Coronavirus (No politics)

#7,277
#7,277
utvolpj said:
Choosing to get experimental drugs pumped into my body doesn't risk my personal freedom at all. Don't believe I've ever made that argument. Being tracked, being shamed and eventually being forced to do it by an overreaching govt absolutely does and will.
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You didn’t answer the question. What is your resistance based around? What you consider to be “experimental”?
 
#7,278
#7,278
The Original Fade said:
You didn’t answer the question. What is your resistance based around? What you consider to be “experimental”?
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I did fully answer the question you asked. The vaccine itself does not but the actions around it do and will go even further

Experimental means pushed out fast without regular trials and unknown long-term effects.
 
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#7,279
#7,279
utvolpj said:
I did fully answer the question you asked. The vaccine itself does not but the actions around it do and will go even further

Experimental means pushed out fast without regular trials and unknown long-term effects.
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Every new drug that is approved by the FDA lacks long term data. That is gathered in post marketing studies.

Sounds like you don’t have a problem with the vaccine itself, you just don’t want the gov’t telling you to take it. Which has nothing whatsoever to do with you own health
 
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#7,280
#7,280
The Original Fade said:
Every new drug that is approved by the FDA lacks long term data. That is gathered in post marketing studies.

Sounds like you don’t have a problem with the vaccine itself, you just don’t want the gov’t telling you to take it. Which has nothing whatsoever to do with you own health
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FDA trials do study long term effects. Maybe not 30 years but definitely more than a few months. It's why there had to be emergency use orders

As I stated at least twice, I have an issue with being tracked, shamed and forced. That was the direct answer to your question. The govt telling people to inject an experimental drug can absolutely affect their long-term health
 
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#7,281
#7,281
utvolpj said:
FDA trials do study long term effects. Maybe not 30 years but definitely more than a few months. It's why there had to be emergency use orders

As I stated at least twice, I have an issue with being tracked, shamed and forced. That was the direct answer to your question. The govt telling people to inject an experimental drug can absolutely affect their long-term health
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Agree to disagree - we’re not getting anywhere. At least we can agree on Saturdays in the Fall
 
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#7,285
#7,285
mad4vols said:
Mind sharing an article based on our country instead?
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Not an article, but here's the graph from the CDC. In spite of rising cases, vaccine and natural immunity are working. deaths remain low. That also will drop as cases drop here shortly. People are paying too much attention to cases, many of which are asymptomatic. Deaths are what matters, and death rate is still low. Covid has been defeated.

deaths_080621.jpg
 
#7,286
#7,286
Bassmaster_Vol said:
Not an article, but here's the graph from the CDC. In spite of rising cases, vaccine and natural immunity are working. deaths remain low. even if covid remained this hot, our pace is around 20k deaths/year. It won't. That also will drop as cases drop here shortly. People are paying too much attention to cases, many of which are asymptomatic. Deaths are what matters, and death rate is still low. Covid has been defeated.

View attachment 385907
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Not sure what this graph signifies, children, adults? There is no context. And you are wrong, it’s not just deaths that matter. Hospitalizations are what is putting the huge strain on our healthcare system right now.
 
#7,287
#7,287
mad4vols said:
Not sure what this graph signifies, children, adults, hospitalizations, deaths? There is no context. And you are wrong, it’s not just deaths that matter. Hospitalizations are what is putting the huge strain on our healthcare system right now.
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I think you're believing the fear. There isn't a huge strain on our hospitals. This is the same thing we were told last year when we sent a hospital ship to NY, and set up tents in the park and.... never used them.

We've posted several articles that have said that the rate of children getting sick is the same. It appears as a higher percentage because the majority of elderly have been vaccinated, but that the number of children hospitalized has not increased.

We're also not told of what the condition of these children are. The number of completely healthy children who are bouncing around playing one day, then get covid and die, are nil. So we aren't told the preconditions of these children. It's all terrible, anytime someone dies is terrible, but these narratives are simply untrue. There's been several articles from yahoo, and other medical sites, not misinformation as you love to call it, posted in the past several days that demonstrate this.

Buying into headlines isn't going to help you. Deaths are and will remain low. Especially when cases drop dramatically just as they did in the UK with the delta strain.
 
