Recruiting Forum Football Talk XLI

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#2,902
#2,902
Darth_Shiveman said:
The fact that they traveled with just 5-6 OL and didn’t have a contingency plan is just another indicator of how incompetent Butch and the offensive staff he’s surrounded himself with are.



A lot of people here are still really underrating how bad of a coach Butch is because they bought into his snake oil so hard. Once th next coach shows up, it will become a lot more clear. We could end up with our 10th choice and it will be a big upgrade.
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Butch had a couple of good recruiting classes, and had a couple (not enough) of big wins as the result of those. Beyond that, his legacy is largely overstated.
 
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#2,904
#2,904
Heard from my Nashville media friend that Currie is bring the Title IX settlement into the buyout negotiations.

The university essentially spent $2.5M to protect Butch and prevent him from incriminating himself in court
 
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#2,905
#2,905
Kingston Vol said:
Heard from my Nashville media friend that Currie is bring the Title IX settlement into the buyout negotiations.

The university essentially spent $2.5M to protect Butch and prevent him from incriminating himself in court
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They should wrap up these negotiations just in time for us to hire a coach for the 2019 season.
 
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#2,906
#2,906
Kingston Vol said:
Heard from my Nashville media friend that Currie is bring the Title IX settlement into the buyout negotiations.

The university essentially spent $2.5M to protect Butch and prevent him from incriminating himself in court
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If true, the gloves have come off.
 
#2,907
#2,907
Kingston Vol said:
Heard from my Nashville media friend that Currie is bring the Title IX settlement into the buyout negotiations.

The university essentially spent $2.5M to protect Butch and prevent him from incriminating himself in court
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Should have settled sooner and we would have avoided that $2.5m. Could have used it to pay the settlement and move on.

I don't understand why CBJ would negotiate anything at this point. Fire him. Give him his buyout and hope someone else hires him and pays him $1m.
 
#2,910
#2,910
GoBigOrangeVols said:
In the eyes of fans it may, but I don't think it will for the decision makers. They know they can't get this one wrong, so they have to take the surest thing they can get.

Plus, I think Frost becomes moot when he goes to Nebraska or Florida. I can't imagine we are higher on HIS list than 3rd behind those two.

So a combination of us not at the top of his list, and our AD wanting less risk in the hire means Frost isn't coming to The Hill. JMO.
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Don’t agree. The decision makers aren’t going to hold to that sitting power 5 theory if it’s not the right coach. Just because a coach is a sitting power 5 coach doesn’t = sure thing. Example: they aren’t going to hire rich rod over Frost just because he’s a sitting power 5 coach. There is just as much risk hiring a guy whose best years are behind him over a lower G5 coach whose best years are in front of him. Give me the best coach period, regardless of where he comes from. That’s why PM and Fulmer should be and most likely are very involved in this search, they know coaching and they know a smart football mind when they see one. I put my confidence in them, with hopes that politics doesn’t overtake their suggestions.

Edit: I meant to quote your other post with the sitting power 5 list.
 
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#2,911
#2,911
Here is a list of all of the linemen currently on the Roster (except Jack Jones, who is still on the roster but his career is reportedly over):

Drew Richmond R-SO
Coleman Thomas SR
Riley Locklear FR (headed for a redshirt)
Nathan Niehaus R-FR
Brett Kendrick R-SR
Joe Keeler R-SO (walk-on)
Marcus Tatum SO
Brian Garvey R-FR (walk-on)
Ryan Johnson R-FR
Trey Smith FR
K’Rojhn Calbert FR
Jason Robertson SR
Chance Hall JR
Devante Brooks R-FR
 
#2,913
#2,913
BigZiti09 said:
Should have settled sooner and we would have avoided that $2.5m. Could have used it to pay the settlement and move on.

I don't understand why CBJ would negotiate anything at this point. Fire him. Give him his buyout and hope someone else hires him and pays him $1m.
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Plenty of reasons for Butch to negotiate.

1) He never should've accepted the mitigation clause in his first contract. He's going to get another head coaching gig and he'll probably be paid about half of what he's paid here. That immediately reduces his buyout 50%.

2) in addition to the Title IX stuff, UT could try to fire him "with cause" for the Mack Crowder stuff and the more recent concussion stuff. Butch would then sue UT for his full buyout, but that would be a long legal battle and at that point he has to defend himself against UT's allegations in a public manner. He would not want to do that. Especially if you know anything about what happened with Drae Bowles.

Also, his buyout, in addition to the mediation clause, also has no lump sum payment up front. He would be paid his salary monthly until the duration of his contract is complete. Assuming he gets paid about half of what he was paid here at his next job, that's about $100k a month for 4 years. He may prefer to negotiate that number down to a lump sum buyout up front and be done with the entire situation. UT would also benefit from doing this as it allows them to have an exact number for their athletic budget for the fiscal year - something they need as they propose to spend $340M on Neyland Stadium beginning next summer.
 
