Recruiting Forum Talk XL

[BruinVol]

Boosters can threaten to pull $$ all they want but we all know when it comes to whoever new coach is they will be back giving $$ for that access

I can say with zero hesitation that the higher level Booster I know isn't just bluffing when they say they are pulling their money out. Fwiw Currie is taking such threats seriously and is meeting with such boosters on a daily basis.

 

[BruinVol]

I can't remember if it was Thornton or Anderson heck maybe it was both. But one of those dudes not named haslam was against Blackburn because of an old vendetta regarding Dooley vs Wittingham hire

Anderson is the one that didn't like him Iirc

 

[HankHill]

Every team in West not named Arky could have won the east at some point in past few years. Heck Arky might have one of those years

I have lost more money betting on Arkansas for or against than any other team by far. Hate that team lol. Never know what you’re going to get.

 

[85SugarVol]

I do not like Jim Haslam

I'll never gas up at Pilot again if this goes south

 

[nicksjuzunk]

Here, I will outline why I oppose a hiring of Dan Mullen. It must be stated beforehand, that the standard response to each point is, "but it's at Miss State." That may work for you, but it don't accept it, sorry.

I believe we can disagree, but logical, thought points are more valuable to the board than cheap one liners, which I no doubt play often, so here is my rationale, which you may take or leave.

I challenge you to remove Dan Mullen's name from your head, and think "Coach X" when reviewing the following, and tell me how impressed you are, and how he is instantly the 2nd best coach in the league.

1. Record vs. ranked opponents at the time of play: 6-33 .181 winning %. That's an average of .75 ranked wins per season while losing to 3.66 ranked teams per season.

Three of those wins are detailed below. The other three:

a. LSU this season, when LSU was BAD... losing to Troy at home.

b. 2016 A&M 8-5, unranked at end of year.

c. 2010 Florida 8-5, unranked at end of year.

2. Magical #1 ranking season: Dan Mullen led MS ST to #1 in the nation in an amazing 2014 season, incredibly beating 8 LSU, 6 A&M and 2 Auburn in successive weeks. The #1 rating was absolutely deserving... at the time. As we know, mid-season rankings mean nothing at all. Where teams land in the end is the true test. How did those juggernaut three teams finish out?

LSU 8-5 unranked
A&M 8-5 unranked
Auburn 8-5 22nd and 23rd in polls

In hindsight, how impressed are you with wins over 8-5 teams? Do you expect UGA, Bama, and Florida to put up a lot of 8-5 seasons in the near future? Yet this is Mullen's high water mark, in a 10-3 season.

To recap this point... Dan Mullen has never beaten a team better than an 8-5 record... this year's LSU team, TBD.

3. Has Never Beaten Bama: Almost everyone in the West has beaten Bama since Mullen has been there. He has not.

4. Career Winning %: 66-44 60%. SEC record, 31-37 46%. As we've seen, he's not beaten many ranked teams, so this 60% winning percentage is built on cupcakes.

5. Division Standings: Mississippi State has averaged the position of 4.375 in their division during Mullen's time there.

6. Wins vs. Losses per season: What's our goal? Winning? Mullen has averaged 7.6 wins per season vs. 5.5 losses. When I say he will average 8-9 per year, I think I am being kind in giving him an extra 20% more than what history shows he has averaged. Some think 9-11? Based on what, pixie dust?

7. Recruiting: 247 rankings

Nationally, SEC Average 27th nationally, 9.5th in the SEC.

2017 26th, 9th
2016 28th, 11th
2015 18th, 8th
2014 36th, 12th
2013 24th, 10th
2012 22nd, 9th
2011 41st, 11th
2010 30th 8th
2009 18th 8th

8. But it doesn't matter... he does more with less, more than any coach in 'Merica!: Are you sure? Remember, he's averaging between 4th and 5th in his own division win loss standings.

During the Mullen era (66 wins), USCe has 70, UGA has 78, FL has 71, Mizzou has 65. So, given he's about 4th-5th in his division, and the East has 3 teams ahead of him (W/L) and Mizzou within one game, I'd say that his performance on field is on par with his 9th in conference ranking.

Are you content with being the 9th best SEC team?

Even Tennessee, in what we have considered to be the worst stretch in our history (Kiffin, Dooley, Jones) has won 56 games in the time that Mullen has been at Mississippi State. Mullen is averaging an extra 1.25 wins per year. Let this sink in... hard. Imagine the wonderful things we could have done with an extra 1.25 wins per year!!! Yeah... not much.

