#BoycottNRA

#751
#751
Grand Vol said:
Yeah, we've never had a government agency that oversteps its bounds or anything.

NASA, for instance, should be focusing on space exploration and stuff away from the planet. However, they somehow shifted into earth sciences in the past 20 years.

Kinda outside their scope of responsibility, wouldn't you think? Maybe NOAA's realm more than NASA? I mean, it is the National Aeronautics and Space Administration.

Now, gun violence and whatnot. Wouldn't and shouldn't that fall under maybe the DOJ and specifically the ATF?

Still didn't answer the question of why a DNC Congress and DNC President didn't restore funding when they had the chance...

No, let's blame the NRA instead. Way easier to do that.
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Let's take a step back and focus on more conceptual issues. Do you agree that gun violence has an effect on public health? If so, is that something the government--having an interest in the health of its citizens--should be studying (or funding the study of)?

I don't think there's any dispute that the NRA does not want there to be gun violence studies and actively lobbies to make sure the government doesn't get into that business. Why do you think they do that?
 
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#753
#753
37L1 said:
Sure, when they do a study on the affect of cars on public health, alcohol on public health, prescription drugs on public health, fast foods on public health, tobacco on public health, video games on public health, violent movies on public health, etc., and then recommend that they all be banned or rigorously controlled "for the public good."
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I'm pretty sure the CDC studies (or funds the study) of all of these issues with the exception of maybe video games and movies.

Regardless though, I guess your argument is that unless you study everything that possibly affects public health, you shouldn't be able to study any particular issue that affects public health. Is that an argument you really want to defend?
 
#754
#754
evillawyer said:
Let's take a step back and focus on more conceptual issues. Do you agree that gun violence has an effect on public health? If so, is that something the government--having an interest in the health of its citizens--should be studying (or funding the study of)?

I don't think there's any dispute that the NRA does not want there to be gun violence studies and actively lobbies to make sure the government doesn't get into that business. Why do you think they do that?
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I do have a problem with the government funding “gun violence” research. If they were funding research into VIOLENCE then I would be all for it but I think we all know why gun violence is singled out instead of looking into the root causes of violent behavior.
 
#755
#755
OuterBanksVol said:
* Don't blame the burgers for fat people. If burgers weren't available, they'd eat - I don't know - rice? Yet undeveloped countries with no McDonald's have a healthier, skinnier populace.

** No cause and effect. Pure coincidence.

*** Western Fast Food Chains Flourish in China, Rates of Obesity and Diabetes Skyrocket

Redirect Notice
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If you believe eliminating McDonald’s would change obesity rates, you’re out of your mind
 
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#758
#758
evillawyer said:
NorthDallas40, we had a nice civil discussion yesterday on the Haab story. No reason to get nasty with each other.

I'm fairly new to the political forum, so I'm not familiar with all of your prior posts. However, because I like to base my beliefs on facts, as opposed to immediately dismissing something because of source (also called the genetic fallacy), I'd be more than happy to read the study you linked.

As a general matter though, studies of public health issues should be continuously updated as the forces that affect public health are continuously changing.

Do you think there's any good reason for the NRA to strenuously oppose studying the affect that guns have on public health?
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I actually completely missed who I was quoting and just read the content. I just got up and read a couple of posts that just fired me up and finished watching that useless sheriff speak of his solid leadership on TV this morning. Sorry my fuse had been lit.

I will make this statement on research, data, and conclusions in general. I’m an engineer. I deal with data everyday. What point are we trying to make today from the same data? You agree? That’s why this report on FAWB94 resonated with me. An academic used what appeared to be solid data analytics, stated his assumptions, and provided his source info the FBI. And I think we can all go get that info if we want.

I don’t know the details of the NRAs issue with the study so I’m not prepared to give you a relevant reply. However I do agree with your position on studies on public health in general and I believe mental health in particular plays heavily into this instance.

But let’s be clear on Parkland. This is a complete and utter failure of government agencies and local law enforcement to do their damn jobs and protect these kids. Everything else is amplifying.
 
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#759
#759
OuterBanksVol said:
* Don't blame the burgers for fat people. If burgers weren't available, they'd eat - I don't know - rice? Yet undeveloped countries with no McDonald's have a healthier, skinnier populace.

