Latest Coronavirus - Yikes

[82_VOL_83]

So much stupid gets posted here. Feel like I need to wash my brain when I finally get through the 20 pages of this thread each day. TDS is just killing some of yall.

There is only 1 fact that in and of itself SCREAMS to open this country back up now.

99.8% of people WITH the virus live. That makes the mortality the same as a somewhat bad flu season. Nothing like flu season in 1968 that killed a million Amercians...which we also never closed down anything over.

You stupid Dems are bitching about the wrong thing. If yall said " Trump never should have shut down at all, like Sweden...he WRECKED our economy !!"

You would have him by the balls. Dead to rights. As usual...yall are not only on the wrong side of the issue...but instead going 100MPH down a dead end road which will put this country in a damn depression if the rational people or citizens dont take charge.

Freaking Morons

Thanks for the kind words NGV. Hope you and Reb are well.

VB33...I didnt know you were stuck in NC like me. I live in Charlotte. Wish it was Knoxville...

/thread

 

[allvol123]

Buffet paid for the grand kids' education, and let them know that was all they were getting. His kids are getting money that they can only spend on their specified charities.

It is an old fashioned notion called self-sufficiency.

You should check it out.

And has nothing to do with the point I just stated. I'm confident if given the choice, the man would give his own life before the life of one of his children or grandchildren.

 

[Rifleman]

And has nothing to do with the point I just stated. I'm confident if given the choice, the man would give his own life before the life of one of his children or grandchildren.

You set this up a binary choice, but you already lectured us on how the virus doesn't affect 10u groups remember? So how is that a binary? His grandkids aren't in danger, but he has a knowledge and insight into our economy that no one else on earth has?

The binary is between everything Buffet has left to offer in a crisis like this and the void left once he's dead.

It's so sad that you are rooting for the void.

 

[allvol123]

You set this up a binary choice, but you already lectured us on how the virus doesn't affect 10u groups remember? So how is that a binary? His grandkids aren't in danger, but he has a knowledge and insight into our economy that no one else on earth has?

The binary is between everything Buffet has left to offer in a crisis like this and the void left once he's dead.

It's so sad that you are rooting for the void.

Good grief dude, it was a discussion on views of value of life between old versus young, held by the masses. Thus the hypothetical, because this disease does discriminate. If it didnt, and 8% of all infected 10u were dying, the shutdown we have just seen economically, would have paled in comparison to a shutdown if that were the scenario.

At this point, I'm bored with this. In my family, and all the other families I know, youth, in terms of life and death situations, are valued more than adults.

 

[Rifleman]

Good grief dude, it was a discussion on views of value of life between old versus young, held by the masses. Thus the hypothetical, because this disease does discriminate. If it didnt, and 8% of all infected 10u were dying, the shutdown we have just seen economically, would have paled in comparison to a shutdown if that were the scenario.

At this point, I'm bored with this. In my family, and all the other families I know, youth, in terms of life and death situations, are valued more than adults.

Obviously I'm joking about the void, but by your own admissions your hypothetical has nothing to do with the situation we find ourselves in.

Thank God the youth are only occasionally affected, but they still would want their parents and grandparents to be able to earn a living safely.

I think most of us, apart from a few misanthropes, want the same thing.

I sincerely appreciate the discussion. Stay safe out there.

 

[NurseGoodVol]

If someone is COVID-19 positive, do you want them processing your beef, chicken or pork?

I would think cooking properly takes that out of the equation.

 

[rjd970]

Anybody here arguing going $4T more in debt and adding 20M unemployed worth saving the life of a single 80 year old with emphysema and has one foot in the grave already?

If you aren’t arguing that then you have a threshold on human life too, you just don’t want to admit it. After that, one’s specific threshold is just a subjective matter of argument.

My personal opinion is we overreacted and probably costed more lives in the long run while adding unnecessary misery to millions currently alive as well as future generations burdened with the increased debt.

 

[Rifleman]

I would think cooking properly takes that out of the equation.

You have to have a meat thermometer to make a proper steak anyway. As soon as I'm comfortable the microbes are gone, that puppy is on the plate.

 

[NurseGoodVol]

Nope. We don't really care whether or not there is a vaccine. We drink aquarium cleaner and shoot up with Lysol.

Why do you think my mother's day was so great...i found beam lysol!!!

 

[NurseGoodVol]

You have to have a meat thermometer to make a proper steak anyway. As soon as I'm comfortable the microbes are gone, that puppy is on the plate.

