Recruiting Forum Football Talk [RIP 9.3.2019]

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#112,326
#112,326
GoVolsDR said:
Did anyone ever figure out why Malik was dismissed from FSU in the first place? Normally things get leaked, but that was a situation where information on that situation still is non-existent.
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After watching LCU I think it's safe to say he easily could have been dismissed for just being himself. It woudnt have to be one major incident imo
 
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#112,327
#112,327
SugarCC said:
2002: yes, #7 defense. It was also the same defense that gave up 41 to the Jets in that playoff game. Chad Pennington went 19-25 for 222 yds, and 3TDs . The Jets also had 180 yds rushing as a team on 42 carries (4.2 ypc), and 2 more TDs. That's 396 yds of total offense. The Colt defense allowed the Jets to score 3TDs and kick a FG on 5 first half possessions, and 2TDs and a FG on 4 second half possessions. Yes, Manning played horrible, but the Colts had only 52 yds rushing as a team, as well; missing a FG and fumbling on the first 3 possessions of the game. Manning's 2 ints came after the game was long over.

2005: yes, the #2 defense. It was also the same defense that gave up 300 total yds on 68 plays, and 21 first downs to the Steelers in that playoff game. Rothliesberger was 14-24 for 197 yds and 2TDs; and the Steelers also rushed for 112 yds, and another score. The Steelers scored 2 TDs in their first 3 possessions. Manning was 22-38 for 290 yds and a touchdown; and only got 58 yds rushing as a team. Yes, the D created two turnovers, including the fumble that led to Manning marching them into FG range, and Mike Vanderjagt missing a 46 yd FG to send it to OT...Adam Vinatieri doesn't miss that FG.

2007: yes, the #1 defense. It was also the same defense that gave up 411 total yds to the Chargers in that playoff game. Rivers was 17-23 for 312 yds, and 3 TDs. San Diego also had 99 yds rushing as a team, and another TD. Manning was 33-48 for 402 yds, 3TDs and 2 INTs. Indy had 44 yds rushing as a team.

2008: yes, the #7 defense. It was also the same defense that gave up 357 total yds to the Chargers in that playoff game. San Diego had 167 yds rushing and 3 TDs on 33 carries (5 ypc). Indy had 64 yds rushing on 22 carries (2.9 ypc). Manning was 25-42 for 310 yds and a touchdown.

2009: yes, the #8 defense. It was also the same defense that allowed Drew Brees to set a Super Bowl record with 32 completions on 39 attempts (that's 7 incompletions out of 39 attempts), for 288 yds and 2 TDs; while also failing to stop drives that eat up almost the entire 2nd and 3rd quarters...Manning hardly saw the field during this time. Also, if Pierre Garcon could catch, he takes a Manning pass to the house and scores, making it 17-3, and maybe dealing a major blow. Instead, he drops a sure TD, Indy has to punt. Saints go down and kick a FG cutting it to 10-6; then they get onside kick coming out of half, go down and score, and the rest is history.

2012: yes, the #4 defense. It was also the same defense that gave up 38 points to Baltimore in that playoff game, and 479 total yds of offense; not to mention the bomb by Flacco that set up the winning FG. Flacco was 18-34 for 331 yds and 3TDs; not to mention the Ravens rushed for 155 yds on 39 carries (4 ypc).

Manning having top ranked defenses that stayed top ranked in the playoffs is a myth, as well.
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I like your argument, but the fact is is that whether Peyton or Brady was the greatest, it doesn't really matter because at the end of the day Brady has 6 and Manning's got 2, it's a lot like the Jordan vs. Lebron debate, is Lebron the greatest ever? Possibly in fact even probably, as far as being the best all-around player, but the deciding factor between greatness a lot of times is winning, I can't personally tell you who's arm is stronger, who's better at reading defenses, or who's more accurate. What I can tell you is Brady's got more rings than he can fit on one hand and Peyton on the other hand has two, and the second was won by Von Miller and Demarcus Ware. Let me finish with this, I was and am the biggest Peyton fan (in my mind) on earth but ultimately my fanhood is not going to keep me from giving an unbiased opinion.
 
