to death, imprisoned specifically so the kremlin could replace them and create long term ties working to maintain sway over the locals. They were all primed for this to happen.
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Actually Abkhazia is mostly ethnic Abkhaz people. Apparently, Georgians and Abkhazians do not like one another. Not certain where the origins of that tension comes from.

South Ossetia is very small in population. A little over 50,000 live in that region. Mostly Ossetian people. Another separate and distinct ethnic group. Most Ossetians live in the North Ossetia-Alania which is a republic of Russia. South Ossetia along with Abkhazia have small ethnic Russian populations.
 
#20,016
#20,016
Rasputin_Vol said:
I have no idea. Who said it and what was the context?
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Mikhail Gorbachev.

We now have a very authoritative voice from Moscow confirming this understanding. Russia behind the Headlines has published an
interview with Gorbachev, who was Soviet president during the discussions and treaty negotiations concerning German reunification. The interviewer asked why Gorbachev did not “insist that the promises made to you [Gorbachev]—particularly U.S. Secretary of State James Baker’s promise that NATO would not expand into the East—be legally encoded?” Gorbachev replied: “The topic of ‘NATO expansion’ was not discussed at all, and it wasn’t brought up in those years. … Another issue we brought up was discussed: making sure that NATO’s military structures would not advance and that additional armed forces would not be deployed on the territory of the then-GDR after German reunification. Baker’s statement was made in that context… Everything that could have been and needed to be done to solidify that political obligation was done. And fulfilled.”

Gorbachev continued that “The agreement on a final settlement with Germany said that no new military structures would be created in the eastern part of the country; no additional troops would be deployed; no weapons of mass destruction would be placed there. It has been obeyed all these years.” To be sure, the former Soviet president criticized NATO enlargement and called it a violation of the spirit of the assurances given Moscow in 1990, but he made clear there was no promise regarding broader enlargement.
 
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#20,017
#20,017
BigOrangeTrain said:
Boy you just do not want to blame Biden for anything huh? He has zero accountability right? Let me guess, it’s Trumps fault right?
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I know nothing of luthervol's politics, religion, or whether he prefers Stubb's BBQ sauce or Memphis dry rub on his meat. But I know when it comes to politics, nobody is clean. As for Trump, he gutted our cybersecurity offices, which opened the door wide for Russian, Chinese, and North Korean hackers to breach our federal agencies' computers. The alarm was raised even before he disowned our intelligence community in favor of Russia's. As for Biden, I fear he may prove too timid to act decisively when the USA needs it the most. That would prove to be just as bad as Trump's open invite to Puddin's and Ix's cyberattacks on the nation.
 
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#20,018
#20,018
WoodsmanVol said:
I know nothing of luthervol's politics, religion, or whether he prefers Stubb's BBQ sauce or Memphis dry rub on his meat. But I know when it comes to politics, nobody is clean. As for Trump, he gutted our cybersecurity offices, which opened the door wide for Russian, Chinese, and North Korean hackers to breach our federal agencies' computers. The alarm was raised even before he disowned our intelligence community in favor of Russia's. As for Biden, I fear he may prove too timid to act decisively when the USA needs it the most. That would prove to be just as bad as Trump's open invite to Puddin's and Ix's cyberattacks on the nation.
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Never said Trump was clean but Democrats blamed Trump for everything for 4 years. They blamed nothing on Obama. Now they are blaming all kinds of things on Trump. What’s good for the goose is good for the gander. Biden is in charge so it’s his baby. His fault. That’s the way they played it, now they are getting a dose of their own medicine and cannot handle it.

Luther thinks Trump is the most evil human on the planet and was a terrible president. All of that is fine. He blames virtually everything on Trump yet blames nothing on Biden and Obama.
 
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#20,019
#20,019
BigOrangeTrain said:
Um no. You along with others blamed Trump for everything for 4 years. You complete absolved the great divider Obama from any wrong doing. Sorry now that your guy is in charge, it’s his fault.
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Oh I agree, to the same degree as Trump is to blame for COVID.
 
#20,021
#20,021
BigOrangeTrain said:
Never said Trump was clean but Democrats blamed Trump for everything for 4 years. They blamed nothing on Obama. Now they are blaming all kinds of things on Trump. What’s good for the goose is good for the gander. Biden is in charge so it’s his baby. His fault. That’s the way they played it, now they are getting a dose of their own medicine and cannot handle it.

Luther thinks Trump is the most evil human on the planet and was a terrible president. All of that is fine. He blames virtually everything on Trump yet blames nothing on Biden and Obama.
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Well, if it matters, I think all politicians are evil. They tell different factions of people different lies, the same lies when convenient, then privately laugh at us all for being gullible sheeple.
The more you observe politics, the more you realize that each party is as bad as the other. -Will Rogers-
 
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#20,023
#20,023
Burhead said:
They have the demographic time bomb there just as the Kremlin has in other post-Soviet states if they chose to use it. I find it smart that Stalin and other Soviet leaders placed sizable Russian minority groups in the non-Russian republics of the USSR. I'm sure it was by design so that if the USSR ever broke up the future Russian nation could use those minorities as weapons to encroach upon the newly independent countries under the guise of "Protecting Russian speakers" when needed.
Click to expand...
I doubt very seriously they were game planning for the downfall and then resurrection over 30 years later. It think they did that for more immediate reasons at the time. If there was really a Soviet plan to do what you are suggesting, it makes no sense then for the Russian Federation (not the Soviets) to wait until now to pull the trigger on that plan.

I think you are reaching.
 
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#20,024
#20,024
KB5252 said:
I already covered this. If they are intent on incorporating some of their former borders west and the baltics would come first, they could turn their attention south later.
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Kazakhstan would be just as important as any of those because it is a gateway between central Asia and the Russian border. Jihadists could easily use Kazakhstan as a staging ground for terrorist acts... and you know the US has a history of funding them in the Middle East.

Not only the security risks that Kazakhstan presented, but it is also a rather significant energy producer.
 
#20,025
#20,025
apevol said:
Mikhail Gorbachev.

We now have a very authoritative voice from Moscow confirming this understanding. Russia behind the Headlines has published an
interview with Gorbachev, who was Soviet president during the discussions and treaty negotiations concerning German reunification. The interviewer asked why Gorbachev did not “insist that the promises made to you [Gorbachev]—particularly U.S. Secretary of State James Baker’s promise that NATO would not expand into the East—be legally encoded?” Gorbachev replied: “The topic of ‘NATO expansion’ was not discussed at all, and it wasn’t brought up in those years. … Another issue we brought up was discussed: making sure that NATO’s military structures would not advance and that additional armed forces would not be deployed on the territory of the then-GDR after German reunification. Baker’s statement was made in that context… Everything that could have been and needed to be done to solidify that political obligation was done. And fulfilled.”

Gorbachev continued that “The agreement on a final settlement with Germany said that no new military structures would be created in the eastern part of the country; no additional troops would be deployed; no weapons of mass destruction would be placed there. It has been obeyed all these years.” To be sure, the former Soviet president criticized NATO enlargement and called it a violation of the spirit of the assurances given Moscow in 1990, but he made clear there was no promise regarding broader enlargement.
Click to expand...
I would love to get a link to that story.
 
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