View attachment 278522

I'm a rare type person almost close to steak tartar. Kick the horns off and flip it twice. I think given how many contaminants the fda allows in food these days I may have to rethink that.

 

[Septic]

Covid kills old people. Thus you had to have govt step in to close things. If it killed 10u like it killed the 80+, you wouldnt have needed govt to step in, people would have barricaded themselves willingly.

It is fairly simple to see.

I'm not disagreeing that the reaction was worse than the virus, but that's still a subjective opinion. Hindsight, fortunately, allows for us to grouse about it.

You've failed to address the question of at which age does the value of life become less important or valuable, objectively. COVID may primarily affect older folks, but it's not JUST octogenarians. Anecdotally, I had a guy that lives a mile away from me die, he was a healthy 39 year old.

 

[allvol123]

I'm not disagreeing that the reaction was worse than the virus, but that's still a subjective opinion. Hindsight, fortunately, allows for us to grouse about it.

You've failed to address the argument of at which age does the value of life become less important or valuable, objectively. COVID may primarily affect older folks, but it's not JUST octogenarians. Anecdotally, I had a guy that lives a mile away from me die, he was a healthy 39 year old.

I think that determination is so individualistic and is one of many reasons why the govt shouldnt be involved in picking winners and losers, essentials and non essentials.

I have a healthy issue that personally I believe would be a very bad matchup with me getting covid. It causes me concern every flu season as well. But I choose to continue working because I believe while those are threats to me, the ramifications for my family of me choosing to stay home and sink us into poverty are worse than me dying.

 

[MontyPython]

Did you read the articles I linked?

This is like wrestling a tar baby.

What part of the study's conclusions are you disputing? Are you suggesting that the 1.3% mortality rate for COVID-19 is wrong? That the 0.1% mortality rate for 'normal flu' is wrong?

Any reasonable, rational person recognizes that CV19 is probable AT LEAST 10x more deadly than the flu.

 

[rjd970]

I'm not disagreeing that the reaction was worse than the virus, but that's still a subjective opinion. Hindsight, fortunately, allows for us to grouse about it.

You've failed to address the argument of at which age does the value of life become less important or valuable, objectively. COVID may primarily affect older folks, but it's not JUST octogenarians. Anecdotally, I had a guy that lives a mile away from me die, he was a healthy 39 year old.

I bet you can go back through this thread and clearly put who was in which camp from the beginning. Those that agreed with the response, fear peddled, posted all the junior twitter statisticians saying the apocalypse was upon us....will always say "well, hindsight is 20/20." No it's not. It is and always was agenda driven BS. Any objective observer can see it and should have seen it.

I think Trump is an idiot of the first order and can't get out of the white house soon enough, he shirks responsibility, is awful with the cronyism, and can't put together a coherent thought to save his life...but at the same time he did have some legitimate gripes with how the press sold us on this fear story and intentionally stayed away from any kind of success or good news.

I was, and I still am, in the agreement we needed a 2 or 3 week hiatus to make sure we had everything in place to address this thing. After that, it made no sense and there was nothing that demonstrated an extended lock down was necessary.

We can argue until we are blue in the face about the objective threshold on when a life becomes more or less valuable....but one thing we can't argue is it is pretty apparent, dare I say even objective, we did in fact overreact, and many of us saw that in the beginning, without the "benefit of hindsight".

 

[allvol123]

This is like wrestling a tar baby.

What part of the study's conclusions are you disputing? Are you suggesting that the 1.3% mortality rate for COVID-19 is wrong? That the 0.1% mortality rate for 'normal flu' is wrong?

Any reasonable, rational person recognizes that CV19 is probable AT LEAST 10x more deadly than the flu.

Really. Ten times? The Lancet didnt come that conclusion.

 

[Septic]

I think that determination is so individualistic and is one of many reasons why the govt shouldnt be involved in picking winners and losers, essentials and non essentials.

I have a healthy issue that personally I believe would be a very bad matchup with me getting covid. It causes me concern every flu season as well. But I choose to continue working because I believe while those are threats to me, the ramifications for my family of me choosing to stay home and sink us into poverty are worse than me dying.

The begged question is which is more important - life, liberty or the pursuit of happiness? I think this pandemic has raised the issue that these can be mutually exclusive for some.

I'm glad the economy is opening up, it's pretty clear at this point a one step fits all approach wasn't a good one - and as @rjd970 , it was notable early on. It's mind boggling that as low a bar as I'd set for the .gov leading up to this, they still failed to clear it with this response. It's hard to imagine that the 'playbook' we had for dealing with a pandemic on both the states and federal level were so woefully bad.

