Recruiting Forum Football Talk XXXVI

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#6,777
#6,777
bignewt said:
anybody else like the cocks -4 tomorrow?
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Didn't it jump to -6 now? Should win at home. Thought about throwing them in a teaser along with TN +11.5/Under, OK St/Pitt over, Oregon/Wyoming over, UCLA/Memphis Over but I tend to prefer double digit dog points in my teasers than faves so I may leave them out and do separate
 
#6,778
#6,778
BigZiti09 said:
5 is what I always feared. Statistically his defenses looked good but it was fools gold.
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Yeah I kinda worry that was the case, but it still seems like if his defenses were just overrated, he'd be able to put a decent or middle of the pack defense together.
 
#6,779
#6,779
Vols4us said:
These.

The guys who messed up the opponents being able to get outside easily were DB and a healthy Cam Sutton. Outside of them occasionally getting to the ball carrier, it has been a recurring theme. The common denominator over the 4+ seasons is Butch.

The O-line is not beaten much physically when the right guys are playing, which was a major problem for a few years. More often they are beat mentally. This is why Jay is correct on the play calls. Max protect with the TE when the O-line is getting beat. Go with quicker releasing passes/routes. Have the RB chip and release if no blitz up the middle. The slow developing stuff will only work if it is play action after it has been set up by other stuff. The past O-line coach and OC's are gone. Let's see how Wells/Scott does. I'm seeing some hopeful signs with those two.

If you have obvious weaknesses year after year, they have to be addressed by the HC as soon as he can establish a trend in each game, not just after the game or season. That includes his own mistakes in game management. He's 10+ years in as a HC now, no excuses. This is where I personally believe his commitment to his system is getting in the way at times. Win. Don't care about the system. He can do it if he will get out of his own way. Start tomorrow for this season and approach each game that way.
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Play press coverage and watch how easy the edge gets set.
 
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#6,780
#6,780
For the bettors out there, a system in play this weekend Fromm betlabs

College teams that are 0-2 ATS in first 2 weeks of season....(guess who qualifies)
.Vols!!!!

WGWTFA
 
#6,782
#6,782
Kingston Vol said:
Question: a bad game plan with a whole off-season to prepare doesn't concern you? You seem to have confidence this concerns will be addressed and corrected. I think there is reason to doubt it.
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It doesn't concern me if the game plan changes against traditional teams, starting this week.
 
#6,784
#6,784
Catbone said:
How many years should he get to win the east? 10?
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Probably around 10 for some to these people. We should be cool with 8 win seasons because I mean look at how we've been over the last 10 years or so. Never mind the fact that from a period of around 1926 to 2004 Tennessee was the winningrest program in college football.
 
#6,786
#6,786
WallyBalls said:
I don't even believe that's any sort of real narrative (the "saving it" stuff) especially against GT. Maybe among the dimmest of fans, but not enough to even worry about. We weren't hiding anything. That's worrisome, I admit.

Now, ISU, I don't blame them a bit. That game was a paid open scrimmage with hired practice players. Basically one day of practice coming in. Run your base stuff and get ready for this week. I know there is disagreement there, but I don't think that game has any bearing on the season good or bad.

Sure, there will be things people point back at, but you can do that with any game.
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What we run on defense vs Georgia tech is totally different from what we will throw at Florida. We weren't hiding anything in that game. The defensive gameplan just sucked.
 
#6,791
#6,791
Crazy Ivan said:
Not sure you can judge him based off that one 2016 season at Oregon. He inherited a defense that was very flawed. The season prior, 2015, that defense ranked #116 in total defense and gave up 37.5 ppg. There had been dissention in the lockerroom with players calling each other out for lack of effort, and there were a lot of criticisms of Helfrich for the overall culture within the program. And talking to some friends who are Duck fans, they didn't have the talent they needed on the DL. It was a tough situation to go into. Not saying he doesn't deserve any blame, just that it is very difficult to come in and correct major problems in one season.
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Appreciate your thoughts. I didn't know all of that info, as I don't keep up with them any...just saw the stats. Has he been a DC at other places, and how successful was he?
 
#6,793
#6,793
BigZiti09 said:
Up until last year I always felt we were well prepared, well coached, disciplined.

Even when we were winning last year something seemed off.

I think our defense had a bad game plan for Ga Tech.

I don't see how we are still gnashing teeth over it two weeks later at 2-0. If we had beat ISU by 70 or by 30 it doesn't mean much at all.
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Agree 100%. Just can't wrap my head around last year.
 
#6,794
#6,794
Kingston Vol said:
Agreed. But can you put toothpaste back in the tube? Once Dooley started to allow this type of thing he was D.O.A. Players didn't respect him anymore. I'm not saying Butch is to that point yet - but it's not something we (fans) would see until it's too late.
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It's obvious players still respect him 💯. Did you see their fight the first game of the year? That doesn't happen if you could care less about your HC.
 
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#6,795
#6,795
OGbabyaviVol said:
It's obvious players still respect him 💯. Did you see their fight the first game of the year? That doesn't happen if you could care less about your HC.
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Very possible and I don't dismiss it at all. It's also possible they just had way more talent and eventually it kicked in.
 
#6,796
#6,796
Chief Vol 13 said:
Probably around 10 for some to these people. We should be cool with 8 win seasons because I mean look at how we've been over the last 10 years or so. Never mind the fact that from a period of around 1926 to 2004 Tennessee was the winningrest program in college football.
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We can all pick any portion of UT football history to support any narrative we choose. But, if you are willing to deal strictly in facts:

If I keyed everything into Excel correctly, through the 2016 season our all-time record was 829-375-53 for a winning percentage of .681. If you apply that record to a 13 game season, then our history would indicate that Tennessee's expectation, on average, should be to go 8.6 - 3.9 - 0.5 each year. Obviously, I realize that there are no tie games anymore. Using the winning percentage formula, which awards 0.5 wins for a tie game, then you could say that our expectation should be a record of 8.85 - 4.15 each year.

We all would like to win 10 games a year, and I don't think that is an unrealistic expectation for some years. But if you're going to talk about the realm of what is realistic vs. unrealistic, 9-4 is right about what our history suggests we should expect. Butch does need to win 10 or more at some point, but to use our history to suggest that he's underachieving is erroneous.
 
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#6,799
#6,799
Kingston Vol said:
Very possible and I don't dismiss it at all. It's also possible they just had way more talent and eventually it kicked in.
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I don't think that's the case. There have been numerous examples over the years where the more talented team got punched in the mouth over and over, and quit. We had the opportunity to quit multiple times, but didn't.
 
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