Where did life begin? (Merged)

Do you believe we have a creator, aka "God"?

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#1,427
#1,427
Orangeslice13 said:
Yet one of your gods has a G-d


◄ John 20:17 ►
New International Version
Jesus said, "Do not hold on to me, for I have not yet ascended to the Father. Go instead to my brothers and tell them, 'I am ascending to my Father and your Father, to my God and your God.'"

New Living Translation
"Don't cling to me," Jesus said, "for I haven't yet ascended to the Father. But go find my brothers and tell them, 'I am ascending to my Father and your Father, to my God and your God.'"

English Standard Version
Jesus said to her, “Do not cling to me, for I have not yet ascended to the Father; but go to my brothers and say to them, ‘I am ascending to my Father and your Father, to my God and your God.’”

Berean Study Bible
"Do not cling to Me," Jesus said, "For I have not yet ascended to the Father. But go and tell My brothers, 'I am ascending to My Father and your Father, to My God and your God.'"

Berean Literal Bible
Jesus says to her, "Do not touch Me, for not yet have I ascended to the Father. Now go to My brothers and say to them, 'I am ascending to My Father and your Father, and to My God and your God.'"

New American Standard Bible
Jesus said to her, "Stop clinging to Me, for I have not yet ascended to the Father; but go to My brethren and say to them, 'I ascend to My Father and your Father, and My God and your God.'"

King James Bible
Jesus saith unto her, Touch me not; for I am not yet ascended to my Father: but go to my brethren, and say unto them, I ascend unto my Father, and your Father; and to my God, and your God.
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sounds like we have another Catholic here, so jumping in.

If you operate under our faith, its kinda hard to differentiate between one and the other, and the other.

How would you use human words to describe God when you are unwilling/won't spell out the word itself?

One way I have had it described, that also has obvious short comings, is looking at it in tenses.

Father/Son/Holy Spirit
Was/Is/will be

In each case it is still God, its just our understanding of God and the role/impact on our lives that changes. God is a constant, is everywhere and nowhere. something that exists beyond our realm of understanding.

Would you argue that God couldn't be three-in-one if God wanted to be?
 
#1,428
#1,428
Orangeslice13 said:
There is a levitical system for atonement and forgiveness. I’m curious how Jesus fulfilled it.
Jesus said he didn’t come to destroy the law(system) but to fulfill it (make complete).

Many Christians believe he said.

“I didn’t come to destroy the law, but to end it”
That couldn’t be further from the truth in light of Mathew 7:21
21 “Not everyone who says to me, ‘Lord, Lord,’ will enter the kingdom of heaven, but the one who does the will of my Father who is in heaven. 22 On that day many will say to me, ‘Lord, Lord, did we not prophesy in your name, and cast out demons in your name, and do many mighty works in your name?’ 23 And then will I declare to them, ‘I never knew you; depart from me, you workers of lawlessness.’


He doesn’t know the lawless
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not sure about the Jewish faith but does one have to atone for sins you don't commit? Do you atone for things that don't happen? What should Christ be atoning for? *he did atone for our sins, that whole gone for three days thing he was busy*

also you guys clearly got something wrong with your law for Christ to even be amongst us.
 
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#1,430
#1,430
Slice, didn't the original law pertain to the Hebrews and thus exclude Gentiles? If we were to go by the old law strictly then salvation would not be extended to we non-Hebrews?
 
#1,432
#1,432
Wafflestomper said:
I agree. I'm not claiming to know that no gods exist, but given the evidence, I feel that belief in any gods is not warranted.

I'm still waiting for someone here to present some evidence that isn't personal anecdotes.
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You're going to get the question of what that means....

Do you believe there is no God?

or

Do you lack belief in a God?

There is a difference. I've been down this road before with evidence....you are going to get circular reasoning, equating religious faith with "scientific faith", and mental gymnastics of free will.

Good luck.
 
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#1,433
#1,433
Wafflestomper said:
I agree. I'm not claiming to know that no gods exist, but given the evidence, I feel that belief in any gods is not warranted.

I'm still waiting for someone here to present some evidence that isn't personal anecdotes.
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that's the whole point. Not sure where the conversation went while I was gone, but God isn't measurable by scientific means, yet. Yet science at least accepts the possibility of things that can not yet be measured, or have been measured.

So if you are beyond the realm of current science and look at the other methods of how to measure God you are left with individual anecdotes. Which considering that faith should be personable is not conflicting. makes for piss poor means of "proving" him to others who have yet to experience him. But to those individuals, he is just as real as anything science has quantified.
 
#1,434
#1,434
distrovol said:
Slice, didn't the original law pertain to the Hebrews and thus exclude Gentiles? If we were to go by the old law strictly then salvation would not be extended to we non-Hebrews?
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I’m really busy working on Loudervols parents house and can’t give it the time it deserves......

Short short short version

There is no original/old law. To suggest otherwise would render G-d imperfect. Yeshua completes the existing law. Even the often misrepresented Paul says the law remains but there’s no condemnation for those in union with Yeshua Messiah.

And the law was given to the Hebrews and the strangers among them. Following G-d/salvation has always been available to everyone. (See Rehab the professional as your paradigm of hope)

Salvation by grace is not new.
Read Hubakah 2 and psalms 119.
 
