Recruiting Forum Football Talk II

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#126,478
#126,478
Bassmaster_Vol said:
You’re really bad at this. Straw man after straw man
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How else should one interpret "our" supposed (unified, of course) worldview that "Humans have no value at all"?

Sounds to me like only creationists value human life. But you can correct yourself if you like.
 
#126,479
#126,479
bignewt said:
By legalizing it, you take those billions of dollars you were spending on the drug war and reinvest it in EDUCATION and TREATMENT and people no longer go to jail for possession. If my best friend had went to jail for possession, his life would be crap right now. Instead he was able to stop doing it and turn his life around. Hard to do that when you are a convicted felon.
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Seems like there are two separate arguments here. 1. Legalizing drugs 2. Reforming the prison system. I think you can definitely do number 2 without having to do number 1 like your suggesting, and a lot of people would likely be on board with that. However legalizing drugs doesn’t fix our prison system in any way shape or form, and creates new problems of its own.
 
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#126,481
#126,481
Devo182 said:
How else should one interpret "our" supposed (unified, of course) worldview that "Humans have no value at all"?

Sounds to me like only creationists value human life. But you can correct yourself if you like.
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The argument is not and has never been that evolutionists do not have moral values. I explained this to you two days ago, using their own words. This is not just a creationist talking points, but something they readily admit and even celebrate. Do I really need to explain it to you again?
 
#126,484
#126,484
ndubvols said:
Seems like there are two separate arguments here. 1. Legalizing drugs 2. Reforming the prison system. I think you can definitely do number 2 without having to do number 1 like your suggesting, and a lot of people would likely be on board with that. However legalizing drugs doesn’t fix our prison system in any way shape or form, and creates new problems of its own.
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#1 results in #2
 
#126,485
#126,485
I hate meth, heroin, prescription meds (abused) with the fire of 1000 suns. I just don't see how you can prevent people from putting whatever they want in the bodies. I don't like the idea of legalizing them and I don't like the idea of government profiting off it's use. I'm definitely against the government running to the rescue of those choosing to put poison in their bodies. If the same guy gets his dose of Narcan every friday, I've heard some call 911 right before they shoot up, what "good" are we doing? Are we not encouraging that behavior?
 
#126,487
#126,487
Kristy* said:
If someone dies during a grease fire, do you go to jail for manslaughter? No difference if it's all legal. They're just cooking something.
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For the sake of argument, I think you’d have to look at the legal marijuana model. You have to apply for a permit to operate a grow farm.

Illegal grow farms are punished, just like illegal cook houses would be punished.
 
#126,488
#126,488
Bassmaster_Vol said:
The argument is not and has never been that evolutionists do not have moral values. I explained this to you two days ago, using their own words. This is not just a creationist talking points, but something they readily admit and even celebrate. Do I really need to explain it to you again?
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2 days ago you were confused, remember? You started by talking about evolution and ended up talking about atheists vs theists and objective ethics.

You're going in circles again. Let's just focus on one thing and not shift subjects:

"Darwinism does not care about human life. Humans have no value at all. We're just bags of protoplasm banging around with no intrinsic value. So it doesn't surprise me that those who hold to that worldview think that everything should be legalized, including life destroying drugs. Of course, as I said yesterday, you can't live consistently within that worldview."

Sounds to me like people that believe in evolution cannot value human life.

Did I misinterpret? If so, here's your chance to correct me.
 
#126,489
#126,489
bignewt said:
#1 results in #2
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Not even close. It’ll reduce the population for a little while but that’s about it.

If you were to suggest being more lenient in some drug cases and creating a path for education and reintegration into society then it’d have a little more merit.

Legalizing all drugs fixes the prison system is a laughable argument.
 
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#126,492
#126,492
GoBigOrange86 said:
Honestly, who would cook their own meth if it were legal anyway? The mass-produced meth would be much safer and cheaper and involve a let fewer steps.
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Idk, is the mass produced meth regulated at all or not?

If not, then you’ll likely see it in every gas station and convenience store in the country. Corporations will profit on it, and people will buy them. There’s enough people that would “try it once or twice” then get hooked to cause a huge problem.

If it is regulated then it’ll be heavily regulated, and then that almost sounds like the pharmaceutical drugs...
 
#126,493
#126,493
Devo182 said:
Yup. Takes the gang and cartel power away.

(As long as it isn't overtaxed)
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One theory is to take control of the market and sell the stuff cheap, those who want to take advantage of the legality can just go ahead and kill themselves with the stuff, and therefore clean out the gene pool. Darwinism at its finest
 
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#126,494
#126,494
Bassmaster_Vol said:
Other than the sill top 2 you have, which is completely foolish by I digress... I don't think big men should be in the discussion on a list of greatest of all time. Big men are specialists. I compare them to pitchers in baseball. When you talk about who the greatest baseball player ever, no one should say Nolan Ryan. Nolan Ryan might be the greatest pitcher ever, but he isn't the greatest baseball player ever. He's a specialist.