Conclusion: Too much time spent on this already, but there are my reasons. "But Miss State" may comfort you, but I personally find these facts very sobering.

 

[85SugarVol]

"Firing Butch Jones now would be helpful for recruiting, especially with the early signing period coming up. The longer the Vols’ brain trust waits, the more recruits will be confused and look around as Jones is viewed as a lame duck coach now anyhow.

Tennessee should have moved on after the South Carolina loss and I am puzzled beyond belief that the trigger wasn’t pulled the day after the Alabama loss. What are the Vols gaining by keeping Jones in charge?

He has to be a lame duck coach. If he’s not and they are considering keeping him if the team runs the table and finishes 8-4 overall, then the people in charge in Knoxville are willing to settle for mediocrity. That’s just my two cents."

- Mike Farrell

 

[Vols4us]

I hope the handful of really dumb rich people that make the call on HC's and AD's will listen intently to PM and the legions of faithful Vol fans that have had enough and will abandon this program in droves for many years if they eff this up.

 

[BeecherVol]

Anderson is the one that didn't like him Iirc

At one time they had their issues.

I'm pretty sure that wasn't a problem at the time of the hire.

 

[McGeesPub]

Here, I will outline why I oppose a hiring of Dan Mullen. It must be stated beforehand, that the standard response to each point is, "but it's at Miss State." That may work for you, but it don't accept it, sorry.

I believe we can disagree, but logical, thought points are more valuable to the board than cheap one liners, which I no doubt play often, so here is my rationale, which you may take or leave.

I challenge you to remove Dan Mullen's name from your head, and think "Coach X" when reviewing the following, and tell me how impressed you are, and how he is instantly the 2nd best coach in the league.

1. Record vs. ranked opponents at the time of play: 6-33 .181 winning %. That's an average of .75 ranked wins per season while losing to 3.66 ranked teams per season.

Three of those wins are detailed below. The other three:

a. LSU this season, when LSU was BAD... losing to Troy at home.

b. 2016 A&M 8-5, unranked at end of year.

c. 2010 Florida 8-5, unranked at end of year.

2. Magical #1 ranking season: Dan Mullen led MS ST to #1 in the nation in an amazing 2014 season, incredibly beating 8 LSU, 6 A&M and 2 Auburn in successive weeks. The #1 rating was absolutely deserving... at the time. As we know, mid-season rankings mean nothing at all. Where teams land in the end is the true test. How did those juggernaut three teams finish out?

LSU 8-5 unranked
A&M 8-5 unranked
Auburn 8-5 22nd and 23rd in polls

In hindsight, how impressed are you with wins over 8-5 teams? Do you expect UGA, Bama, and Florida to put up a lot of 8-5 seasons in the near future? Yet this is Mullen's high water mark, in a 10-3 season.

To recap this point... Dan Mullen has never beaten a team better than an 8-5 record... this year's LSU team, TBD.

3. Has Never Beaten Bama: Almost everyone in the West has beaten Bama since Mullen has been there. He has not.

4. Career Winning %: 66-44 60%. SEC record, 31-37 46%. As we've seen, he's not beaten many ranked teams, so this 60% winning percentage is built on cupcakes.

5. Division Standings: Mississippi State has averaged the position of 4.375 in their division during Mullen's time there.

6. Wins vs. Losses per season: What's our goal? Winning? Mullen has averaged 7.6 wins per season vs. 5.5 losses. When I say he will average 8-9 per year, I think I am being kind in giving him an extra 20% more than what history shows he has averaged. Some think 9-11? Based on what, pixie dust?

7. Recruiting: 247 rankings

Nationally, SEC Average 27th nationally, 9.5th in the SEC.

2017 26th, 9th
2016 28th, 11th
2015 18th, 8th
2014 36th, 12th
2013 24th, 10th
2012 22nd, 9th
2011 41st, 11th
2010 30th 8th
2009 18th 8th

8. But it doesn't matter... he does more with less, more than any coach in 'Merica!: Are you sure? Remember, he's averaging between 4th and 5th in his own division win loss standings.

During the Mullen era (66 wins), USCe has 70, UGA has 78, FL has 71, Mizzou has 65. So, given he's about 4th-5th in his division, and the East has 3 teams ahead of him (W/L) and Mizzou within one game, I'd say that his performance on field is on par with his 9th in conference ranking.

Are you content with being the 9th best SEC team?

