Vaccine or not?

Which one is more important to you? The right for people to make their own medical decisions OR a business mandating people make medical decisions?
Like I've said, its not an either/or choice for me. If I do a mandate, I'd have a weekly testing opt-out. But like I told ND40 yesterday, the state has no reason to step in and tell me I can't do it just to play chicken with the feds. If comes down to it, I'll take my right to employee who I choose.
 
Like I've said, its not an either/or choice for me. If I do a mandate, I'd have a weekly testing opt-out. But like I told ND40 yesterday, the state has no reason to step in and tell me I can't do it just to play chicken with the feds. If comes down to it, I'll take my right to employee who I choose.
So in other words you are okay with private business trying to enforce medical decisions upon employees?
 
Never have been an employee of a large corporation but two of our biggest clients are the largest package delivery companies in the world, used to have a good chunk of WalMart (thank goodness we lost that) and several other national name brands so I do have some experience navigating those waters.

Any corporate tyranny can only exist with government approval and help.
You keep saying this, but you haven't proven it. Let's say we're in an anarchic system with no government. You think the first company that wins the race would just tend towards doing things like buying up threats and enlarging itself to the point where it would just become, essentially, a ruling government?
 
It's funny how all these "choices" work. Those of us who have needed masking and social distancing to be practiced in our places of employment, grocery stores, etc., so that we wouldn't bring COVID home to vulnerable members of our families? Many who are currently so exercised by the plight of those who have run afoul of vaccination requirements explained to us repeatedly that we had the "choice" of just staying home (or 'hiding in our homes, if we were so afraid of a virus,' as it was usually phrased). Funny how that "choice" isn't still on the table, now that the shoe's on the other foot . . .

For the record, I'm a supporter of robust conscience protections, and, like you, I wish for fair and reasonable accommodations to be extended to those who (whether for the sake of conscience or because of fear) are unwilling to comply with their employer's vaccination policy (or the policy imposed upon their employer by the federal government). I confess, though, that I find it difficult to muster much sympathy for those particular individuals who have exhibited so little sympathy for the vulnerable.
I hadn't thought about it that way, but a lot of the, "if you're susceptible, stay home and let me pretend covid isn't real" crowd sure are looking for sympathy now.
 
A couple of questions for you.

Are you for vaccine mandates or not?

Also, what's more important to you? Personal freedom to choose whether or not to be vaccinated? Or a private business being able to mandate vaccinations and choosing to fire people who don't want to get vaccinated?
So even though you might think CV and I are at odds we really aren’t and I’d say he supports an individual’s right of choice here. He just wants the same choice in how he’s running his business and I don’t blame him. He’s rightly pissed that the state of TN basically reacted and put him in an untenable situation he’s going to break somebody’s mandate. It’s a ****** situation all around.

Most of us support the right of businesses to act largely how they choose, even if that would appear to be badly. Then we can all see it and choose whether we want to support that business or not. I agree with that too if a business is acting in some discriminatory manner I’d like to see it so I can react accordingly and take my business or my employment even elsewhere.

The whole crux here is the idiot in the WH massively upset the Apple cart and put us at odds with each other, employee and employer. CV is right that two wrongs don’t make a right but I’ll at least admit the states are trying to reset the Apple cart. Most employers are going to say “please just stop it’s already bad enough” while most employees will say “yes keep those Feds off our backs”.

All you really saw in mine and @clarksvol00 exchange are two people who pretty agree on what should have happened while just bitching at each other from our own position of what actually happened and how were pissed about the current state. We both want the same resolution remove ALL government interference here.

But not @hog88 he’s just a clueless rube and a horrible employer
 
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You keep saying this, but you haven't proven it. Let's say we're in an anarchic system with no government. You think the first company that wins the race would just tend towards doing things like buying up threats and enlarging itself to the point where it would just become, essentially, a ruling government?

Man if you want to go all sci-fi we can't have a discussion since I'm not versed in that genre.