Sadly, I have no faith at all that any lessons will be learned from this.

 

[Sandman 423]

This is like wrestling a tar baby.

What part of the study's conclusions are you disputing? Are you suggesting that the 1.3% mortality rate for COVID-19 is wrong? That the 0.1% mortality rate for 'normal flu' is wrong?

Any reasonable, rational person recognizes that CV19 is probable AT LEAST 10x more deadly than the flu.

so the experts that say the cov-19 is actually somewhere around .2% are not reasonable?

Why do you post here if you don't actually want to have a discussion?

 

[allvol123]

The begged question is which is more important - life, liberty or the pursuit of happiness? I think this pandemic has raised the issue that these can be mutually exclusive for some.

I'm glad the economy is opening up, it's pretty clear at this point a one step fits all approach wasn't a good one - and as @rjd970 , it was notable early on. It's mind boggling that as low a bar as I'd set for the .gov leading up to this, they still failed to clear it with this response. It's hard to imagine that the 'playbook' we had for dealing with a pandemic on both the states and federal level were so woefully bad.

Sadly, I have no faith at all that any lessons will be learned from this.

I prefer my freedom. That is my choice.

 

[rjd970]

This is like wrestling a tar baby.

What part of the study's conclusions are you disputing? Are you suggesting that the 1.3% mortality rate for COVID-19 is wrong? That the 0.1% mortality rate for 'normal flu' is wrong?

Any reasonable, rational person recognizes that CV19 is probable AT LEAST 10x more deadly than the flu.

SMH. Even if it is 10X more deadly than the flu, that is still a really small number. We still overreacted, because we addressed a 10X more deadly disease than the flu with a 100000000X times more increased response than the flu.

 

[508mikey]

Covid kills old people. Thus you had to have govt step in to close things. If it killed 10u like it killed the 80+, you wouldnt have needed govt to step in, people would have barricaded themselves willingly.

It is fairly simple to see.

imo anything can kill old people, even natural causes & after all why are they in nursing homes to begin with ?

 

[zeppelin128]

I don’t know where you went to school but it sounds like it sucked . I knew most or we as a whole knew the cooks in our schools and we had real food not brussel sprouts and tofu or no meat Monday’s . I don’t think I was ever served undercooked chicken or over cooked tater tots . Maybe like all things , it’s not what is being cooked but the actual cooks in the kitchen .

Best food days in middle school and high school was pizza day. They always served it with corn, which is surprisingly a good combo. We had a bunch of old battle axes in the cafeteria, those ladies could cook. They'd hit your hand with a spatula too if you tried to take extra fries. Lol

 

[Rifleman]

Really. Ten times? The Lancet didnt come that conclusion.

Can you give a link to that paper, allvol? I'd like to see what the disparity between the two was.

The one Monty posted looks statistically sound and benefits from being done after we have a lot more data than some of the early estimates relying on the numbers from the Communist Party of China.

A 1.3% death rate for symptomatic cases is right in the strike zone of just about everything I've seen. When you factor in asymptomatic cases, you are still at around 1%, though that data will improve as we get antibody tests. There is not a lot of evidence of a death rate close to the flu at this point. And obviously we have a good vaccine for the flu as well.

 

[Orangeburst]

Best food days in middle school and high school was pizza day. They always served it with corn, which is surprisingly a good combo. We had a bunch of old battle axes in the cafeteria, those ladies could cook. They'd hit your hand with a spatula too if you tried to take extra fries. Lol

 

[allvol123]

imo anything can kill old people, even natural causes & after all why are they in nursing homes to begin with ?

I dont have any family in one but have taken my daughter to one for Christmas carols. It looked the on deck circle for death, for sure.

 

[allvol123]

Can you give a link to that paper, allvol? I'd like to see what the disparity between the two was.

The one Monty posted looks statistically sound and benefits from being done after we have a lot more data than some of the early estimates relying on the numbers from the Communist Party of China.

A 1.3% death rate for symptomatic cases is right in the strike zone of just about everything I've seen. When you factor in asymptomatic cases, you are still at around 1%, though that data will improve as we get antibody tests. There is not a lot of evidence of a death rate close to the flu at this point. And obviously we have a good vaccine for the flu as well.

https://www.thelancet.com/journals/laninf/article/PIIS1473-3099(20)30243-7/fulltext