You think hiring a proven HC doesn't matter?

[05_never_again]

Closer to the truth than many would like to realize....probably more about fit, relative time in the coaches career and availability of talent on a roster, as well as talent in the region.

Jones may not have been a bad coach....if he stayed non P5, but he wasn't ready for the SEC or magnitude of the task at hand. I admit, I thought he had potential to grow into it, but he was unwilling to change....and unwilling to let someone play second fiddle, even if that guy was a great fiddler. As much grief as Deboard got, I think he was a decent coach (Striplin too.....and oh hell, even Janzeck....D was better w/ that tandem), but maybe ol' CMD saw the fatal flaw wasn't going to correct itself and bailed to IU.

Yep. This is an unpopular thing to say now and people here are just too blinded by hindsight bias, but there were reasons to think Butch might actually turn out to be a pretty good coach when he was hired. Especially relative to Dooley. Unlike Dooley, he had successful and more meaningful experience as an HC. He followed Brian Kelly at both jobs, but there was a lot of attrition off those rosters once he departed. He stabilized both programs and won conference titles at both schools after Kelly left, both with and without Kelly's players. I thought that given his track record at Central Mich and Cincy he was probably a decent tactician and talent developer but concerned about his recruiting chops. Shows you how much I know. He turned out to be the exact opposite. It seems pretty clear now that his teams were good because he simply out-recruited MAC and Big East competition, and you can be the best team in your conference by doing that at that level.

Butch I think is still perfectly capable of being a pretty good coach at a G5 school again. The thing that stunned me the single most about him is how out of whack his perception of the expectations was with the reality. Butch always seemed to believe that having 2015 and 2016 as the pinnacles of his career here was fantastic and something that the fanbase should be over the moon with. He never really understood just how big a deal football is here, which is amazing considering he was a professional college football coach.

 

[05_never_again]

We do. Some of these posters are damn moronic. When Alabama hired Nick Saban his first year, NO ONE was ready to get rid of him because the Bama fans realized it takes time for him to put in his system and get his players. We have a hell of a coach. But we also have a fan base that seems to ONLY look at the negatives. Noah also didn’t build his big a** ark in one day. Chill out. We will see something unexpected this year that wasn’t supposed to happen, then we’ll have people to name a street after Pruitt. We’re way to dramatic, smh...
Go big

Not exactly. Don't give their fanbase at large that kind of credit. There was quite a bit of angst after that first season, particularly after the Louisiana-Monroe loss. Way more than any of our fans currently have with Pruitt. They had very high expectations. I remember hearing a lot of "Well hell, Shula blew them out last year and now Saban can't beat them?!" Of course in classic Saban fashion, he's managed to surpass the wildest dreams of even their most delusional fans. I don't even think Harvey Updyke thought they'd win 5 titles in 11 years.

Saban is lucky he made them a national contender again in year 2 instead of year 4, because if he didn't return them to prominence in 3 years there probably wouldn't have been a year 4. Remember, he took that job having flopped in Miami and not having the greatest reputation because of how he left. He was viewed as a good coach then, but certainly not in the same way he is viewed today.

 

[JMSqb11]

you need to go back and read stj's post again.

you called the TN fan base idiotic as a reference point of why mullen wouldn't want to come here.

stj said "idiotic enough to fire a guy before the end of his 3rd year who had won the East the two previous years "

referencing the FL fan base not being happy with Mac. Butch never won the East, so he's obviously talking about FL fans and Mac.

it wasn't ever a question of whether or not they should have fired mac. just the Mullen's perception of the "idiotic" fanbases if trying to decide which one would he rather deal with.....the ones that wanted a complete under acheiver fired? or the ones that wanted a guy fired even though he won the division twice in his 1st three years?

Florida was justified in firing their coach and it had zero to do with expectations. Even though they won the division in back to back years, there was no progress for that program. Stevie Wonder could see that. It didn't help that Mac accused his fan base of death threats and when push came to shove, he admitted he lied about it. Florida didn't fire Mac because of lofty expectations. They fired him because he lied about the fan base sending death threats and taking a repeat Division winning team to 4-7.... Florida had the equivalent of Butch Jones in Mac. Only difference were the division titles. If he didn't lie about the death threats, he would likely still be there on the hot seat for this year. But him lying about death threats were an easy way for Florida to fire him because that point, the relationship was toast. And I am sorry, but saying the Florida fans idiots for being upset with last year is completely moronic. I think they are idiots and crazy 99.9% of the time. However in the Mac situation, they were completely right.

Mullen was smart enough to stay away because there is no pleasing this fan base for short term. Half the folks on the board after the first quarter of the WVU game were asking for Butch to come back or "this is what we fired Butch for"....... While I am high on Mullen and wish he would have came, he had his pick of schools to go to. He picked wisely. Everyone knew this season was going to be a wasted year and nothing to look forward too. Saban would have issues with the roster for this year. Good thing about Pruitt is he is a first time head coach so there isn't any "Well he couldn't win big at (Insert previous head coaching gig) so is anyone surprised?"

