Mass shooting of the week, high school in parkland, FL.

[Grand Vol]

Nope. Too much potential for abuse.

How so?

 

[luthervol]

Florida school shooter obtained 10 firearms - CNN

Nikolas Cruz made a brief appearance in court for a procedural matter Monday, shortly after a law enforcement source told CNN that the 19-year-old school shooter obtained 10 rifles in the last year or so.

Should be illegal....but at a minimum, a huge red flag that immediately puts the person on a watch list.

 

[Squints]

Is this thread still going? There’s nothing left to debate.

Libs want complete gun control and refuse to honestly identify the problem.

There’s literally nothing to debate with the above stance, unless, of course, the only capacity being debated is not a magazine, but mental fortitude.

 

[luthervol]

Is this thread still going? There’s nothing left to debate.

Libs want complete gun control and refuse to honestly identify the problem.

There’s literally nothing to debate with the above stance, unless, of course, the only capacity being debated is not a magazine, but mental fortitude.

Which is.......?

 

[Grand Vol]

Should be illegal....but at a minimum, a huge red flag that immediately puts the person on a watch list.

You know what else should be illegal? Your ability to vote.

 

[Squints]

you started with an initial point that all deliveries come through one door. That won't work because you grossly underestimate what it takes to run a large school.

Operations larger than schools have single entry/exit points.

Namely, airports and military bases, among others. Now if you want to argue “deliveries,” these same entities have dedicated routes for deliveries, so as to isolate and eliminate unnecessary traffic. It’s called compartmentalizing and common sense.

 

[hog88]

I can understand why you, Hog, DTH and others are concerned about a UBC system being abused and turned into a registration list. So, think out of the box and take the fear out of it by still achieving what the gun control proponents want in the end. They want to cut out the "gun show loophole" (although not a one can explain it) and require a background check. Got it.

So, take the firearms identification out of it to an extent. Sure, run the serial to make sure it isn't stolen, but the background check should be about the individual, not the item. Records get deleted within a reasonable period (I say 15 days) and everyone should be happy.

Gun grabbers won't be though.

They tried to close the gun show "loophole" a few years ago. The proposal was to allow instant BGCs at the door to certify buyers. The dems didn't let it come up for a vote.

 

[zeppelin128]

I can understand why you, Hog, DTH and others are concerned about a UBC system being abused and turned into a registration list. So, think out of the box and take the fear out of it by still achieving what the gun control proponents want in the end. They want to cut out the "gun show loophole" (although not a one can explain it) and require a background check. Got it.

So, take the firearms identification out of it to an extent. Sure, run the serial to make sure it isn't stolen, but the background check should be about the individual, not the item. Records get deleted within a reasonable period (I say 15 days) and everyone should be happy.

Gun grabbers won't be though.

If there was sufficient language in the legislation to ensure no national database of any type I'd be okay with this proposal.

As Mulder would say, "Trust no one."

 

[DancingOutlaw]

Are you a member of the NRA? If yes, the blood of these kids is on your hands. Sorry, it's ugly and rude to say, but it's a fact.

The only reason these guns are legal is because of the NRA. You can stomp your feet, hold your breath, call me an *******... none of that changes this truth.

"...Sheriff Israel was honored to visit Anthony Borges, 15, in the hospital today. His family shared that Anthony was shot five times in Wednesday's school attack. Fortunately, he is recovering -- but has a long road ahead with more surgeries needed. Please join us in praying for the swift recovery of Anthony and all the other victims of this horrific criminal act."

View attachment 154108

I’m not so that’s a big relief to me.

Carry on.

 

[Grand Vol]

If there was sufficient language in the legislation to ensure no national database of any type I'd be okay with this proposal.

As Mulder would say, "Trust no one."

I'm all about single item bills anyway. Enough of this rider bull****.

You want a universal system, fine, only THAT in the bill.

 

[82_VOL_83]

I'd bring universal background checks to the table.

And ask that suppressors be taken off the NFA. The Hughes Amendment get a valid vote. The Sporter Clause be reviewed. And the State Department gets out of the FFL business.

In a free market, a P2P transfer can and should be inexpensive.

What if you own a gun you have to have a carry permit. The permit then becomes more of a background check that allows you to carry if you wish. No firearm attached to it. This forms a background check record.... think SSN. Then, if you get a recordable strike on it, it is a searchable record. You present your back ground card if you wish to HANDLE a weapon in a place of purchase. No weapon SN associated with it. The seller then knows who you are and if you should even be handling a gun. Whether you choose to buy or not is up to you. Anyone with the correct app on a phone can run the check.

 

[Grand Vol]

What if you own a gun you have to have a carry permit. The permit then becomes more of a background check that allows you to carry if you wish. No firearm attached to it. This forms a background check record.... think SSN. Then, if you get a recordable strike on it, it is a searchable record. You present your back ground card if you wish to HANDLE a weapon in a place of purchase. No weapon SN associated with it. The seller then knows who you are and if you should even be handling a gun. Whether you choose to buy or not is up to you. Anyone with the correct app on a phone can run the check.

That would take it a bit too far.

 

[Squints]

Which is.......?

You tell me.

You have yet to honestly identify the root cause. Your “common sense” reform is nothing more than a step on the way to a total ban.

If you’re scared of guns, then don’t buy them, and furthermore, don’t discuss them. That alone eliminates your opinion from consideration on the basis of ignorance and skewed bias.

 

[LouderVol]

You can get out of the school, just not in. Emergency situations where you need to get out of the school would not be impacted. if you can get out you can get in. Memphis area schools have to use a physical chain to keep doors shut.
Some of that in Atlanta too. If people want to find a way in, the out doors are the best. Especially as your exits won't be monitored as much.

