Recruiting Forum Football Talk III

[coven]

I think it’s worth asking if Texas high school football is over-rated.

Lake Travis and Westlake are both really good and will put out some good players pretty often. Several QB's in the NFL are from there. I think it's more of being a really big state, so a lot of talent to pick from. For the big programs, you will often have players move into the area to play, but that happened in TN as well.

 

[RiotVol]

It's been a thing that Texas HS players have peaked in HS.

Agreed, because of Varsity Blues, Friday Night Lights, and that reality show with the little kids playing pop Warner, people think they are producing the best talent. They produce a lot of players, but I wonder about the quality.

I think if I were designing a recruiting profile for UT, I wouldn’t even bother with Texas. I’d focus almost entirely on the South and if I were to look beyond it, I’d spend my money on Southern CA before Texas. It wasn’t until I spent time in Arizona that I realized how much talent from Southern CA is spread across the PAC 12.

 

[DustyRockSolid]

If I were in JP’s shoes...I would probably look to the future. Shore up one of the best ‘22 classes the program has ever seen and make it extremely hard for the administration to get rid of me for fear of loosing such a talented group of players...

Pruitt is not going to sign a legendary class or anything close to it. The only thing that could fix this and stop it from getting worse is winning. Florida will literally put 60 points on us. Its gonna be bad. Pruitt isn't gonna just start winning games. This class will continue to lose players. I've come to terms with it. We are a bad team and program. Bottom of the SEC. We will stay that way until a proven coach is hired. Appreciate everything you do, BTW. Big fan of yours.

 

[butchna]

If McElwain didn't make up death threats, there's a really good chance Mullen is our coach right now. I don't know how good we'd be, but I bet you we'd have a good QB, whether it be JG or someone else.

Without the alleged death threats, he maybe coaches the rest of the season and if he doesn’t win enough they pay his full buyout and end up with Mullen anyway...he would’ve waited.

 

[BAJAvol]

Would absolutely take Herman over what we have. I think Herman is an 8-10 win coach per year. Really glad he didn't end up at LSU.

 

[BAJAvol]

You want to save the '22 class? Cut bait within the next 2 weeks. Anyone that thinks he could pull a top 10 class next year needs to be evaluated.

 

[Smokeytom]

Haven’t seen it mentioned - in the presser yesterday Pruitt said it wasn’t knowledge of the playbook keeping Bailey from playing, ‘he knows the playbook, he’s a smart guy,’ but he hasn’t had the opportunities for live reps...

So you’re telling me our 5 ️ FR QB has had a solid handle on the playbook all season, and yet it still took you this long to get him the opportunities needed to be ready to start?

 

[BAJAvol]

Like anyone cares, but my list:
-Freeze
-Campbell
-Rhule (may hate the NFL)
-Herman
-Sark
-Napier

 

[butchna]

Agreed, because of Varsity Blues, Friday Night Lights, and that reality show with the little kids playing pop Warner, people think they are producing the best talent. They produce a lot of players, but I wonder about the quality.

I think if I were designing a recruiting profile for UT, I wouldn’t even bother with Texas. I’d focus almost entirely on the South and if I were to look beyond it, I’d spend my money on Southern CA before Texas. It wasn’t until I spent time in Arizona that I realized how much talent from Southern CA is spread across the PAC 12.

By UT you mean the Vols? Otherwise that would be a very radical strategy for the other guys! Guess Salter’s glad you’re not in charge!

 

[Catbone]

“Mehlen”
“Can’t recruit”
“Goofy”
“Won’t last”
“Butch with a visor”

Bingo

 

[BJWeeks]

good god man. that just isnt true. Freeze beat Bama, he is an slightly above averahe coach @ 4-2 in bowl games, 70% WP at Liberty and 61% at Ole Miss, and he cheated to get there!

Do you see Pruitt beating Bama? The answer is no

 

[Jackcrevol]

Haven’t seen it mentioned - in the presser yesterday Pruitt said it wasn’t knowledge of the playbook keeping Bailey from playing, ‘he knows the playbook, he’s a smart guy,’ but he hasn’t had the opportunities for live reps...

So you’re telling me our 5 ️ FR QB has had a solid handle on the playbook all season, and yet it still took you this long to get him the opportunities needed to be ready to start?

View attachment 327009

my buddy said to tell you, good choice of gifs.

 

[Smyrna ATL Vol]

He had one good year. The year they beat GA. Since then he really hasn't done much, and if you compare the competition of SEC to Big12-11-10, it's not even close. He might be better than Pruitt, but it's not a huge step up. We were lucky with Brown. Their last AD wasn't very good and let go of a winning coach. The fans here are more than willing to send him packing, and there are is a lot of talk about Urban. They have the money to get the golden goose, so you may get your wish. I think it's table scraps though and we will still be unhappy. Maybe we beat Vandy again though!