For some reason, people labeled Mullen a dud the minute it came up that he had any chance of leaving Starkville. That was an idiotic take by every person on this board and everywhere else.

With that said, Florida had a way out to cut their loser coach and upgrade a million times better. Kudos to them for it. Kudos to Pruitt for being willing to take this task on.

 

[JMSqb11]

Not exactly. Don't give their fanbase at large that kind of credit. There was quite a bit of angst after that first season, particularly after the Louisiana-Monroe loss. Way more than any of our fans currently have with Pruitt. They had very high expectations. I remember hearing a lot of "Well hell, Shula blew them out last year and now Saban can't beat them?!" Of course in classic Saban fashion, he's managed to surpass the wildest dreams of even their most delusional fans. I don't even think Harvey Updyke thought they'd win 5 titles in 11 years.

Saban is lucky he made them a national contender again in year 2 instead of year 4, because if he didn't return them to prominence in 3 years there probably wouldn't have been a year 4. Remember, he took that job having flopped in Miami and not having the greatest reputation because of how he left. He was viewed as a good coach then, but certainly not in the same way he is viewed today.

And his craziest flop was signing Culpepper over Drew Brees. Lmao!

 

[jakez4ut]

so, "hard no" on going back and reading the post?

 

[JMSqb11]

meh...not a UF fan, so no idea how the fan base felt. While his overall record as a HC isn't that bad...always thought of him as a buffoon. He definitely made a mess of things his last year...but, was 3-4 when fired; UF likely wins a couple more games if he'd just focused on the job and kept his mouth shut.

He opened the door wide for a show cause firing.....he'd probably still be the HC if he'd at least gone 5-7 or 6-6 and hadn't made the outlandish claims.

If he didn't lie about the death threats, he is still coaching.

 

[JMSqb11]

so, "hard no" on going back and reading the post?

There is nothing to read. Yall think Florida fans were crazy or "idiotic" for wanting to can Mac last year. That is not a correct or true take.

 

[sjt18]

Are you calling Jimmy Mac a great coach? You do realize they digressed every season with him, right? They won the division in first year, backed into another in year 2 and then cratered to a point where said coach accused his fan base of making death threats without offering one ounce of proof. Calling him great is something funny. Thanks for the chuckle.

You seriously missed the point that badly? Rather than respond to this non-sense... maybe you could re-read my post first then edit your response.

 

[sjt18]

you need to go back and read stj's post again.

you called the TN fan base idiotic as a reference point of why mullen wouldn't want to come here.

stj said "idiotic enough to fire a guy before the end of his 3rd year who had won the East the two previous years "

referencing the FL fan base not being happy with Mac. Butch never won the East, so he's obviously talking about FL fans and Mac.

it wasn't ever a question of whether or not they should have fired mac. just the Mullen's perception of the "idiotic" fanbases if trying to decide which one would he rather deal with.....the ones that wanted a complete under acheiver fired? or the ones that wanted a guy fired even though he won the division twice in his 1st three years?

Thanks Jake. You got it... not sure why the other guy can't.

 

[jakez4ut]

There is nothing to read. Yall think Florida fans were crazy or "idiotic" for wanting to can Mac last year. That is not a correct or true take.

FL fans were not very high on Mac at all. and by game 5 of 2017, they were done with him. on one was unhappy to see him go. they saw what we saw.

 

[jakez4ut]

Thanks Jake. You got it... not sure why the other guy can't.

no problem.

 

[Lawrence Wright]

I'm gonna go out on a limb and claim Mullen's decision to come to UF had more to do with the stability of our administration and athletic department than fear of perceived expectations from the nutjob fringe of any particular fan base.

 

[BeardedVol]

We do. Some of these posters are damn moronic. When Alabama hired Nick Saban his first year, NO ONE was ready to get rid of him because the Bama fans realized it takes time for him to put in his system and get his players. We have a hell of a coach. But we also have a fan base that seems to ONLY look at the negatives. Noah also didn’t build his big a** ark in one day. Chill out. We will see something unexpected this year that wasn’t supposed to happen, then we’ll have people to name a street after Pruitt. We’re way to dramatic, smh...
Go big

There is absolutely nothing similar between Saban's hiring by Alabama, and Pruitt's by Tennessee. To even insinuate so, is laughable at best.

 

[TGFHeupel16]

There is absolutely nothing similar between Saban's hiring by Alabama, and Pruitt's by Tennessee. To even insinuate so, is laughable at best.

As in they came from 2 different situations? Because they did. Also, Saban was coming off a “could’ve been better” stint at Miami. So I’m not really insinuating anything. Just saying, it wasn’t just Saban who struggled in his first year it was also Dabo Swinney (6-6 in the ACC) Bob Stoops, Gary Patterson, Bobby Bowden, Mike Gundy. Look at what they all did. If you know football you can tell Pruitt is a football coach. GBO

 

[Pepe]

I think this game shows our hire was solid. Best thing is I think we can keep Mullen for a looong time, unlike Chip Kelly or Frost.