#7,288
#7,288
Oh yeah, forgot about this one, posted for the third time. Guess you didn't see it. It's from Stanford and Harvard, America of course, in case you were wondering:

Despite ‘Delta’ Alarmism, US COVID Deaths Are at Lowest Level Since March 2020, Harvard and Stanford Professors Explain | Brad Polumbo

"Despite ‘Delta’ Alarmism, US COVID Deaths Are at Lowest Level Since March 2020"

"Now, some would cite rising COVID-19 case counts or hospitalizations in certain parts of the country as evidence that the pandemic is indeed once again spiraling out of control. But many COVID-19 cases recorded as positive are either asymptomatic or come with very mild symptoms—especially the cases confirmed among vaccinated individuals—so high case counts are not necessarily proof of a serious problem. Hospitalizations are concerning, yes, but primarily insofar as they lead to high numbers of deaths, which, thankfully, is not the case so far with the Delta variant.

"That’s right: despite all the alarmism and clamor for renewed restrictions on our liberty, there’s not really been a resurgence in the state of the COVID-19 crisis itself.

“We should be declaring a great and resounding success,” Bhattacharya told FEE in conclusion. “The COVID emergency is over. We still need to take COVID seriously, and there are still vulnerable people here and abroad left to vaccinate. But we can start to treat it as one disease among many that afflict people rather than an all-consuming threat.”

I guess that's more misinformation from Stanford and Harvard...
 
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#7,289
#7,289
Bassmaster_Vol said:
Oh yeah, forgot about this one, posted for the third time. Guess you didn't see it. It's from Stanford and Harvard, America of course, in case you were wondering:

Despite ‘Delta’ Alarmism, US COVID Deaths Are at Lowest Level Since March 2020, Harvard and Stanford Professors Explain | Brad Polumbo

"Despite ‘Delta’ Alarmism, US COVID Deaths Are at Lowest Level Since March 2020"

"Now, some would cite rising COVID-19 case counts or hospitalizations in certain parts of the country as evidence that the pandemic is indeed once again spiraling out of control. But many COVID-19 cases recorded as positive are either asymptomatic or come with very mild symptoms—especially the cases confirmed among vaccinated individuals—so high case counts are not necessarily proof of a serious problem. Hospitalizations are concerning, yes, but primarily insofar as they lead to high numbers of deaths, which, thankfully, is not the case so far with the Delta variant.

"That’s right: despite all the alarmism and clamor for renewed restrictions on our liberty, there’s not really been a resurgence in the state of the COVID-19 crisis itself.

“We should be declaring a great and resounding success,” Bhattacharya told FEE in conclusion. “The COVID emergency is over. We still need to take COVID seriously, and there are still vulnerable people here and abroad left to vaccinate. But we can start to treat it as one disease among many that afflict people rather than an all-consuming threat.”

I guess that's more misinformation from Stanford and Harvard...
Click to expand...

What point is it you are highlighting exactly?
 
#7,290
#7,290
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#7,291
#7,291
utvolpj said:
I would guess multiple 2yo used to die of the flu every year too and no one ever mentioned the vax status of their parents. Using a child's death to make a point is cheap
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I don't care to comment about the choice to vaccinate or not, but the stats on pediatric flu deaths are out there. States are required to report those. Adult flu deaths do not have to be reported.

In 2018, 171 pediatric flu deaths occurred, and 80% were unvaccinated. Looking at the numbers, 75% is roughly the year to year minimum with unvaccinated kids with maybe up to 90%.

I don't know the true pediatric Covid numbers, but I would guess so far, it's not worse than the flu. However, I believe Covid is much more contageous.
 
#7,292
#7,292
Bassmaster_Vol said:
Oh yeah, forgot about this one, posted for the third time. Guess you didn't see it. It's from Stanford and Harvard, America of course, in case you were wondering:

Despite ‘Delta’ Alarmism, US COVID Deaths Are at Lowest Level Since March 2020, Harvard and Stanford Professors Explain | Brad Polumbo

"Despite ‘Delta’ Alarmism, US COVID Deaths Are at Lowest Level Since March 2020"

"Now, some would cite rising COVID-19 case counts or hospitalizations in certain parts of the country as evidence that the pandemic is indeed once again spiraling out of control. But many COVID-19 cases recorded as positive are either asymptomatic or come with very mild symptoms—especially the cases confirmed among vaccinated individuals—so high case counts are not necessarily proof of a serious problem. Hospitalizations are concerning, yes, but primarily insofar as they lead to high numbers of deaths, which, thankfully, is not the case so far with the Delta variant.

"That’s right: despite all the alarmism and clamor for renewed restrictions on our liberty, there’s not really been a resurgence in the state of the COVID-19 crisis itself.

