Official Gramps' Memorial Eternal OT Thread

[AM64]

One comment that shocked me from the game was they said we only had 69 healthy players/particiapting. That's almost 20% of our team gone. Including several defensive starters.

Also why coaches can't just dump players that need to go. The NCAA is going to have to loosen up the 25 per year recruiting, and dump early signing. If they don't, expect every team going through coaching change to never recover. My first thought on early signing was that teams with new coaches were truly screwed ... and it hasn't changed at all.

Remember Johnny Major's struggles here vs success at Pitt. His first class at Pitt was somewhere around 70 ... including a guy named Dorsett. By the time he got to Tennessee the NCAA made recruiting something completely different.

 

[Mick]

I was hoping anybody besides JG. I haven't liked him from day 1 two years ago.
I really didn't care for that attitude of his when he was sitting there on the bench fuming about not playing.
Now that he's the starting QB and losing every game you'd think the coaches would have enough sense to change him out.....if not working very good. What's to hurt if you put in #2 or #3 QB....can't be worse.

If people didn't sour on him seeing him pouting on the sideline, getting the starting job the next week and him leading us to what a 6 and 16 record since, I don't know what will.

 

[AM64]

My spectators evaluation of JG is he has poor peripheral vision. That's the main thing and that is something you cannot teach. That hinders his ability to be elusive as well as him throwing into coverage. It really is like he either goes to the pre snap read receiver or the checkdown. I don't think he know where the other receivers are going to be once the ball is snapped and he does not have the vision to scan the field.

I think JG can't handle pressure. The student who knows the subject matter, but freezes under the pressure of a test ... something I really struggled with, so I recognize it when I see it. Stage fright perhaps in other terms.

 

[1972 Grad]

I think JG can't handle pressure. The student who knows the subject matter, but freezes under the pressure of a test ... something I really struggled with, so I recognize it when I see it. Stage fright perhaps in other terms.

AKA ...performance anxiety.

 

[Mick]

I think JG can't handle pressure. The student who knows the subject matter, but freezes under the pressure of a test ... something I really struggled with, so I recognize it when I see it. Stage fright perhaps in other terms.

He makes bad throws without pressure.

 

[RavinDave]

Not really. We had a couple of should have been ints just like they did. He missed some wide open passes. I particularly remember one which would have been a td to their right end. Held the ball way too long, hence several of the sacks.

They won because their D figured out our run, and a bust by our D.

Their QB getting too much credit.

You make a good point but as I said in replying to another poster, I’m not saying he was great. Not at all. Probably near or even a bit below average if compared against all the college QBs who played on Saturday. But I do think their QB play was, on balance, a little better than ours and if that balance was flipped the Vols win.

 

[AM64]

He makes bad throws without pressure.

It's simply being in the game that he can't seem to handle. He'd probably be great at backyard football ... with dreams of the NFL.

 

[LouderVol]

You make a good point but as I said in replying to another poster, I’m not saying he was great. Not at all. Probably near or even a bit below average if compared against all the college QBs who played on Saturday. But I do think their QB play was, on balance, a little better than ours and if that balance was flipped the Vols win.

On this close of a game it's hard to say. Why pass when we had a run game that was killing it? Easily our best in a long time. 230ish yards on the ground with a lead, is not the time to air it out.

The balance was made on that one last play. Otherwise they are eerily similar. So I dont agree that they got better performance.

He was 19/29 for 230ish yards 1 td
JG was 17/29 for 180ish yards, 2 tds 1 int.

Last year people wanted JG to take more risks and throw more 50 50 balls. That means more INTs. JG, with only two games as a barometer, is on pace to double his tds, and increase yardage by 500-700.

Seems like the only metric people care about is wins, because he has improved. Is he great? No. Is he even decent, he maybe. He has also consistently put up better stats than Dobbs thru the air. But he doesnt win so he is crap apparently. Seems like a real crap argument

 

[RavinDave]

On this close of a game it's hard to say. Why pass when we had a run game that was killing it? Easily our best in a long time. 230ish yards on the ground with a lead, is not the time to air it out.