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#112,329
#112,329
I am actually not sure how well Belicek's and Payton's personalities would have meshed. I think that they still win a lot, but I don't think that they have the same rapport as Brady and Hoodie. Don't @ me.
 
#112,330
#112,330
engineerVOL said:
That’s a big boom though.
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Indeed. He's not announcing until 4pm Wednesday which means this place is going to be a cesspool of negativity and doubt all day long unless Pickens and/or Tootoo picks UT in an upset. And I wouldn't doubt it at all if some out of left field 3 star guy gets the go ahead and signs Wednesday which will add fuel to the already burning fire.

My best advice to all is to stay away from VN until 4pm when Wright announces. It won't be pretty leading up to that announcement most likely.
 
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#112,331
#112,331
BucVol98 said:
I like your argument, but the fact is is that whether Peyton or Brady was the greatest, it doesn't really matter because at the end of the day Brady has 6 and Manning's got 2, it's a lot like the Jordan vs. Lebron debate, is Lebron the greatest ever? Possibly in fact even probably, as far as being the best all-around player, but the deciding factor between greatness a lot of times is winning, I can't personally tell you who's arm is stronger, who's better at reading defenses, or who's more accurate. What I can tell you is Brady's got more rings than he can fit on one hand and Peyton on the other hand has two, and the second was won by Von Miller and Demarcus Ware. Let me finish with this, I was and am the biggest Peyton fan (in my mind) on earth but ultimately my fanhood is not going to keep me from giving an unbiased opinion.
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Football is the ultimate team sport. Rings matter least of all when deciding greatness. That's like saying Edelman is greater than Calvin Johnson. It's asinine.

Brady did jack squat all night except one good pass to Gronk. The defense won the game, and more accurately Belichick won the game like he has every other super bowl the Patriots have won. Tom Brady is a really good QB who gets way more credit than he deserves.

If you were starting a franchise, and you could only choose one, would you take Belichick, Brady, or Aaron Rodgers? I think just about everyone would choose Brady last of those 3. I doubt he ever wins a super bowl without Belichick. He's not the GOAT, he's a benefactor of the GOAT coach.

Your championships argument holds a lot more water in basketball where the game can be much more affected by a single player. I'd still argue the supporting cast matters a lot more than you're giving it credit for though.
 
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#112,332
#112,332
titansvolsfaninga said:
It is possible to be a VOL fan and not worship Manning. Manning is good QB, but there are better QB's that have played. Hell, Tee Martin took basically the same team and won a NC.
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Terrible.

Martin was barely good enough to not screw up that Natty. It was about Defense & the single best RB group to ever be on the same team together.

Lewis doesn't get injured and that team would have been dominating.

Team stats (wins & championships) defining QB greatest is pure stupidity in my opinion. Patriots have one of the greatest HCs to ever do it and he is the best defensive mine ever to be in the NFL.

Like people forget Peyton was playing for a Natty and then the defense got steamrolled...500+ yards and 42 points (21 in the 3rd quarter).
 
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#112,333
#112,333
Ron Swanson said:
Indeed. He's not announcing until 4pm Wednesday which means this place is going to be a cesspool of negativity and doubt all day long unless Pickens and/or Tootoo picks UT in an upset. And I wouldn't doubt it at all if some out of left field 3 star guy gets the go ahead and signs Wednesday which will add fuel to the already burning fire.

My best advice to all is to stay away from VN until 4pm when Wright announces. It won't be pretty leading up to that announcement most likely.
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Only the people who don't come around much will be on here expecting things that were never happening.
 