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#2,915
#2,915
Nash_Vol97 said:
Don’t agree. The decision makers aren’t going to hold to that sitting power 5 theory if it’s not the right coach. Just because a coach is a sitting power 5 coach doesn’t = sure thing. Example: they aren’t going to hire rich rod over Frost just because he’s a sitting power 5 coach. There is just as much risk hiring a guy whose best years are behind him over a lower G5 coach whose best years are in front of him. Give me the best coach period, regardless of where he comes from. That’s why PM and Fulmer should be and most likely are very involved in this search, they know coaching and they know a smart football mind when they see one. I put my confidence in them, with hopes that politics doesn’t overtake their suggestions.
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I know I'm not going to convince you, and that's fine. I'm not saying any of those 15 guys are "sure" things -- I'm saying the sitting P5 coaches are "surer" things than a Frost or other G5 coach. Frost is only in his 2nd season as a HC. Rich Rod has won 4 conference titles and been to 3 BCS/NY6 bowls, and taken Arizona to their 3rd best season in program history. He's a much "surer" thing than Frost is at this point, even though Frost may have miles and miles of more potential upside.

And like I said in a different post, I think it is a moot point on Frost because we aren't going to be higher than 3rd on HIS list, and one of Nebraska or Florida is likely to take him anyway. If UCLA, Texas A&M or some other places were to open, there is a good chance we may not be in HIS top 5.
 
#2,918
#2,918
Kingston Vol said:
Plenty of reasons for Butch to negotiate.

1) He never should've accepted the mitigation clause in his first contract. He's going to get another head coaching gig and he'll probably be paid about half of what he's paid here. That immediately reduces his buyout 50%.

2) in addition to the Title IX stuff, UT could try to fire him "with cause" for the Mack Crowder stuff and the more recent concussion stuff. Butch would then sue UT for his full buyout, but that would be a long legal battle and at that point he has to defend himself against UT's allegations in a public manner. He would not want to do that. Especially if you know anything about what happened with Drae Bowles.

Also, his buyout, in addition to the mediation clause, also has no lump sum payment up front. He would be paid his salary monthly until the duration of his contract is complete. Assuming he gets paid about half of what he was paid here at his next job, that's about $100k a month for 4 years. He may prefer to negotiate that number down to a lump sum buyout up front and be done with the entire situation. UT would also benefit from doing this as it allows them to have an exact number for their athletic budget for the fiscal year - something they need as they propose to spend $340M on Neyland Stadium beginning next summer.
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Reasons 1 and 2 conflict themselves. Not sure what you're aiming at.

1) Butch Jones did sign it though and if we fire him he gets what he gets. He's not gonna be able to use that as leverage. The mitigation can only benefit UT. Not CBJ.

2) Can't fire for cause on the Title 9, Drae Bowles stuff because it is ancient history. If you want to fire with cause you can't wait 2 years to do so. He's not gonna get touched in this concussion stuff.
 
#2,919
#2,919
GoBigOrangeVols said:
Here is a list of all of the linemen currently on the Roster (except Jack Jones, who is still on the roster but his career is reportedly over):

Drew Richmond R-SO
Coleman Thomas SR
Riley Locklear FR (headed for a redshirt)
Nathan Niehaus R-FR
Brett Kendrick R-SR
Joe Keeler R-SO (walk-on)
Marcus Tatum SO
Brian Garvey R-FR (walk-on)
Ryan Johnson R-FR
Trey Smith FR
K’Rojhn Calbert FR
Jason Robertson SR
Chance Hall JR
Devante Brooks R-FR
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Truly amazing how bad he killed OL depth through injuries and lack of development. Biggest issue is his scheme. Wells trying to teach aggressive and mean but the scheme doesn't allow for it. It is sit back and react instead of attack
 
#2,922
#2,922
HankHill said:
I don’t know what it is but something about Fuente just doesn’t get me excited.
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Great coach. It's probably because he just coaches ball. He doesn't scream to rooftops promoting his program. Not sure about his recruiting either but he finds player that fit his style.

I don't see him leaving where he is. He is at the perfect spot for what he likes.
 
#2,923
#2,923
BigZiti09 said:
Reasons 1 and 2 conflict themselves. Not sure what you're aiming at.

1) Butch Jones did sign it though and if we fire him he gets what he gets. He's not gonna be able to use that as leverage. The mitigation can only benefit UT. Not CBJ.

2) Can't fire for cause on the Title 9, Drae Bowles stuff because it is ancient history. If you want to fire with cause you can't wait 2 years to do so. He's not gonna get touched in this concussion stuff.
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Although it may severely limit head coaching opportunities for him after he gets fired. Not saying that it will, but some schools will see that as a stigma. It only takes one, though.
 
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