The balance was made on that one last play. Otherwise they are eerily similar. So I dont agree that they got better performance.

He was 19/29 for 230ish yards 1 td
JG was 17/29 for 180ish yards, 2 tds 1 int.

Last year people wanted JG to take more risks and throw more 50 50 balls. That means more INTs. JG, with only two games as a barometer, is on pace to double his tds, and increase yardage by 500-700.

Seems like the only metric people care about is wins, because he has improved. Is he great? No. Is he even decent, he maybe. He has also consistently put up better stats than Dobbs thru the air. But he doesnt win so he is crap apparently. Seems like a real crap argument

I certainly hope he plays to his potential from here on out but to my eye his play has not been as good as last year, stats notwithstanding.

 

[AM64]

On this close of a game it's hard to say. Why pass when we had a run game that was killing it? Easily our best in a long time. 230ish yards on the ground with a lead, is not the time to air it out.

The balance was made on that one last play. Otherwise they are eerily similar. So I dont agree that they got better performance.

He was 19/29 for 230ish yards 1 td
JG was 17/29 for 180ish yards, 2 tds 1 int.

Last year people wanted JG to take more risks and throw more 50 50 balls. That means more INTs. JG, with only two games as a barometer, is on pace to double his tds, and increase yardage by 500-700.

Seems like the only metric people care about is wins, because he has improved. Is he great? No. Is he even decent, he maybe. He has also consistently put up better stats than Dobbs thru the air. But he doesnt win so he is crap apparently. Seems like a real crap argument

Yeah, but when things went to crap, Dobbs was at his best. He made something of nothing so often that people forgot how good he really was. I'd take Dobbs ability to run any day over JG's "ability" to pass; JG's running would be laughable if it didn't mean losing.

 

[VolStrom]

I'm apathetic. I was a fan through the Majors era to the Fulmer dynasty to the lost decade and beyond. Let the next generation take over and show us what they can do.

 

[McDad]

My spectators evaluation of JG is he has poor peripheral vision. That's the main thing and that is something you cannot teach. That hinders his ability to be elusive as well as him throwing into coverage. It really is like he either goes to the pre snap read receiver or the checkdown. I don't think he know where the other receivers are going to be once the ball is snapped and he does not have the vision to scan the field.

if that is accurate, and it isn't something which can be taught, we have no choice. We either have to dumb down the offense further or bring in another QB.

 

[McDad]

Also why coaches can't just dump players that need to go. The NCAA is going to have to loosen up the 25 per year recruiting, and dump early signing. If they don't, expect every team going through coaching change to never recover. My first thought on early signing was that teams with new coaches were truly screwed ... and it hasn't changed at all.

Remember Johnny Major's struggles here vs success at Pitt. His first class at Pitt was somewhere around 70 ... including a guy named Dorsett. By the time he got to Tennessee the NCAA made recruiting something completely different.

I think the recruiting maximum of 25 really does protect the student athlete. Unfortunately, the maximum creates a more difficult climb to relevancy and it helps the dynasties remain the top dogs.

 

[AM64]

I think the recruiting maximum of 25 really does protect the student athlete. Unfortunately, the maximum creates a more difficult climb to relevancy and it helps the dynasties remain the top dogs.

I get what you mean about protecting the "student athlete", but it doesn't do much for real students who want to be athletes - most who walk on don't get to play. But that's for the NFL and NCAA to hammer out some day - I hope.

The funny thing is that the NCAA 25 rule has done some really strange things to parity. It appears to be keeping dynasties dynasties while tending to equalize the rest. God help the dynasty that gets in a coaching change with players who don't like the new guy (especially with early signing) ... the fall will be sudden and not pretty.

 

[ajvol01]

I think the recruiting maximum of 25 really does protect the student athlete. Unfortunately, the maximum creates a more difficult climb to relevancy and it helps the dynasties remain the top dogs.

It coincides almost exactly with Saban’s current 12 season run averaging 12 wins with 5 national championships.