** No cause and effect. Pure coincidence.

*** Western Fast Food Chains Flourish in China, Rates of Obesity and Diabetes Skyrocket

Redirect Notice
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skinnier is not always healthier.

As to the rest of your post.... lulz
 
#760
#760
Grand Vol said:
Yeah, we've never had a government agency that oversteps its bounds or anything.

NASA, for instance, should be focusing on space exploration and stuff away from the planet. However, they somehow shifted into earth sciences in the past 20 years.

Kinda outside their scope of responsibility, wouldn't you think? Maybe NOAA's realm more than NASA? I mean, it is the National Aeronautics and Space Administration.

Now, gun violence and whatnot. Wouldn't and shouldn't that fall under maybe the DOJ and specifically the ATF?

Still didn't answer the question of why a DNC Congress and DNC President didn't restore funding when they had the chance...

No, let's blame the NRA instead. Way easier to do that.
Click to expand...

NASA’s own incompetence and lack of spinal support KILLED seven people onboard Challenger. They are a shell of their former self today.
 
#762
#762
NorthDallas40 said:
I actually completely missed who I was quoting and just read the content. I just got up and read a couple of posts that just fired me up and finished watching that useless sheriff speak of his solid leadership on TV this morning. Sorry my fuse had been lit.

I will make this statement on research, data, and conclusions in general. I’m an engineer. I deal with data everyday. What point are we trying to make today from the same data? You agree? That’s why this report on FAWB94 resonated with me. An academic used what appeared to be solid data analytics, stated his assumptions, and provided his source info the FBI. And I think we can all go get that info if we want.

I don’t know the details of the NRAs issue with the study so I’m not prepared to give you a relevant reply. However I do agree with your position on studies on public health in general and I believe mental health in particular plays heavily into this instance.

But let’s be clear on Parkland. This is a complete and utter failure of government agencies and local law enforcement to do their damn jobs and protect these kids. Everything else is amplifying.
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Without a doubt there's a lot of blame to go round on parkland. The gun debate is inherently factual so I'm glad we agree that it would be best to have as much access to the facts as possible so we can have an informed debate about underlying causes and possible solutions. If that's the case, the NRA is not helping us have an informed debate.
 
#763
#763
luthervol said:
And boost revenue to the companies that severed ties. The good will alone will have a positive impact on the company.
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People are not going to fly or not fly on Delta because of their severing ties to the NRA. That is just stupid to believe that they will.
 
#764
#764
I think another thing these companies might be forgetting is that there are many second amendment supporters that while they aren't members or even agree with all the things the NRA does, they still look at an attack on the NRA as an attack on the second amendment. I'm not sure these companies realize how big that group of people are.
 
#765
#765
evillawyer said:
I'm pretty sure the CDC studies (or funds the study) of all of these issues with the exception of maybe video games and movies.

Regardless though, I guess your argument is that unless you study everything that possibly affects public health, you shouldn't be able to study any particular issue that affects public health. Is that an argument you really want to defend?
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That is not my argument, and you know it, counselor. God I hate how lawyers try to bend logic in a fallacious manner to try and make it appear you are saying one thing and not the other so they can amaze you with their fancy footwork and present you as a misinformed numbnut. Don't be so obtuse, we aren't stupid.

Studies that are done to support conclusions that are already drawn before the study is even started will only come to one conclusion, depending on your prejudice. The solution is also already predetermined but is not applied equally to other facets of society that affect public health such as movies, video games etc., because they are First Amendment Rights and since Second Amendment Rights "are so extreme and outdated", they are secondary to the "health of the public."

It's BS and you know it.
 
#766
#766
OuterBanksVol said:
Why companies are abandoning the NRA - Feb. 25, 2018

Per the NRA release yesterday the only cowards here are those who have to hide behind their AR15s because they're so scared of the world. Pathetic.
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The sum of that article is *golf clap* as usual for anything you post. Only way those companies pulling ties impacts the NRA is if they were active donors. Go get that data if you want to make a point. But you might have to look somewhere else than the WaPo web site!
 
#767
#767
One thing I've never understood and I think the reason many don't support universal back ground checks, private sales in particular, why does the government need to know what gun you're buying? Why do they need to know the serial number? If the purpose of the check is to determine whether one is eligible to own a firearm or not, where's the need to know what the firearm is?
 