Let’s compare Big 12 and SEC East from last year:

Baylor - Rhule
WV - Brown
Iowa State - Campbell
OU - Riley
OKST - Gundy
TCU - Patterson

SC - Muschamp
Vandy - Mason
KY - Stoops
UF - Mullen
UGA - Smart

Every coach in the big twelve listed is better than every coach in the East not named Mullen or Smart. And Smart mostly wins by talent.

Herman would be a major upgrade and has done well everywhere he has been.

 

[butchna]

I wasn't impressed at all with what Sark did at Washington. That's a pretty good job with some historical success and you can win there, but he was the definition of "meh." Sark got the USC job because of his previous connections there, not because he demonstrated some great coaching ability at a previous job.

Took over an udder dumpster fire from Willingham. Rice has historical success at some point.

 

[BAJAvol]

I think USC, Michigan, possibly LSU, Auburn, and possibly Penn State may all be open next year. We will be left with scraps.

 

[Jackcrevol]

Do you see Pruitt beating Bama? The answer is no

You asked me a question then answered it yourself. Answer is even if I thought he could or couldnt doesnt matter bc President and AD along with boosters make these decisions. And for 13 million reasons they arent going to fire him in a Pandemic. We've made this exact mistake in recent memory, it wont happen again.

 

[SLICKYINC]

Like anyone cares, but my list:
-Freeze
-Campbell
-Rhule (may hate the NFL)
-Herman
-Sark
-Napier

Solid 1-4. I’d put Rhule at 1 since we’re in dream mode.

 

[05_never_again]

Agreed, because of Varsity Blues, Friday Night Lights, and that reality show with the little kids playing pop Warner, people think they are producing the best talent. They produce a lot of players, but I wonder about the quality.

I think if I were designing a recruiting profile for UT, I wouldn’t even bother with Texas. I’d focus almost entirely on the South and if I were to look beyond it, I’d spend my money on Southern CA before Texas. It wasn’t until I spent time in Arizona that I realized how much talent from Southern CA is spread across the PAC 12.

Well said. High school football is uniquely popular in Texas, so people assume they must have the best players.

I think Texas does put out incredible offensive talent, especially at QB. Look at the number of NFL QBs who went to high school in that state. However, for some reason, Texas HS coaches take all their best athletes and put them on the offensive side of the ball. Not sure the reason for that. Huge emphasis in 7-on-7, which has obvious offensive advantages but I don't think lends itself to producing physical defensive players.

 

[butchna]

I still don’t like him but would kill for him to be the HC right now

I wouldn’t have broken a Commandment if he had been hired...and I won’t now.

 

[butchna]

Solid 1-4. I’d put Rhule at 1 since we’re in dream mode.

That’s “proven”.

 

[RiotVol]

Lake Travis and Westlake are both really good and will put out some good players pretty often. Several QB's in the NFL are from there. I think it's more of being a really big state, so a lot of talent to pick from. For the big programs, you will often have players move into the area to play, but that happened in TN as well.

I think you need wealthy suburbs to consistently produce top flight QB and special teams play, because it takes a lot more tutelage to produce a D1 qb or kicker. Poor school systems can’t usually afford those kinds of coaches, or have parents who can afford the kind of private coaches. However, wealthy suburbs have the ability to draw kids from adjacent districts without resources, have more money to spend on coaches, and parents who can afford to spend money on private coaching.

Those Austin area high schools are cranking out elite QBs for a reason - they have the talent and the money to do so.

However, from top to bottom, I’m not convinced that Texas football superior to what’s played around Atlanta. I think your 5A and 6A schools from there would more than hold their own against comparably-sized schools from Texas.

 

[bignewt]

“Mehlen”
“Can’t recruit”
“Goofy”
“Won’t last”
“Butch with a visor”

You forgot

cuck
wife is typhoid mary
doofus
my dog could win recruiting Florida

 

[RiotVol]

By UT you mean the Vols? Otherwise that would be a very radical strategy for the other guys! Guess Salter’s glad you’re not in charge!

I think Bailey is a better qb than Salter.

Edit: FWIW, the logical extension of my post above about the economics behind developing qbs/specialty plays would say that they’re probably the exception to the rule. You go get them where you can.

 

[BAJAvol]

I will say this about Herman. Dude has underachieved at Texas, but he doesn't get blown out. His worst loss was a 24-7 loss to TCU in his first year.

 

[Kingston Vol]

Okay okay okay....

Bear with me and let’s assume Pruitt isn’t replaced.

What would your priorities to fix this team? What assistants would you move around? What seniors would you try and talk into staying? Etc...