This was specifically referenced for non-campus style schools. Campus style with multiple buildings would need to be looked at in a different light.

Also as far as chaos being at the front door, it’s not like a grocery store with things being delivered and needing in the school all day. That isn’t an issue imo. point is once you introduce another opening that can be accessed during non school hours it remains an opening during school hours

As far as your point in one friend flushing them out, that wouldn’t be possible as they wouldn’t be able to get into the school and flush out.

if people want in or out, they find a way. someone props a door open to take a smoke break. someone is leaving and you grab the door before it shuts. heck depending on the shutting mechanism a piece of wax paper can foil some modern locking mechanisms and its impossible to tell from a distance.

 

[Darkman]

Florida school shooter obtained 10 firearms - CNN

Nikolas Cruz made a brief appearance in court for a procedural matter Monday, shortly after a law enforcement source told CNN that the 19-year-old school shooter obtained 10 rifles in the last year or so.

Should be illegal....but at a minimum, a huge red flag that immediately puts the person on a watch list.

 

[Obsessed]

10 new rifles in a year?

How does a 19 year afford that?

Fishy...

 

[LouderVol]

None of those are essential. Bring in the food before/after school. Do food/vending machines need to be filled during the 6-7 hour school day or can that take place the other 17-18 hours?

Don’t think there are a bulk of maintenence men working on printers and copiers during the day that the office people would be overwhelmed.

A little adjustment in time can go a long way. People/schools would be open to being flexible imo

something breaks down, you need a repair man. you going to wait until after hours? You going to monitor him while he treks from the front door every time he needs a part?

more time for people to be on site is more cost.

most delivery services only run at certain hours. I am sure you could pay more for other hours....

 

[volfanCLT]

if people want in or out, they find a way. someone props a door open to take a smoke break. someone is leaving and you grab the door before it shuts. heck depending on the shutting mechanism a piece of wax paper can foil some modern locking mechanisms and its impossible to tell from a distance.

No doubt. If you are looking for a perfect, fool proof fix I think you will be looking for a while though. Any “solution” is going to have loopholes and ways to get around it.

That doesn’t mean you can’t take steps to drastically reduce the chances of that happening imo

 

[luthervol]

You tell me.

You have yet to honestly identify the root cause. Your “common sense” reform is nothing more than a step on the way to a total ban.

If you’re scared of guns, then don’t buy them, and furthermore, don’t discuss them. That alone eliminates your opinion from consideration on the basis of ignorance and skewed bias.

Why are you reluctant to identify what you see as the "root" cause? Man up and say it.........

 

[Squints]

Why are you reluctant to identify what you see as the "root" cause? Man up and say it.........

I’ve said it and I’m not going to spell it out again. Get off your lazy ass and find it. My stance is well-known and I’ve openly made it known.

You, however, hide behind a cloak of BS, only to have complete desires of a total ban.

 

[DancingOutlaw]

“A 2016 Florida Department of Children and Families says that following a breakup with a girlfriend, Cruz began cutting his arms. He also announced plans to buy a gun, put racial slurs and hate symbols on his backpack and suffered from depression, attention deficit hyperactivity disorder and autism, the report said. Despite Cruz's behavior, the report concluded the "final level of risk is low."”

Considering this and the FBI’s response, why do people continue to put such unwarranted faith in the government to protect them? They’ve made it clear when the chips are down there’s a great chance they will fail at their job.

 

[luthervol]

I’ve said it and I’m not going to spell it out again. Get off your lazy ass and find it. My stance is well-known and I’ve openly made it known.

You, however, hide behind a cloak of BS, only to have complete desires of a total ban.

I looked and couldn't find it; but I'm the one that's hiding. Cute.

I have never supported a total ban. Your delusions must be comforting.

 

[LouderVol]

No doubt. If you are looking for a perfect, fool proof fix I think you will be looking for a while though. Any “solution” is going to have loopholes and ways to get around it.

That doesn’t mean you can’t take steps to drastically reduce the chances of that happening imo

in my informed opinion more ways in/out is better than fewer.

I would think its more important to have internal check points than external. keep the control you mentioned, but if its an open door beyond that one hard point?

 

[LouderVol]

“A 2016 Florida Department of Children and Families says that following a breakup with a girlfriend, Cruz began cutting his arms. He also announced plans to buy a gun, put racial slurs and hate symbols on his backpack and suffered from depression, attention deficit hyperactivity disorder and autism, the report said. Despite Cruz's behavior, the report concluded the "final level of risk is low."”

Considering this and the FBI’s response, why do people continue to put such unwarranted faith in the government to protect them? They’ve made it clear when the chips are down there’s a great chance they will fail at their job.

pretty sure one doesn't just develop autism.

 

[NorthDallas40]

I looked and couldn't find it; but I'm the one that's hiding. Cute.

I have never supported a total ban. Your delusions must be comforting.

Oh you damn sure eluded to a total ban agenda.

Your first stance was “eliminate ARs and keep shot guns and deer rifles”.

I immediately jumped that and pointed out you were picking the wrong for lethality.

Then after getting thru to you that I could still kill over 10 people a minute with my deer rifle you finally acknowledged that and state “well we have to look at those too then!”

If you don’t own those statements then you are a liar!

You have zero intent at stopping at the AR. The “intelligent” ones in your camp (read: not you) have a plan to work towards total disarmament and realize the AR actually isn’t the issue. The issue to them is any gun and thus we must have zero private ownership. That is the “ultimate solution”!