But let's just look at our not so distant history and the coal miner strikes (wars) in KY, WV and VA. The mine companies behavior was endorsed and backed by the .gov. Go back to Englands history and and the East India Company, the same. None of those actions could have happened without .gov endorsement. I can keep going if need be but can you give us an example of corporate tyranny that wasn't endorsed by the .gov?
 
Man if you want to go all sci-fi we can't have a discussion since I'm not versed in that genre.

But let's just look at our not so distant history and the coal miner strikes (wars) in KY, WV and VA. The mine companies behavior was endorsed and backed by the .gov. Go back to Englands history and and the East India Company, the same. None of those actions could have happened without .gov endorsement. I can keep going if need be but can you give us an example of corporate tyranny that wasn't endorsed by the .gov?
Endorsement by the government in a lot of cases was the government stepping out of the way, or turning a blind eye to the company setting up its own government structure (especially with regards to the East India Co.), no?
 
Seeing a big wave of retirements from folks I assume are not vaccinated (based on my assumptions knowing these folks) being announced this week.
 
Really? I've never had a private business I worked for try and force medical treatment on me. Nor have I ever worked for a private business trying to make vaccines mandatory.

Most people in medicine are required to have a Hepatitis B vaccination. This has been a requirement since I got into the field over 30 yrs ago. Our medical people can chime in whether that is still the case
 
Endorsement by the government in a lot of cases was the government stepping out of the way, or turning a blind eye to the company setting up its own government structure (especially with regards to the East India Co.), no?

The British government was intertwined with the EIC and teh Hudson Bay company to the point of providing military support.
 
Seeing a big wave of retirements from folks I assume are not vaccinated (based on my assumptions knowing these folks) being announced this week.
We are also but it’s not just the vax mandate or a lack of compliance with it. It’s more just people can retire and had been working because they chose to do so but with the current ****** state of employment and our interfering government they are just choosing to get out of the rat race. It’s a mix but largely driven by the results of our lousy government leadership and deteriorating economic environment
 
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I'm curious, do you believe in green policies and saving the planet?

You should have been more specific. As in the green policies and saving the planet stuff that promotes raping the earth of trees and other natural carbon emission filters in order to facilitate the harvesting of rare metals for battery production. I'd love to see the confusion on libtard activist faces when tree huggers and Green New Deal dummies show up at the same rally.
 
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What's the deal with celebrities that keep spreading misinformation about vaccines? Eric Clapton, Nicki Minaj, Joe Rogan, Josh Archivald (NHL) and now this idiot, and the list goes on. They could help the cause but decide to side with stupidity.
Just because speech is free doesn't mean these people think they are entitled to spread bull crap.
Why can't they focus on their field instead and let health professionals deal with everything vaccine and COVID-related?
Aaron Rodgers should stick to throwing footballs for his own sake.



Aaron Rodgers is just as entitled to sharing his opinion as you are entitled to spew your garbage about vaccines saving the world. Rodgers used a proven treatment for covid and fools like you need to quit spreading lies and claiming that treatment other then vaccinations don't work. Thousands of doctors agree with Aaron.
 
The way meat is going up, I'll be poaching Dove out of season this year.
It’s outlandish here in Norfolk. We were just in Indiana and there were no shortages and prices were reasonable. Gas on tollways totally controlled by Sunoco in 4 states was absolutely ludicrous. 3.59 to 4.03 depending upon which mile marker you were at.
 
Like I've said, its not an either/or choice for me. If I do a mandate, I'd have a weekly testing opt-out. But like I told ND40 yesterday, the state has no reason to step in and tell me I can't do it just to play chicken with the feds. If comes down to it, I'll take my right to employee who I choose.
So you would only require unvaccinated employees to test weekly? What if they are showing no symptoms? How long would the testing last? And why not just require all employees to test weekly since people who are vaccinated can catch it and spread it as well.
 

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