The same is true with big men. Shaq was phenomenal as were Kareem and Wilt. But they were limited. They were specialists. Big men have a specific role that they play. They are rebounders, shot blockers, and they are tasked with controlling the paint. Men like Shaq don't take shots outside of 10 feet. While they are of course extremely important and they are great players, they are so limited that you shouldn't be comparing them to MJ. They should be in a class of their own imo.

Guards and forwards shoot the three, they drive the lane, they shoot jump shots, they dunk, layup, they block shots, rebound, play defense, they do it all. Shaq isn't shooting threes or jump shots. Heck, the dude couldn't even make free throws. Whereas Magic could play all 5 positions at an elite level, could you imagine Shaq trying to run the point? It should be a different discussion for them imo.
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Shaq doesn’t have the longevity that other more accomplished players have, but for like a 5 year stretch... he’s the most unstoppable player I’ve ever seen. No one could come halfway close to guarding him.

i view the lebron/Jordan a lot like Manning/Brady. I think their careers are All so similar. I used to have MJ & Brady but what made me change my mind was When manning and lebron proved that their teams (colts and Cavs 2x) go from championship contender to literal worst teams in the league instantly, and they go and win titles and had great seasons in their next stop. The patriots were a good team without Brady into his run won 10 games i think. The bulls won one less game and won a playoff series without MJ his first retirement. So i think it’s safe to say they had a far better situation from top to bottom than manning or lebron.

Maybe it’s foolish or unfair Bc Jordan didn’t really get that chance, Bc not counting his wizards boredom. But hopefully Brady has a good one or two left in him to spice up the debate again.
 
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#126,495
#126,495
HankHill said:
Shaq doesn’t have the longevity that other more accomplished players have, but for like a 5 year stretch... he’s the most unstoppable player I’ve ever seen. No one could come halfway close to guarding him.

i view the lebron/Jordan a lot like Manning/Brady. I think their careers are All so similar. I used to have MJ & Brady but what made me change my mind was When manning and lebron proved that their teams (colts and Cavs 2x) go from championship contender to literal worst teams in the league instantly, and they go and win titles and had great seasons in their next stop. The patriots were a good team without Brady into his run won 10 games i think. The bulls won one less game and won a playoff series without MJ his first retirement. So i think it’s safe to say they had a far better situation from top to bottom than manning or lebron.

Maybe it’s foolish or unfair Bc Jordan didn’t really get that chance, Bc not counting his wizards boredom. But hopefully Brady has a good one or two left in him to spice up the debate again.
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Personally, I'm pulling for Brady to fall on his face.
 
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#126,496
#126,496
Pepe said:
One theory is to take control of the market and sell the stuff cheap, those who want to take advantage of the legality can just go ahead and kill themselves with the stuff, and therefore clean out the gene pool. Darwinism at its finest
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"Clean out the gene pool"? Those are people. I know some joke about things like that, but in reality it would probably mean someone they know dying.

Would rather rehab and educate. Each purchase comes with education and opportunity to rehab.
 
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#126,497
#126,497
MarcoVol said:
For the sake of argument, I think you’d have to look at the legal marijuana model. You have to apply for a permit to operate a grow farm.

Illegal grow farms are punished, just like illegal cook houses would be punished.
Click to expand...

But I think that's silly too. Marijuana can be naturally grown and done so with no danger to anyone (unlike meth). And there can be some benefits to using marijuana (unlike meth). For the government to make it "legal" is just a way to make money off it. I think it should be legal the same way growing fruits and vegetables is legal.
 
#126,498
#126,498
ndubvols said:
Not even close. It’ll reduce the population for a little while but that’s about it.

If you were to suggest being more lenient in some drug cases and creating a path for education and reintegration into society then it’d have a little more merit.

Legalizing all drugs fixes the prison system is a laughable argument.
Click to expand...

47% of federal prison inmates are there for drug offenses.
 
#126,499
#126,499
HankHill said:
Shaq doesn’t have the longevity that other more accomplished players have, but for like a 5 year stretch... he’s the most unstoppable player I’ve ever seen. No one could come halfway close to guarding him.

i view the lebron/Jordan a lot like Manning/Brady. I think their careers are All so similar. I used to have MJ & Brady but what made me change my mind was When manning and lebron proved that their teams (colts and Cavs 2x) go from championship contender to literal worst teams in the league instantly, and they go and win titles and had great seasons in their next stop. The patriots were a good team without Brady into his run won 10 games i think. The bulls won one less game and won a playoff series without MJ his first retirement. So i think it’s safe to say they had a far better situation from top to bottom than manning or lebron.

Maybe it’s foolish or unfair Bc Jordan didn’t really get that chance, Bc not counting his wizards boredom. But hopefully Brady has a good one or two left in him to spice up the debate again.
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The main talking point Brady will always have is championships. But honestly I never liked that argument, for many reasons you spelled out above. Same goes for MJ.

Just like in the 90s, the debate was over guys that were winning championships, but honestly I think Marino was the best of that era and he didn't win a dang thing.
 
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