“We should be declaring a great and resounding success,” Bhattacharya told FEE in conclusion. “The COVID emergency is over. We still need to take COVID seriously, and there are still vulnerable people here and abroad left to vaccinate. But we can start to treat it as one disease among many that afflict people rather than an all-consuming threat.”

I guess that's more misinformation from Stanford and Harvard...
Click to expand...
you are pointing out deaths again, the crisis right now is the hospitalizations of the unvaccinated , and it’s getting worse and worse every day.
 
#7,293
#7,293
VolGee4 said:
I don't care to comment about the choice to vaccinate or not, but the stats on pediatric flu deaths are out there. States are required to report those. Adult flu deaths do not have to be reported.

In 2018, 171 pediatric flu deaths occurred, and 80% were unvaccinated. Looking at the numbers, 75% is roughly the year to year minimum with unvaccinated kids with maybe up to 90%.

I don't know the true pediatric Covid numbers, but I would guess so far, it's not worse than the flu. However, I believe Covid is much more contageous.
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Right but we already know the child is unvaccinated for covid because of age. This is about blaming their parents for being unvaccinated or around others who are unvaccinated. When a child dies of flu do they also report on the vax status of their parents and shame them?
 
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#7,294
#7,294
utvolpj said:
Right but we already know the child is unvaccinated for covid because of age. This is about blaming their parents for being unvaccinated or around others who are unvaccinated. When a child dies of flu do they also report on the vax status of their parents and shame them?
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I don't care to shame anyone. But it is data that suggests that a vaccine is effective. I get the timing argument, too. I just did the research and learned a lot more about the flu when Covid was being compared to it. But all of you guys carry on being on one side or the other.
 
#7,295
#7,295
Bassmaster_Vol said:
Oh yeah, forgot about this one, posted for the third time. Guess you didn't see it. It's from Stanford and Harvard, America of course, in case you were wondering:

Despite ‘Delta’ Alarmism, US COVID Deaths Are at Lowest Level Since March 2020, Harvard and Stanford Professors Explain | Brad Polumbo

"Despite ‘Delta’ Alarmism, US COVID Deaths Are at Lowest Level Since March 2020"

"Now, some would cite rising COVID-19 case counts or hospitalizations in certain parts of the country as evidence that the pandemic is indeed once again spiraling out of control. But many COVID-19 cases recorded as positive are either asymptomatic or come with very mild symptoms—especially the cases confirmed among vaccinated individuals—so high case counts are not necessarily proof of a serious problem. Hospitalizations are concerning, yes, but primarily insofar as they lead to high numbers of deaths, which, thankfully, is not the case so far with the Delta variant.

"That’s right: despite all the alarmism and clamor for renewed restrictions on our liberty, there’s not really been a resurgence in the state of the COVID-19 crisis itself.

“We should be declaring a great and resounding success,” Bhattacharya told FEE in conclusion. “The COVID emergency is over. We still need to take COVID seriously, and there are still vulnerable people here and abroad left to vaccinate. But we can start to treat it as one disease among many that afflict people rather than an all-consuming threat.”

I guess that's more misinformation from Stanford and Harvard...
Click to expand...

Deaths from COVID itself aren’t the main issue, it’s the hospitalizations. Several areas are running out of hospital beds, which means people with unpreventable sickness (strokes, heart attacks, embolisms, etc) are having to compete with COVID pts whose predicament was almost entirely preventable with a vaccine
 
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#7,298
#7,298
mad4vols said:
View attachment 385945
View attachment 385951
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Context would include numbers and comparisons. NY screamed about ventilators too and look what happened there.

Using thing like "much more dangerous" may make for a good story but the numbers tell the take. Like I said, last I heard was 87% Icu bed usage but that's not really so much higher than normal pre-pandemic. Testing positive is also a worthless stat but makes for good scare tactics
 
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#7,299
#7,299
utvolpj said:
Context would include numbers and comparisons. NY screamed about ventilators too and look what happened there.

Using thing like "much more dangerous" may make for a good story but the numbers tell the take. Like I said, last I heard was 87% Icu bed usage but that's not really so much higher than normal pre-pandemic. Testing positive is also a worthless stat but makes for good scare tactics
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How do you say you are an antivaxer without saying you are an antivaxer?
 
#7,300
#7,300
mad4vols said:
How do you say you are an antivaxer without saying you are an antivaxer?
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Cute except my wife and I are both vaxxed. We made a choice that should be available to all. I am against the tracking, shaming and forcing going on with this. You spread as much disinformation as the antivax crowd too
 
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