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#112,334
#112,334
BucVol98 said:
I like your argument, but the fact is is that whether Peyton or Brady was the greatest, it doesn't really matter because at the end of the day Brady has 6 and Manning's got 2, it's a lot like the Jordan vs. Lebron debate, is Lebron the greatest ever? Possibly in fact even probably, as far as being the best all-around player, but the deciding factor between greatness a lot of times is winning, I can't personally tell you who's arm is stronger, who's better at reading defenses, or who's more accurate. What I can tell you is Brady's got more rings than he can fit on one hand and Peyton on the other hand has two, and the second was won by Von Miller and Demarcus Ware. Let me finish with this, I was and am the biggest Peyton fan (in my mind) on earth but ultimately my fanhood is not going to keep me from giving an unbiased opinion.
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If Brady had won one of those rings with another team I might go for it. Fact is he is a really good QB that is exactly what Belichick needed, but people will give him the credit for the great teams he played on with the extraordinary coach. Saban won many championships with ordinary QBs. So if you only count rings he wins. But it's funny how no other position gets greatest of all time for the number of rings they have.
 
#112,337
#112,337
Ron Swanson said:
Indeed. He's not announcing until 4pm Wednesday which means this place is going to be a cesspool of negativity and doubt all day long unless Pickens and/or Tootoo picks UT in an upset. And I wouldn't doubt it at all if some out of left field 3 star guy gets the go ahead and signs Wednesday which will add fuel to the already burning fire.

My best advice to all is to stay away from VN until 4pm when Wright announces. It won't be pretty leading up to that announcement most likely.
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I hope Christopher Russell has a ceremony and proceeds to throw the Tennessee hat across the room for good measure 😆 I’ll pop some corn and enjoy the chaos.
 
#112,340
#112,340
MoCo_Vol said:
Terrible.

Martin was barely good enough to not screw up that Natty. It was about Defense & the single best RB group to ever be on the same team together.

Lewis doesn't get injured and that team would have been dominating.

Team stats (wins & championships) defining QB greatest is pure stupidity in my opinion. Patriots have one of the greatest HCs to ever do it and he is the best defensive mine ever to be in the NFL.

Like people forget Peyton was playing for a Natty and then the defense got steamrolled...500+ yards and 42 points (21 in the 3rd quarter).
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And Manning couldn't do it because? Basically the same team...right? Manning still lost to Florida. What are you talking about?

Just can't seem to give Tee his credit for the NC. The team only had 114 rushing yards in the National Championship game....Tee had 2 TD passes.
 
#112,342
#112,342
quadlee21 said:
"INSIDERS KEEP TELLING US to keep an eye on VFL Terry Fair after NSD #2. We’ve been hearing for some time that Pruitt isn’t in love with Fair and may make a move after recruiting is finished"

Basilio's Orange Throat this morning on his blog.
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Would not suprise me. I could see him go to off field role. He is not proving to be a big time recruiter and the more I look at our defensive staff without Kelly we really need another elite recruiter on that side of ball.
 
#112,343
#112,343
jave36 said:
Football is the ultimate team sport. Rings matter least of all when deciding greatness. That's like saying Edelman is greater than Calvin Johnson. It's asinine.

Brady did jack squat all night except one good pass to Gronk. The defense won the game, and more accurately Belichick won the game like he has every other super bowl the Patriots have won. Tom Brady is a really good QB who gets way more credit than he deserves.

If you were starting a franchise, and you could only choose one, would you take Belichick, Brady, or Aaron Rodgers? I think just about everyone would choose Brady last of those 3. I doubt he ever wins a super bowl without Belichick. He's not the GOAT, he's a benefactor of the GOAT coach.

