Gun control debate (merged)

#12,276
#12,276
luthervol said:
There is none. Never has been, never will be. What point does that make?
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That anyone can make pointless straw man arguments in an effort to make their stance appear better than it is.

Also enjoy continuing to point out how much you dont care about lives, and how much you only care about guns. Society kills millions, and you are fine and even cheer on the principals behind those societies. People with guns kill a few thousand nd suddenly the loss of life matters.
 
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#12,277
#12,277
luthervol said:
Compare gun violence in our country and countries with stricter laws.
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If laws work, then explain all the murder. Last I checked, that was illegal. If gun laws work, then explain Chicago. Strictest laws, but most shootings.
 
#12,278
#12,278
hog88 said:
Rational and reasonable people, not horribly despicable ones favor individual liberty and freedoms. Irrational and unreasonable horribly despicable people don't want the inherent dangers that come with being free and prefer horrendously despicable irrational and unreasonable controls on their life.
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Seems as though every society throughout recorded history has reluctantly been forced to reach the conclusion that individuals must have rational and reasonable restrictions for the benefit of society at large.
Blame that fact on the fact that some individuals just suck.
 
#12,279
#12,279
hog88 said:
Coming from someone that is neither rational or reasonable I can see how you would find a rational and reasonable conversation about liberty and rights to be irrational and unreasonable.
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I love liberty and rights, and what is necessary to insure them to the greatest number of individuals.
 
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#12,280
#12,280
luthervol said:
Seems as though every society throughout recorded history has reluctantly been forced to reach the conclusion that individuals must have rational and reasonable restrictions for the benefit of society at large.
Blame that fact on the fact that some individuals just suck.
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All rational and reasonable restrictions boil down to one thing, don't hurt other people. Any further restrictions, laws or regulations are useless and irrational and unreasonable.
 
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#12,282
#12,282
LouderVol said:
That anyone can make pointless straw man arguments in an effort to make their stance appear better than it is.

Also enjoy continuing to point out how much you dont care about lives, and how much you only care about guns. Society kills millions, and you are fine and even cheer on the principals behind those societies. People with guns kill a few thousand nd suddenly the loss of life matters.
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Your post makes no sense to me. I'm not sure what it is you are inferring.
 
#12,285
#12,285
hog88 said:
Rational and reasonable people, not horribly despicable ones favor individual liberty and freedoms. Irrational and unreasonable horribly despicable people don't want the inherent dangers that come with being free and prefer horrendously despicable irrational and unreasonable controls on their life.
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Yea, I'm still for reduced speed limits in school zones and DUI laws.
 
#12,286
#12,286
hog88 said:
All rational and reasonable restrictions boil down to one thing, don't hurt other people. Any further restrictions, laws or regulations are useless and irrational and unreasonable.
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Some feel child porn doesn't hurt other people. Some feel selling drugs to minors doesn't hurt other people. Some feel releasing a poisonous gas as a byproduct of a manufacturing process doesn't hurt other people. Someone has to decide what in fact does hurt other people.
 
#12,288
#12,288
luthervol said:
Some feel child porn doesn't hurt other people. Some feel selling drugs to minors doesn't hurt other people. Some feel releasing a poisonous gas as a byproduct of a manufacturing process doesn't hurt other people. Someone has to decide what in fact does hurt other people.
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Some could say you are ruining the legacy of Don Knotts.
 
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#12,289
#12,289
luthervol said:
Some feel child porn doesn't hurt other people. Some feel selling drugs to minors doesn't hurt other people. Some feel releasing a poisonous gas as a byproduct of a manufacturing process doesn't hurt other people. Someone has to decide what in fact does hurt other people.
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People that feel child porn doesn't hurt other people are not reasonable or rational.

The rest of your post is irrational and unreasonable gibberish.
 
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#12,290
#12,290
luthervol said:
Your post makes no sense to me. I'm not sure what it is you are inferring.
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You dont care about lives.

