Recruiting Forum Talk XL

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#2,902
#2,902
VolGee4 said:
I said earlier today that I would be fine with Mullen, especially after striking out with elite names. He would get better talent at UT. I think he could win the East ever couple of years. Just not sure he is a championship level coach.

That said, just take the time to really look at his records by season. Before the SEC mandated a P5 OOC game, he had 4 automatic wins plus UK. He would go 7-5 with a 3-5 conference record. In one of Dak's years, they played UK and Mizzou from the East (not s good year for them). Arkansas, Auburn, and Ole Miss all have had 3-9 or 2-10 seasons, something that Vandy hasn't done in quite a few years. Just giving you the bad with the good.
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We haven’t won a SEC title in 20 years. I’d be ecstatic just getting there on a consistent basis.
 
#2,904
#2,904
Heres AV's response to your question Chief Vol.



Well clearly he could...but like i said i don’t see it happening under these circumstances.

Gents about to start my decent so gonna hop off an enjoy the rest of my ride. May be around a bit tomorrow..
 
#2,905
#2,905
HankHill said:
We haven’t won a SEC title in 20 years. I’d be ecstatic just getting there on a consistent basis.
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Yea, me too. But Nick is correct. If you dig into his record, it's not great. Not all records are created equal.

Mullen is playing 4 cupcakes while UT schedules Butch for at Oregon and home and home with OU in his first 3 years. Just not the same.
 
#2,906
#2,906
Missed this whole AtlantaVol convo and now with multiple convos going on about multiple boosters, I am confused. Someone help a brother out:

Who is trying to block Jon Gruden?
 
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#2,907
#2,907
Charlie Anderson can go **** himself too then. This petty bull**** is what is keeping the atheltics program from being good. This is 100% from the very top down.
 
#2,909
#2,909
nicksjuzunk said:
Here, I will outline why I oppose a hiring of Dan Mullen. It must be stated beforehand, that the standard response to each point is, "but it's at Miss State." That may work for you, but it don't accept it, sorry.

I believe we can disagree, but logical, thought points are more valuable to the board than cheap one liners, which I no doubt play often, so here is my rationale, which you may take or leave.

I challenge you to remove Dan Mullen's name from your head, and think "Coach X" when reviewing the following, and tell me how impressed you are, and how he is instantly the 2nd best coach in the league.

1. Record vs. ranked opponents at the time of play: 6-33 .181 winning %. That's an average of .75 ranked wins per season while losing to 3.66 ranked teams per season.

Three of those wins are detailed below. The other three:

a. LSU this season, when LSU was BAD... losing to Troy at home.

b. 2016 A&M 8-5, unranked at end of year.

c. 2010 Florida 8-5, unranked at end of year.

2. Magical #1 ranking season: Dan Mullen led MS ST to #1 in the nation in an amazing 2014 season, incredibly beating 8 LSU, 6 A&M and 2 Auburn in successive weeks. The #1 rating was absolutely deserving... at the time. As we know, mid-season rankings mean nothing at all. Where teams land in the end is the true test. How did those juggernaut three teams finish out?

LSU 8-5 unranked
A&M 8-5 unranked
Auburn 8-5 22nd and 23rd in polls

In hindsight, how impressed are you with wins over 8-5 teams? Do you expect UGA, Bama, and Florida to put up a lot of 8-5 seasons in the near future? Yet this is Mullen's high water mark, in a 10-3 season.

To recap this point... Dan Mullen has never beaten a team better than an 8-5 record... this year's LSU team, TBD.

3. Has Never Beaten Bama: Almost everyone in the West has beaten Bama since Mullen has been there. He has not.

4. Career Winning %: 66-44 60%. SEC record, 31-37 46%. As we've seen, he's not beaten many ranked teams, so this 60% winning percentage is built on cupcakes.

5. Division Standings: Mississippi State has averaged the position of 4.375 in their division during Mullen's time there.

6. Wins vs. Losses per season: What's our goal? Winning? Mullen has averaged 7.6 wins per season vs. 5.5 losses. When I say he will average 8-9 per year, I think I am being kind in giving him an extra 20% more than what history shows he has averaged. Some think 9-11? Based on what, pixie dust?

7. Recruiting: 247 rankings

Nationally, SEC Average 27th nationally, 9.5th in the SEC.

2017 26th, 9th
2016 28th, 11th
2015 18th, 8th
2014 36th, 12th
2013 24th, 10th
2012 22nd, 9th
2011 41st, 11th
2010 30th 8th
2009 18th 8th

8. But it doesn't matter... he does more with less, more than any coach in 'Merica!: Are you sure? Remember, he's averaging between 4th and 5th in his own division win loss standings.

During the Mullen era (66 wins), USCe has 70, UGA has 78, FL has 71, Mizzou has 65. So, given he's about 4th-5th in his division, and the East has 3 teams ahead of him (W/L) and Mizzou within one game, I'd say that his performance on field is on par with his 9th in conference ranking.

Are you content with being the 9th best SEC team?

Even Tennessee, in what we have considered to be the worst stretch in our history (Kiffin, Dooley, Jones) has won 56 games in the time that Mullen has been at Mississippi State. Mullen is averaging an extra 1.25 wins per year. Let this sink in... hard. Imagine the wonderful things we could have done with an extra 1.25 wins per year!!! Yeah... not much.