For me, in no particular order:

• I’d look to move on from Weinke. Ty Simpson recruitment be damned. I mean, it’s hard for me to be too critical of him because JG is a bag of ****, Bailey missed the entire offseason, and Mauer was suicidal so doubt he was focusing on his craft. But as bag a ****** as JG is, he’s regressed. Shrout never has improved, etc. I’d look at Tee Martin as the natural replacement. Him or Long.
• Id move Osovet to something other than TE coach. We’ve gotten nothing from the position all year, and it was fairly damning when Jacob Warren, during his media availability, pointed out how the tight ends had to teach Joe about the position. That ain’t good. Joe is a creative offensive mind and seems like a talented recruiter. He has a position on the staff - but Im not 100% sure what it is yet.
• Niedermeyer has a background in defense, and I hate to judge him too harshly, but I’m not sure he needs to be coaching ILB’s. HT has regressed this year and neither Banks nor Crouch have improved.
• I’d tell Len’Neth Whitehead that yeah, I know you want to play RB, but his path to the field is at LB. There was a lot of talk during his recruitment that his best position was LB. With Gray, Dee, Smalls, Hodge, and the incoming freshman - we have a log jam at running back. Meanwhile, outside of HT- we have nothing proven at LB. Some players have flashed, like Joseph, but for my money, LB is our biggest question mark going forward.
• I’d thank Brandon Kennedy and most of the seniors for their service. Maybe ask Fant, Solomon, and Palmer to come back.
• I’d tell Cooper Mays to spend the entire offseason working at center. And I’d sell Cade on the idea of playing side by side with his brother if he’s willing to return.
• Id do my best to bring Tosh or Bo Davis in as DL coach.
• Id scour the earth for a transfer quarterback. Darriel Mack, formerly of UCF, would be someone I would look closely at. Dual threat QB with a few years eligibility left. Played well against LSU a few years back. I’d encourage every QB not named Harrison Bailey or Kaiden Salter to “look around” this offseason.
• Previously expressed my concern about linebackers so like above, I’d make finding a transfer linebacker or two a priority. Especially if someone has an ounce of pass rushing ability.

That’s all I have off the top of my head.

If Pruitt is back, my opinion is he has to have clear instruction from Fulmer to back off the offense and let Chaney do things his way. I know some of you are not Chaney's biggest fans anymore, but I think he can get this offense rolling at a level that is, at bare minimum, SEC average. All the calls to fire him make no sense to me purely from the standpoint that 1) it would cost a lot of money and 2) the last thing we need is a system change in a make or break year. Otherwise, on the offensive side, Weinke and Friend have to go. Our QBs have been awful and poorly developed over three seasons, and our offensive line is one of the most talented in the country but certainly doesn't play that way. It's pretty easy for me to see a new QB coach come in, I'm doubtful anything is done at the offensive line position. Let Chaney pick a QB coach and OL coach. He's been around long enough to know what works and what doesn't. The focus all offseason should be Harrison Bailey, Kaidon Salter, and a transfer QB. One of those three should be competent enough for Chaney to run with.

Tee is the assistant head coach. He is next in line if Pruitt were down for COVID. As a result of that, he should slowly be given more responsibility. Some of you don't like it, but he will 100% be a candidate for this job if it comes open. Now, I'm not saying you hand it to him, but it would be smart business to vet what you have in house while you still have the chance. If he doesn't seize the opportunity then that's one thing. But you have nothing to lose, if you're Fulmer, by trying to put more responsibility on him and seeing how he handles it. The hard part is doing this while Pruitt still has his job.

On the defensive side, it's clear to see the linebackers are the weak link, both in talent and development. Neidermeyer and Felton were not ready to be put in these positions - and I'll eat some crow here. During the offseason I thought Sherrer and Rumph were overrated and could be easily replaced. I was wrong. We needed the recruiting juice and it made sense at the time, but recruiting wins are hollow without success on the field. As we're seeing now, this class is going to implode. I think we're stuck with Felton - no one is going to hire him. Neidermeyer gets calls every offseason to move out west. I think he'll accept one of them this year, simply for the job stability.

My guess is Ansley is going to get calls for G5 HC jobs this year, and he'll definitely get NFL assistant/coordinator calls. For this reason, I think he'll be gone in the same fashion Sherrer and Rumph left. Probably shortly after Signing Day if it's an NFL job. This is where it gets dangerous for us, because if Tosh or Bo Davis or someone isn't immediately hired, we'll know this ship is sinking, because it would 100% be Pruitt telling his buddies, "We want you, but I'm not sure how long I'll be here." If we start hiring Brumbaughs and Feltons, watch out.

The problem with all of these changes is they would require Pruitt to take his hands off the wheel to a certain extent, and I don't believe he's willing to do that. If he finally acquiesces and makes these moves, he won't be happy about it and the culture around the program will only become more divided and get worse. When that kind of culture permeates a program, it's near impossible to flip the switch. And on the off-chance it works, and we win 6 to 8 games next year (which is realistic), and he's given 2022, will he go back to his old ways? Will we be any better off than we would have been by starting fresh with another head coach?