You are really against rifles, what you know as assault weapons, despite them being a tiny fraction of gun deaths. You dont rail against any of the other 50 things, I am sure that is not much of an exaggeration, that more commonly are used to murder people.

Ergo, you dont care about the lives lost, because you are choosing something way down the list. Instead what you care about is the gun. You dont hold a consistent view point. Meaning it is neither rational nor reasonable.

What makes a lot more sense in an Occams Razor sense, is that you care about controlling people. Not protecting them or ensuring their wellbeing. You have to go on a huge walk around, way down the list of lives lost, to get to your point. Whistling past several graveyards ypu refuse to acknowledge or see how they are tied to your stance.
 
#12,292
#12,292
luthervol said:
They reduced what would have been an even higher gun violence rate.
Plus, Chicago pays the price for inadequate gun laws in surrounding areas.
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So the city with the strictest gun laws, and has more shootings in a week than the country combined, is benefiting from said laws?😂😂
 
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#12,293
#12,293
hog88 said:
People that feel child porn doesn't hurt other people are not reasonable or rational.

The rest of your post is irrational and unreasonable gibberish.
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So you're good with selling drugs to minors and releasing poisonous gas?
 
#12,294
#12,294
luthervol said:
Some feel child porn doesn't hurt other people. Some feel selling drugs to minors doesn't hurt other people. Some feel releasing a poisonous gas as a byproduct of a manufacturing process doesn't hurt other people. Someone has to decide what in fact does hurt other people.
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Everything you described above was an action.
What you are arguing against is an object.

Again, no consistency in your arguments. If you were consistent you would argue against all porn, because their might be kiddie porn. You would argue against all drugs, because some may end up with minors, you would argue against the creation of poisous gases, because they might be released.

But you dont. You argue the use of those objects. But when it comes to guns, you dont care how they are used. Probably because 99.9999999% of them dont hurt anyone. You just care about the object. Complete inconsistency.
 
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#12,296
#12,296
LouderVol said:
Everything you described above was an action.
What you are arguing against is an object.

Again, no consistency in your arguments. If you were consistent you would argue against all porn, because their might be kiddie porn. You would argue against all drugs, because some may end up with minors, you would argue against the creation of poisous gases, because they might be released.

But you dont. You argue the use of those objects. But when it comes to guns, you dont care how they are used. Probably because 99.9999999% of them dont hurt anyone. You just care about the object. Complete inconsistency.
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Well said. I can't fathom how the "educated" side doesn't understand this.
 
#12,298
#12,298
LouderVol said:
You dont care about lives.

You are really against rifles, what you know as assault weapons, despite them being a tiny fraction of gun deaths. You dont rail against any of the other 50 things, I am sure that is not much of an exaggeration, that more commonly are used to murder people.

Ergo, you dont care about the lives lost, because you are choosing something way down the list. Instead what you care about is the gun. You dont hold a consistent view point. Meaning it is neither rational nor reasonable.

What makes a lot more sense in an Occams Razor sense, is that you care about controlling people. Not protecting them or ensuring their wellbeing. You have to go on a huge walk around, way down the list of lives lost, to get to your point. Whistling past several graveyards ypu refuse to acknowledge or see how they are tied to your stance.
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That's a butt load of accusation with no supporting detail.
I'll just say.....not true.
Feel free to be more specific.
 
#12,300
#12,300
LouderVol said:
Everything you described above was an action.
What you are arguing against is an object.

Again, no consistency in your arguments. If you were consistent you would argue against all porn, because their might be kiddie porn. You would argue against all drugs, because some may end up with minors, you would argue against the creation of poisous gases, because they might be released.

But you dont. You argue the use of those objects. But when it comes to guns, you dont care how they are used. Probably because 99.9999999% of them dont hurt anyone. You just care about the object. Complete inconsistency.
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When have I ever argued against all guns?
 
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