Your championships argument holds a lot more water in basketball where the game can be much more affected by a single player. I'd still argue the supporting cast matters a lot more than you're giving it credit for though.
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But if wins don't really mean anything then everything becomes to objective and opinionated, yeah Peyton has better stats than Brady but if statistics are the end all be all of the sport then it won't be long till you can make the argument that Brees is easily the greatest of all time based on the stats, and that's when Vol fans will be like.... but Peyton has more rings, the fact is whether it's a Team sport or not QB is the most important position on the field and has the most impact and Brady has been statistically great as well as has 3 times as many Super Bowls, and btw the defense argument can be played against Manning in his last superbowl because Von Miller and Demarcus Ware won him that one
 
#112,344
#112,344
SweetasSoda said:
If Brady had won one of those rings with another team I might go for it. Fact is he is a really good QB that is exactly what Belichick needed, but people will give him the credit for the great teams he played on with the extraordinary coach. Saban won many championships with ordinary QBs. So if you only count rings he wins. But it's funny how no other position gets greatest of all time for the number of rings they have.
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Bama might have had Avg. QB's but every other position sure isn't average. I get that Belichick is the GOAT, no debate here and I think Peyton is cemented as #2 but the fact is that Rings have to matter, how many rings would Peyton win with Belichick? We'll never know but the fact still remains that wins matter in my book and most people's books that don't wear orange tinted glasses (which I do most of the time).
 
#112,345
#112,345
Kamaldeep Singh on LinkedIn: "“Good Training Is Priceless.” The strength of individual greatness makes a great team...‍♂️ Good Wishes To All Of My Lovely Overseas Or Indian Linkies Family Members Have A Spectacular Day Ahead From India Stay tuned! Stay connected! Stay blessed! Keep Sharing Positive Vibes Always Keep Smiling Always Guys #linkedin #inspiration #hope #nevergiveup #determination #passion #hustle #motivate #focus #believeinyourself #confidence #nevergiveup #excuses #neverfail #dedication #motivation #mindset #mylovelylinkie #efforts #positiveness #bepositive #education #life #learning #happiness #respect #author #CIO #CEO #organisations #executive #professional #teambuilding #teamwork #teammanagement #teamspirit #entrepreneurship #business #work #willpower #sportsmen #sportsspirit #sport #basketball #player "
 
#112,346
#112,346
SmokinBob said:
Kamaldeep Singh on LinkedIn: "“Good Training Is Priceless.” The strength of individual greatness makes a great team...‍♂️ Good Wishes To All Of My Lovely Overseas Or Indian Linkies Family Members Have A Spectacular Day Ahead From India Stay tuned! Stay connected! Stay blessed! Keep Sharing Positive Vibes Always Keep Smiling Always Guys #linkedin #inspiration #hope #nevergiveup #determination #passion #hustle #motivate #focus #believeinyourself #confidence #nevergiveup #excuses #neverfail #dedication #motivation #mindset #mylovelylinkie #efforts #positiveness #bepositive #education #life #learning #happiness #respect #author #CIO #CEO #organisations #executive #professional #teambuilding #teamwork #teammanagement #teamspirit #entrepreneurship #business #work #willpower #sportsmen #sportsspirit #sport #basketball #player "
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Holy hashtag....
 
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#112,347
#112,347
titansvolsfaninga said:
And Manning couldn't do it because? Basically the same team...right? Manning still lost to Florida. What are you talking about?

Just can't seem to give Tee his credit for the NC. The team only had 114 rushing yards in the National Championship game....Tee had 2 TD passes.
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What about the pick 6?

Tee gets his credit man. And believe me, I love him for that season, but he was a 57% passer with less than 2500 total yards who had a total of 27 TDs.

The defense was 8th in scoring defense, previous year was 42nd...not the "same" defense at all. Team rushing (without Tee's numbers) went for 2249 & 20 TDs.

Tee won us our only modern day championship, and he deserves all the credit he gets. But he isn't Peyton Manning, Andy Kelly, Heath Shuler, Clausen or even Dobbs. You're welcome to disagree though, but to me that team was all about how great of a defense we had. Even if Peyton had been at the helm I'd still point out just how good Chavis & company were that season.
 
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#112,349
#112,349
The guy that does the thing now isn't as good as the old guy who used to do the thing or the guy who I'm biased for who does the thing with slightly different and/or worse results. He's going to be forgotten after the new guy who doesn't yet do the thing starts doing the thing.

This is every qualitative conversation on this board in a nutshell.
 
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