Conclusion: Too much time spent on this already, but there are my reasons. "But Miss State" may comfort you, but I personally find these facts very sobering.
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You make a compelling case for your reasoning. Don't agree and that's OK. You based most of it on Mullen's W/L. It's apples to oranges no matter how you analyze it. It totally removes program, facilities, tradition, recruiting base. You realize UT's historical winning % is .680, right? That means they win almost 7 games out of 10, right? Butch is 4.5 years in at .569. 1.25 more wins per year at Butch's level would be very significant and even more so above UT's historical average. We play in the SECCG last season and possibly the season before had that happened. Alabama is just around .723 even after Saban's run. "Yeah...not much."
 
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#2,910
#2,910
Hammer85 said:
Heres AV's response to your question Chief Vol.



Well clearly he could...but like i said i don’t see it happening under these circumstances.

Gents about to start my decent so gonna hop off an enjoy the rest of my ride. May be around a bit tomorrow..
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What was the question
 
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#2,912
#2,912
VolGee4 said:
Yea, me too. But Nick is correct. If you dig into his record, it's not great. Not all records are created equal.

Mullen is playing 4 cupcakes while UT schedules Butch for at Oregon and home and home with OU in his first 3 years. Just not the same.
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It’s so tiring to run through and compare resumes. It’s so meaningless tbh. No one knows how a coach will do once he’s in the spot light. Heck Burch’s resume was great. 4/6 conference titles as a head coach. Success at multi stops.
 
#2,914
#2,914
VolGee4 said:
I think you are going too far with this with no facts to back it up. It's called speculation.

Not quite fair to a man who has donated 9 figures to the university.
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It's speculation based on what many who are close to the program have said in the past. And that is, big Jim Haslam calls the shots up there. So I would have to assume he's the one who blew up the Blackburn hire.
 
#2,915
#2,915
Outside of Gruden, Peterson, Kelly, Patterson, or some NFL dark horse, Mullen is the best possible hire we could make IMO. Then Frost. Then I'm not so sure.
 
#2,917
#2,917
Hammer85 said:
Heres AV's response to your question Chief Vol.



Well clearly he could...but like i said i don’t see it happening under these circumstances.

Gents about to start my decent so gonna hop off an enjoy the rest of my ride. May be around a bit tomorrow..
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Thank you sir. Hopefully Peyton along with other big dogs will shut him up if he tries to blow things up just so he can get his way.
 
#2,919
#2,919
Nash_Vol97 said:
Missed this whole AtlantaVol convo and now with multiple convos going on about multiple boosters, I am confused. Someone help a brother out:

Who is trying to block Jon Gruden?
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I'm not sure anybody is yet. Atlanta Vol was alluding to a prominent booster who blew up the Blackburn hire. I assumed he was talking about Haslam, but I could be wrong.
 
#2,920
#2,920
VolGee4 said:
Yea, me too. But Nick is correct. If you dig into his record, it's not great. Not all records are created equal.

Mullen is playing 4 cupcakes while UT schedules Butch for at Oregon and home and home with OU in his first 3 years. Just not the same.
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You are talking about a difference in schedule of one out of conference game. We play 3 cupcakes ever year. When you look at Mullen career record at MSU, it's pretty outstanding, all things considered.
 
#2,921
#2,921
How many other coaches at schools in the lower echelons of their conferences, like Mississippi State with 60% winning percentages are exciting you guys?

Maybe studs like

Mike Bobo at CSU

Todd Graham is 60% at ASU

Surely Kirk Ferentz couldn’t be expected to compete with OSU PSU & Michigan at Iowa, but he’s winning about 56% of his games at a place like Iowa.

Larry Fedora is winning 59%, and he has to play Clemson, FSU VT, GT and other teams like that. Maybe Larry can do better here?

This fan base is infatuated with Mullen, and I just don’t get it
 
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#2,923
#2,923
Nash_Vol97 said:
Missed this whole AtlantaVol convo and now with multiple convos going on about multiple boosters, I am confused. Someone help a brother out:

Who is trying to block Jon Gruden?
Click to expand...

He didn't say a name exactly. He used the term "in my neck of the woods."

Some are speculating Big Jim and others are thinking possibly Anderson.
 
#2,924
#2,924
Nash_Vol97 said:
Missed this whole AtlantaVol convo and now with multiple convos going on about multiple boosters, I am confused. Someone help a brother out:

Who is trying to block Jon Gruden?
Click to expand...

No one that we know. Atlanta Vol just said that it's hopeful that it's a more collaborative effort with the coach. Big boosters are concerned about investing more money if it's not fixed. He mentioned that one guy blew up the Blackburn deal.
 
#2,925
#2,925
MrVolton said:
You are talking about a difference in schedule of one out of conference game. We play 3 cupcakes ever year. When you look at Mullen career record at MSU, it's pretty outstanding, all things considered.
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It's actually a huge difference. What would you think if Butch had been to 4 straight bowls and had won 10 games in 2015?

Just go by SEC records if you want to really compare.
 
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