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#768
#768
Grand Vol said:
I posted those links absolving Clinton for a reason...

Second, the DoD, by and large, knows **** all about firearms except "lowest bidder" and "going with political winds." And at the time, the political winds were shifting more and more towards increased gun control. Starting in 1986 with the FOPA and Hughes Amendment and culminating in the 1994 AWB. Having said that to say this, there is no good answer as to "why" it happened other than gun control at work. I'll single out a specific part of your post:



Which, common sense would dictate, would mean military bases should be zones in which concealed carry shouldn't be much of a problem, no? And furthermore:



Is this you just making **** up again?
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The bolded was my point. Even with that fact, the DOD determined the negatives outweighed the positives. What does that say? I know what it says to me.
 
#769
#769
evillawyer said:
Let's take a step back and focus on more conceptual issues. Do you agree that gun violence has an effect on public health? If so, is that something the government--having an interest in the health of its citizens--should be studying (or funding the study of)?

I don't think there's any dispute that the NRA does not want there to be gun violence studies and actively lobbies to make sure the government doesn't get into that business. Why do you think they do that?
Click to expand...

Let's take two steps back and determine if the government, specifically an Executive Branch that changes every four to eight years, should be the ones researching this "gun violence" issue.

It's a political topic, first and foremost. Which means data can be skewed one way or the other. If one has a pro-gun President (Bush 43 was the closest thing we've had and even he was borderline) the data could be skewed into a pro-2A slant. If you have an anti-gun President (Bush 41 for example) the data could be skewed into an anti-gun slant.

Now, to answer your question. Is gun violence a health concern? Maybe. But way, way, way down on the list of items they could and should be researching. Such things are probably better left to the private sector, universities and whatnot, through grants and whatnot to "study." I think you'll get a better view of the data if you have multiple sources and multiple studies rather than government employee(s) trying their best to chase the data they think might be what their boss wants to hear. No, I don't trust government to give a clear picture at all.

Now, answer my question. Did the NRA actively control the DNC House, Senate and Presidency when they could have requested and funded such portions of this topic despite the NRA's disapproval?
 
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#770
#770
NorthDallas40 said:
The sum of that article is *golf clap* as usual for anything you post. Only way those companies pulling ties impacts the NRA is if they were active donors. Go get that data if you want to make a point. But you might have to look somewhere else than the WaPo web site!
Click to expand...

Propaganda,it's what liberals do.
 
#772
#772
InVOLuntary said:
One thing I've never understood and I think the reason many don't support universal back ground checks, private sales in particular, why does the government need to know what gun you're buying? Why do they need to know the serial number? If the purpose of the check is to determine whether one is eligible to own a firearm or not, where's the need to know what the firearm is?
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Good point.
 
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#774
#774
evillawyer said:
My point is not that this will really affect rank and file members. I acknowledged it may galvanize them. However, when mainstream companies like Delta, United, Avis, etc. (rumors that BofA may do something to) disavow their relationship with the NRA, that sends a message to regular middle-of-the-road Joes who are neither pro- nor anti-NRA that the NRA is not in the mainstream.
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Might add the angle of how many people associated with these companies actually make the decision to drop as well.

Why should average Joe really have that much of a change of opinion because Avis walked out? And if you did that because of that are you really that bright? "Somebody I don't know is boycotting "X" they must be right."

Of course I've come to learn over time, never underestimate the lazy American.
 
#775
#775
NorthDallas40 said:
NASA’s own incompetence and lack of spinal support KILLED seven people onboard Challenger. They are a shell of their former self today.
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No. NASA is a prime example of a government agency that takes the experts out of position and installs bureaucrats instead. The Challenger disaster, while many fingers can be pointed, had the huge benefit of hindsight in studying "what went wrong." Space exploration, even today, is an inherently dangerous proposition. Apollo 1 taught NASA to over-engineer a craft, but still make it user friendly. By and large, the STS was overengineered in the beginning, but by the time the Challenger exploded, launches were seen as mostly "routine" and complacency set it. It did re-instill the old adage "better safe than sorry" until the Columbia disaster.

Humans have always died during exploration of the unknown regions. But so long as we learn from our mistakes and do our best to avoid them in the future, we should never stop exploring.
 
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