 

[ajvol01]

I get what you mean about protecting the "student athlete", but it doesn't do much for real students who want to be athletes - most who walk on don't get to play. But that's for the NFL and NCAA to hammer out some day - I hope.

The funny thing is that the NCAA 25 rule has done some really strange things to parity. It appears to be keeping dynasties dynasties while tending to equalize the rest. God help the dynasty that gets in a coaching change with players who don't like the new guy (especially with early signing) ... the fall will be sudden and not pretty.

Hopefully Bama replaces Saban with a new guy the players don’t like.

 

[DancingOutlaw]

Hopefully Bama replaces Saban with a new guy the players don’t like.

Like his former D coordinator?

 

[McDad]

Like his former D coordinator?

too soon! at least wait until he starts collecting buyout checks.

 

[LouderVol]

I certainly hope he plays to his potential from here on out but to my eye his play has not been as good as last year, stats notwithstanding.

I am fine replacing him. I just think this is the classic example of qb getting too much credit or too much blame. Pointing out the eerily similar stats between the winner that is getting praised vs the loser who is getting dunked on.

 

[LouderVol]

Yeah, but when things went to crap, Dobbs was at his best. He made something of nothing so often that people forgot how good he really was. I'd take Dobbs ability to run any day over JG's "ability" to pass; JG's running would be laughable if it didn't mean losing.

Dobbs passing was often a loser for us too. In 15 or 16 when we were playing bama close he tossed an int at the end of the game. TAMU he ended with an int. South Carolina he threw to the 20 hoping the wr could run it in. I am sure there are more.

And as hog pointed out how many of those should it have come down to one play for us to win or lose because of his lack of passing?

 

[AM64]

I am fine replacing him. I just think this is the classic example of qb getting too much credit or too much blame. Pointing out the eerily similar stats between the winner that is getting praised vs the loser who is getting dunked on.

That's true. I always like the thing about the "winning touchdown" ... like the previous five are insignificant events. However, with respect to the QB, virtually every offensive play goes directly through his hands, and that alone makes him the lightning rod for praise or failure.

 

[AM64]

Dobbs passing was often a loser for us too. In 15 or 16 when we were playing bama close he tossed an int at the end of the game. TAMU he ended with an int. South Carolina he threw to the 20 hoping the wr could run it in. I am sure there are more.

And as hog pointed out how many of those should it have come down to one play for us to win or lose because of his lack of passing?

I can't deny that, but Dobbs was often the spark that kept us in contention against better competition in the first place. With a Dobbs rather than a JG, I can't see us being 0-2 right now.

 

[LouderVol]

That's true. I always like the thing about the "winning touchdown" ... like the previous five are insignificant events. However, with respect to the QB, virtually every offensive play goes directly through his hands, and that alone makes him the lightning rod for praise or failure.

True. I just tend to break down performances. Who is playing winning ball all game, maybe only our RBs and Jennings. Who is playing losing ball, our run defense and safeties. Then there is everyone else that on good or great teams gets covered by the rest, or are brought down on the losing teams. JG falls into the middle ground.

He isnt winning games for us by himself. But he isnt losing games for us.

Like if you didnt know the outcome of the game, just read the players stats how would you feel. JG had great stats against Georgia State, you dont see the ones he gets away with. But just looking at his stats you would say we should have won that.

Byu were meh stats. Less than 200 yards passing isnt good. But two tds is. 60 percent passing is good not great. That's game manager stats. Which we need better than, but again I find it hard to blame the guy doing his job, running the offense as the first sacrifice on the pyre.

 

[RavinDave]

I am fine replacing him. I just think this is the classic example of qb getting too much credit or too much blame. Pointing out the eerily similar stats between the winner that is getting praised vs the loser who is getting dunked on.

I hear you. Had UT stopped their final drive in regulation and came away with a win, JG would not be the punching bag he is right now. From that perspective I agree with you 100%.

 

[LouderVol]

I can't deny that, but Dobbs was often the spark that kept us in contention against better competition in the first place. With a Dobbs rather than a JG, I can't see us being 0-2 right now.

I dont disagree but we dont have a Dobbs.