It has always been my opinion that the real brains behind Urban Meyer was Mullen. After he left Florida's offense was quite ordinary. I think you have a good one.

 

[BeardedVol]

As in they came from 2 different situations? Because they did. Also, Saban was coming off a “could’ve been better” stint at Miami. So I’m not really insinuating anything. Just saying, it wasn’t just Saban who struggled in his first year it was also Dabo Swinney (6-6 in the ACC) Bob Stoops, Gary Patterson, Bobby Bowden, Mike Gundy. Look at what they all did. If you know football you can tell Pruitt is a football coach. GBO

Nick Saban had 37 years of coaching experience, 10 of those being at the HC position at P5 schools , and a national title under his belt when he want to Alabama.

Pruitt has 10 years as a high school position coach, 5 years as a collegiate position coach, and 5 years as collegiate DC.

There's literally nothing similar about Alabama making Nick Saban their one and only target in their coaching search, and the literal circus that occurred to bring Pruitt to Tennessee.

You can throw out whatever other coaches' names that you want, and it still won't make those situations, even remotely similar without the complete and utter denial of reality.

 

[GUNTERSVOL]

and he wanted to go to UF. What's your point?

Not sure what it proves.... SOS won big at FL, but SC hired him and remind me how many championships he won there.... it is possible to mess up top talent laden schools, ask Bama about guys named Mike..... But as impressive as Saban has been there I wonder what he would have done a few miles down the road at the place Mullen left.... lots of variables... no guarantees... the keys from where i sit are evaluation skills to fill the roster and development skills once you get capable guys there..... natural talent base is an element...

 

[volfannbama]

As in they came from 2 different situations? Because they did. Also, Saban was coming off a “could’ve been better” stint at Miami. So I’m not really insinuating anything. Just saying, it wasn’t just Saban who struggled in his first year it was also Dabo Swinney (6-6 in the ACC) Bob Stoops, Gary Patterson, Bobby Bowden, Mike Gundy. Look at what they all did. If you know football you can tell Pruitt is a football coach. GBO

Saban won his first game 52-6. He beat a ranked team (arkansas) in game 3, only lost o ranked Georgia by 3 in week 4. He stomped ranked Tennessee and also made it to a bowl game. He fielded a competative team and didnt make.excuses. There are no similarities between saban and pruitts first year. Except pruitt doesn't make excuses, fans do.it for him.

 

[Cartervol]

Saban won his first game 52-6. He beat a ranked team (arkansas) in game 3, only lost o ranked Georgia by 3 in week 4. He stomped ranked Tennessee and also made it to a bowl game. He fielded a competative team and didnt make.excuses. There are no similarities between saban and pruitts first year. Except pruitt doesn't make excuses, fans do.it for him.

It's amazing the amount of them they have and how quick they move on from one to the other.

 

[TGFHeupel16]

Saban won his first game 52-6. He beat a ranked team (arkansas) in game 3, only lost o ranked Georgia by 3 in week 4. He stomped ranked Tennessee and also made it to a bowl game. He fielded a competative team and didnt make.excuses. There are no similarities between saban and pruitts first year. Except pruitt doesn't make excuses, fans do.it for him.

Our season isn’t finished. We won’t lose every SEC game and might even surprise some people.

 

[Doberman]

It has always been my opinion that the real brains behind Urban Meyer was Mullen. After he left Florida's offense was quite ordinary. I think you have a good one.

That theory may have worked if he hadn’t duplicated that success at Ohio st. With no Mullen.

 

[Mtnvol80]

And his craziest flop was signing Culpepper over Drew Brees. Lmao!

He actually pushed for months to take drew but he got over rided. Looking back now if the higher ups would have listened he prob would have never got the bama job and one can only imagine how the college football scene would be today without him

 

[Doberman]

He actually pushed for months to take drew but he got over rided. Looking back now if the higher ups would have listened he prob would have never got the bama job and one can only imagine how the college football scene would be today without him

I think Brees failed the physical due to labrum issues, if I remember correctly.

 

[JMSqb11]

FL fans were not very high on Mac at all. and by game 5 of 2017, they were done with him. on one was unhappy to see him go. they saw what we saw.

Yes they did. And by him lying about death threats, Florida got a lucky break of cutting him immediately.

 

[BigOrangeTrain]

You mean idiotic enough to fire a guy before the end of his 3rd year who had won the East the two previous years?

The only portion of our fan base that is "idiotic" is those who continue to believe you can get championship results without expecting coaches to perform at a championship level from day 1. They may not have the components... but great coaches, coach great regardless.

So every great coach coached great in their first season? Dude your analogies are beyond hilarious. People can demand greatness all they want. The fact is, football is a team sport that requires coaching and player execution to be successful. If either one is subpar, then mediocrity and failure ensue.