Even Tennessee, in what we have considered to be the worst stretch in our history (Kiffin, Dooley, Jones) has won 56 games in the time that Mullen has been at Mississippi State. Mullen is averaging an extra 1.25 wins per year. Let this sink in... hard. Imagine the wonderful things we could have done with an extra 1.25 wins per year!!! Yeah... not much.

Conclusion: Too much time spent on this already, but there are my reasons. "But Miss State" may comfort you, but I personally find these facts very sobering.

Great post, and I agree with you.

 

[Chief Vol 13]

I don’t understand his desire to make us Virginia. And of course the Browns....nuff said. Dude is killing our program single handedly if he is prohibiting things or would prohibit Gruden

It's pretty maddening. What irritates me even more is why we can't have people tell the old man to kick rocks. I really don't understand it.

 

[Chief Vol 13]

Thought it was Thornton that hated Blackburn?

Haslam I'm pretty sure

 

[85SugarVol]

I can't remember if it was Thornton or Anderson heck maybe it was both. But one of those dudes not named haslam was against Blackburn because of an old vendetta regarding Dooley vs Wittingham hire

Charlie Anderson is the one that got into it with Blackburn. Allegedly.

 

[HankHill]

Here, I will outline why I oppose a hiring of Dan Mullen. It must be stated beforehand, that the standard response to each point is, "but it's at Miss State." That may work for you, but it don't accept it, sorry.

I believe we can disagree, but logical, thought points are more valuable to the board than cheap one liners, which I no doubt play often, so here is my rationale, which you may take or leave.

I challenge you to remove Dan Mullen's name from your head, and think "Coach X" when reviewing the following, and tell me how impressed you are, and how he is instantly the 2nd best coach in the league.

1. Record vs. ranked opponents at the time of play: 6-33 .181 winning %. That's an average of .75 ranked wins per season while losing to 3.66 ranked teams per season.

Three of those wins are detailed below. The other three:

a. LSU this season, when LSU was BAD... losing to Troy at home.

b. 2016 A&M 8-5, unranked at end of year.

c. 2010 Florida 8-5, unranked at end of year.

2. Magical #1 ranking season: Dan Mullen led MS ST to #1 in the nation in an amazing 2014 season, incredibly beating 8 LSU, 6 A&M and 2 Auburn in successive weeks. The #1 rating was absolutely deserving... at the time. As we know, mid-season rankings mean nothing at all. Where teams land in the end is the true test. How did those juggernaut three teams finish out?

LSU 8-5 unranked
A&M 8-5 unranked
Auburn 8-5 22nd and 23rd in polls

In hindsight, how impressed are you with wins over 8-5 teams? Do you expect UGA, Bama, and Florida to put up a lot of 8-5 seasons in the near future? Yet this is Mullen's high water mark, in a 10-3 season.

To recap this point... Dan Mullen has never beaten a team better than an 8-5 record... this year's LSU team, TBD.

3. Has Never Beaten Bama: Almost everyone in the West has beaten Bama since Mullen has been there. He has not.

4. Career Winning %: 66-44 60%. SEC record, 31-37 46%. As we've seen, he's not beaten many ranked teams, so this 60% winning percentage is built on cupcakes.

5. Division Standings: Mississippi State has averaged the position of 4.375 in their division during Mullen's time there.

6. Wins vs. Losses per season: What's our goal? Winning? Mullen has averaged 7.6 wins per season vs. 5.5 losses. When I say he will average 8-9 per year, I think I am being kind in giving him an extra 20% more than what history shows he has averaged. Some think 9-11? Based on what, pixie dust?

7. Recruiting: 247 rankings

Nationally, SEC Average 27th nationally, 9.5th in the SEC.

2017 26th, 9th
2016 28th, 11th
2015 18th, 8th
2014 36th, 12th
2013 24th, 10th
2012 22nd, 9th
2011 41st, 11th
2010 30th 8th
2009 18th 8th

8. But it doesn't matter... he does more with less, more than any coach in 'Merica!: Are you sure? Remember, he's averaging between 4th and 5th in his own division win loss standings.

During the Mullen era (66 wins), USCe has 70, UGA has 78, FL has 71, Mizzou has 65. So, given he's about 4th-5th in his division, and the East has 3 teams ahead of him (W/L) and Mizzou within one game, I'd say that his performance on field is on par with his 9th in conference ranking.

Are you content with being the 9th best SEC team?