#1,436
#1,436
LouderVol said:
not sure about the Jewish faith but does one have to atone for sins you don't commit? Do you atone for things that don't happen? What should Christ be atoning for? *he did atone for our sins, that whole gone for three days thing he was busy*

also you guys clearly got something wrong with your law for Christ to even be amongst us.
Click to expand...

The law is good, all 600 plus laws of God are dealing either with your relationship with God or your relationship with your neighbor. The problem is, we are bad!
 
#1,437
#1,437
rjd970 said:
You're going to get the question of what that means....

Do you believe there is no God?

or

Do you lack belief in a God?

There is a difference. I've been down this road before with evidence....you are going to get circular reasoning, equating religious faith with "scientific faith", and mental gymnastics of free will.

Good luck.
Click to expand...

what about:
1: the stars - creation tells me there is a creator
2: the scriptures-
A:Gods prophecies fulfilled in exact detail. God wrote history in advance.
B: Historical accuracy of the bible.
C: Archeology proves the bible correct.
3: the saints-
A: the change that happens when a poor sinner gets saved. also answered prayer.
B:The disciples died horrible deaths at the hands of Nero for their faith, yet they knew the truth! they were either crazy or Jesus did get up from the grave and they really did witness the miracles!
C: Your family members or friends that you know are the real deal when it comes to being a Christian!
4:The Spirit of God- that is probably dealing with you right now bearing witness to what I'm saying!

Dear friend, there is enough to convince you , if not, then you may want to just simply ask God to help you see the truth!
 
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#1,438
#1,438
OuterBanksVol said:
Septic... why. Why do you do this. Gaaaawww.

This thread is out of control full on retard.
Click to expand...

You want me on that wall. You need me on that wall.

DiXNSL.gif
 
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#1,439
#1,439
BigO95 said:
what about:
1: the stars - creation tells me there is a creator
2: the scriptures-
A:Gods prophecies fulfilled in exact detail. God wrote history in advance.
B: Historical accuracy of the bible.
C: Archeology proves the bible correct.
3: the saints-
A: the change that happens when a poor sinner gets saved. also answered prayer.
B:The disciples died horrible deaths at the hands of Nero for their faith, yet they knew the truth! they were either crazy or Jesus did get up from the grave and they really did witness the miracles!
C: Your family members or friends that you know are the real deal when it comes to being a Christian!
4:The Spirit of God- that is probably dealing with you right now bearing witness to what I'm saying!

Dear friend, there is enough to convince you , if not, then you may want to just simply ask God to help you see the truth!
Click to expand...

Boom goes the dynamite. I don't see how any of this is remotely refutable, the logic is bullet proof.

23569786-Case-closed-grunge-red-stamp-Stock-Photo.jpg
 
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#1,440
#1,440
BigO95 said:
The law is good, all 600 plus laws of God are dealing either with your relationship with God or your relationship with your neighbor. The problem is, we are bad!
Click to expand...

600+ laws?

God must be a liberal, Sodom and Gamorrah may have flourished if'n it had a little more deregulation.
 
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#1,441
#1,441
Septic said:
Boom goes the dynamite. I don't see how any of this is remotely refutable, the logic is bullet proof.
Click to expand...

The one glaring argument that your side cannot argue is life.

As in, how did it start? Random chemicals in just the right place given a tiny electrical charge to come into existence?

Plenty of theories out there, but not much in the way of proof so to speak.
 
#1,442
#1,442
Yes, there are creators.

Societies have been developing mythologies and origin stories to explain new phenomena since we evolved the capacity to do so.

That doesn't make creator myths or deities real. We are tribal, herd animals at our core. Religion and spirituality are social constructs to identify our "tribes".
 
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#1,443
#1,443
Grand Vol said:
The one glaring argument that your side cannot argue is life.

As in, how did it start? Random chemicals in just the right place given a tiny electrical charge to come into existence?

Plenty of theories out there, but not much in the way of proof so to speak.
Click to expand...

The multiverse theory is a solid one to read up on.
 
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#1,445
#1,445
BigO95 said:
Either through death or the second coming of Christ you will get your chance dear friend. I pray that you see him through the eye of faith before that happens.
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Thank you.

I pray you find Allah, via Muhammad (peace be upon him), his true messenger, before judgement day.
 
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#1,446
#1,446
Grand Vol said:
The one glaring argument that your side cannot argue is life.

As in, how did it start? Random chemicals in just the right place given a tiny electrical charge to come into existence?

Plenty of theories out there, but not much in the way of proof so to speak.
Click to expand...

I think both sides have problems to deal with. Infinite regress should be just as troubling for creationists who point out that abiogenisis isn't possible. Pointing out that something can't come come from nothing and then falling back to 'god did it' is absurd.

I don't know what happened to start it all off, I'd be happy to change my position with 'evidence' that wasn't foisted by men with agenda's.
 
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#1,448
#1,448
PKT_VOL said:
Thank you.

I pray you find Allah, via Muhammad (peace be upon him), his true messenger, before judgement day.
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Allah is Satan, Jesus is God! Satan will spend eternity in the lake of fire as will all that choose to follow him!
 
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