Even Tennessee, in what we have considered to be the worst stretch in our history (Kiffin, Dooley, Jones) has won 56 games in the time that Mullen has been at Mississippi State. Mullen is averaging an extra 1.25 wins per year. Let this sink in... hard. Imagine the wonderful things we could have done with an extra 1.25 wins per year!!! Yeah... not much.

Conclusion: Too much time spent on this already, but there are my reasons. "But Miss State" may comfort you, but I personally find these facts very sobering.

I just see a lot of similarities to Gary Patterson and I think he is basically James Franklin and we see how he is doing now that he’s got his big time job. I still say there are 10+ guys that could do great here. And great to me is ~10 wins a year and in Atlanta every other year basically. That’s realistic to me.

 

[Bassmaster_Vol]

- Mike Farrell

Boom! Fire him already! And if you don’t, then fire Currie!

 

[Grey_pilgrim]

For those not reading between the lines Blackburn was all but signed. Haslam said here’s Currie. It seems plenty of others are ready to pull out donations if this hire isn’t substantial. It seems all big boosters are getting on board because they realized they had to. No more d... measuring on this hire.

I’m guessing Peyton has been the mediator of those big guns. Only man who could imo

Peyton for Prez

 

[Skizer41]

It's pretty maddening. What irritates me even more is why we can't have people tell the old man to kick rocks. I really don't understand it.

This!!! I'm pretty sure he's not even the richest booster. In fact I don't even think it's close.

 

[Chief Vol 13]

For those not reading between the lines Blackburn was all but signed. Haslam said here’s Currie. It seems plenty of others are ready to pull out donations if this hire isn’t substantial. It seems all big boosters are getting on board because they realized they had to. No more d... measuring on this hire.

I’m guessing Peyton has been the mediator of those big guns. Only man who could imo

Doug Mathews has said on numerous occasions that big Jim has ultimately made all the major decisions regarding football and athletic director searches over the years. It's high time that changed.

 

[Chief Vol 13]

I think you’re confused. We are talking about Jim Haslam. Big Jim the owner of the Browns.

Bill while having what I assume is major power with the state university is not who Atl was referring imo. It was Jim

Little Jim is the owner of the Browns. Big Jim runs UT athletics. He played on Neyland's 51 national championship team.

 

[volfanCLT]

MSU is consistently the least talented team in the West. Worst job in that division.

Outperforms every year.

Averaging 7 wins a year is outperforming their talent by about 2 games. He does that at UT, we’re looking pretty.

 

[nicksjuzunk]

MSU is consistently the least talented team in the West. Worst job in that division.

Outperforms every year.

Averaging 7 wins a year is outperforming their talent by about 2 games. He does that at UT, we’re looking pretty.

Averages 4-5 in their division annually. Not sure what magic you are seeing happening down there

.

 

[nicksjuzunk]

I just see a lot of similarities to Gary Patterson and I think he is basically James Franklin and we see how he is doing now that he’s got his big time job. I still say there are 10+ guys that could do great here. And great to me is ~10 wins a year and in Atlanta every other year basically. That’s realistic to me.

I would take that 10 win expectation gladly.

 

[VolGee4]

Auburn and ole miss have been more good than bad with auburn being great a fews years

I said earlier today that I would be fine with Mullen, especially after striking out with elite names. He would get better talent at UT. I think he could win the East ever couple of years. Just not sure he is a championship level coach.

That said, just take the time to really look at his records by season. Before the SEC mandated a P5 OOC game, he had 4 automatic wins plus UK. He would go 7-5 with a 3-5 conference record. In one of Dak's years, they played UK and Mizzou from the East (not s good year for them). Arkansas, Auburn, and Ole Miss all have had 3-9 or 2-10 seasons, something that Vandy hasn't done in quite a few years. Just giving you the bad with the good.

 

[volfanCLT]

Averages 4-5 in their division annually. Not sure what magic you are seeing happening down there

.

I’m seeing a team that should finish lower than 4-5 every year. He finishes higher than they should.

Shows me a coach who overachieves with the talent he has in the toughest division in football. Consistently.

He would have much more talent at UT to work with.

 

[HankHill]

Averages 4-5 in their division annually. Not sure what magic you are seeing happening down there

.

In today’s college football, do you think anyone outside of Meyer or saban could win the SEC at MSU?

 

[MrVolton]

I have lost more money betting on Arkansas for or against than any other team by far. Hate that team lol. Never know what you’re going to get.

The Eagles in the McNabb-Reid era used to blow my parlays up on a regular basis.