Recruiting Forum Football Talk XXXVI

[Brillovol]

2 things I think about this game:

Our front 7 on D isn't as good as UFs. In fact ours is probably bottom half SEC.

Franks is a little better than what he showed against UM. He has talent and a good arm.

Add Tuttle back in the mix and we look a lot different.

 

[AWVOL]

Never get the skinny jeans, but a decent fit with a little stretch is awesome. Once I got a pair of Lucky's with the stretchy stuff I never went back. It's just more comfortable.

Just say no to the fancy stitching or bedazzled jeans for men. There's a man code violation or two in there somewhere.

I have worn American Eagle jeans for the last 15 years. Then they went all crazy with the stretchy crap. I don't know what to wear now!

 

[Darth_Shiveman]

Why do some people poke fun at the 17-4 narrative?

A more relevant stat is this one:

Since the beginning of the 2015 season, only 10 P5 teams have won as many games as Tennessee.

That's impressive enough to me and a more accurate indication of where we are as a program.

But to draw an imaginary line at some point in the 2015 season just so you can pretend we've been as good as Bama, Clemson, OU, and OSU the past two seasons seems a little arbitrary and disengenous to me.

 

[Chief Vol 13]

I haven't watched the interview, but was assuming what Shoop was saying basically was "Bituli's role in a 4-2-5 is as the MLB" not "Bituli is our MLB in the 4-2-5" if that makes any sense.

For the life of me I can't understand how Bituli wouldn't be our starting middle linebacker. The guy had more tackles in a game than any other Tennessee football player did since the late 80's or somewhere around in there. If Jumper starts it's a crime IMO.

 

[volfanCLT]

Frank’s cracked under the pressure against UM. I’m glad that he didn’t get the tune up game last weekend to help his confidence. We need to blitz and bring the heat early and often. Can’t let him start to get comfortable.

Also, if he doesn’t do well, I think we see Del Rio.

Can we get pressure without blitzing Saturday?

I'm not so confident leaving our corners/safeties out on the edges with the athletes they have. If we bring the blitzes, the better hit or we could give up some big plays.

Taylor, Kongbo, and Phillips have to step up and get pressure

 

[Chief Vol 13]

First of all, there are great facilities all across the country. That is certainly one huge change in the last 20 years. All P5 schools have money, and most of the top half of each P5 conference have excellent facilities. Second, IMO, the recruiting budget is high because we had to recruit out of state more than other schools. It's not because we purposely allocate more. You have to find players, and as compared to UF, UGA, LSU, etc., we had to spend more to find them. The instate talent is a new phenomenon. It hasn't been the case, and that is what has been an obstacle. Talent in East TN is not great, and most talent in TN is 3 hours away, the same distance as areas out of state as well. The hope is that we continue to keep the instate talent, and the program should get better. The recruiting budget would also decrease.

While I think highly of my school, I am not sure that UT has been a top 12 job. I can think of 4 in the SEC alone that are higher, and 2 others are debatable. That leaves 4 other conferences. There are many things that go into that including recruiting advantages and the strength of the conferences. I do think that the increase in TN high school talent will raise the level of the job.

Before Fulmer was fired, Tennessee was seen by most as a top 10 job at that time. Through Dooley and Kiffin we dipped, but we should be back up in that realm now. Tennessee at the very least is a top 15 job, and as I said earlier I think a top 12. Tennessee fans should expect to be one of the premiere programs in college football most years. This is not a middle of the road program.

 

[The Dog]

For the life of me I can't understand how Bituli wouldn't be our starting middle linebacker. The guy had more tackles in a game than any other Tennessee football player did since the late 80's or somewhere around in there. If Jumper starts it's a crime IMO.

Now this we can agree on, Bituli needs to be starting and even more importantly getting the most snaps of all UTs LBs

 

[Darth_Shiveman]

For the life of me I can't understand how Bituli wouldn't be our starting middle linebacker. The guy had more tackles in a game than any other Tennessee football player did since the late 80's or somewhere around in there. If Jumper starts it's a crime IMO.

If we're playing a lot of 4-2-5 and Bituli isn't out there around half the time at least, I'll be pretty upset most likely. If I'm UF I'm circling 53 and trying to figure out ways to attack him every play he's in the game.

 

[SpringBokVol]

I think UF feels they will be able to throw on us, test the CBs and Safties.

I think they take a shot right away - first or second play. Trying to give themselves a shot in the arm.

I just hope we are ready and don't help them.

I want to see us break their spirits early and often.

That team will straight give up if we start boat racing them.

 

[VolGee4]

The elite period was twice that long. 89-93 should be included as well.

I'm curious though. You're on record saying that all schools currently have resources, so apparently we can't use our substantial resources as rationale for why some of us think we aren't where we should be. Now apparently many- according to you- don't have a grasp of what our historical standards should say about where our program should be. I'm just curious, what is your benchmark? Just happy to be here to watch some football?

Eh, aside from 1989, we had four straight years of 9 wins and an 8 win season in 1994. Sure, we played one less game then, but there is no guarantee that we win an extra game to hit double digits. We just won 9 games for the last two years.

The point is that a small stretch in our long history seemed to elevate the expectations, and the historical standard is out of whack by some. College football has simply changed. The difference between a school like UT and one like Oklahoma State or TCU or Oregon or even Clemson has shrunk. Those schools probably don't have as many overall wins as UT, but the money is all the same now. They make just as much as UT does, and they have caught up in resources and facilities.

You certainly do have a way of going to extremes. I guess I just like to watch football. Hell no, I was disappointed last year. I just stated that I expect to win the East soon. We have a great program. But historical standards can be thrown out the window. This isn't 1970 or even 1990 college football anymore. It's all big money, and right now, we live in Saban's world.

 

[volfanCLT]

I think UF feels they will be able to throw on us, test the CBs and Safties.

I think they take a shot right away - first or second play. Trying to give themselves a shot in the arm.

I just hope we are ready and don't help them.

I want to see us break their spirits early and often.

That team will straight give up if we start boat racing them.

Agree 100%. They did the same thing last year and burnt Martin

 

[Nashvegas31]

They will bring the heat on Franks and Zaire. No doubt. Been caged for two weeks unable to let it rip.

 

[Catbone]

That's exactly what it means.

No.

 

[McGeesPub]

Eh, aside from 1989, we had four straight years of 9 wins and an 8 win season in 1994. Sure, we played one less game then, but there is no guarantee that we win an extra game to hit double digits. We just won 9 games for the last two years.

The point is that a small stretch in our long history seemed to elevate the expectations, and the historical standard is out of whack by some. College football has simply changed. The difference between a school like UT and one like Oklahoma State or TCU or Oregon or even Clemson has shrunk. Those schools probably don't have as many overall wins as UT, but the money is all the same now. They make just as much as UT does, and they have caught up in resources and facilities.

You certainly do have a way of going to extremes. I guess I just like to watch football. Hell no, I was disappointed last year. I just stated that I expect to win the East soon. We have a great program. But historical standards can be thrown out the window. This isn't 1970 or even 1990 college football anymore. It's all big money, and right now, we live in Saban's world.

We won the SEC in 1989 (tied) and 1990 (outright). Hard to pose an argument about those 2 years. 91 and 93 were as good as several seasons in the range you referenced except for blow out losses to Penn State in bowls. 92 saw us beat Georgia and Florida, but was a bit derailed due to the coaching turmoil. So I think it's an elite period.

I will admit that UT's history is streaky, but it is still elite. But to your point about what it means, I look at the top 10 today, and I see names like Alabama, Oklahoma, USC, Penn State, Michigan, and Ohio State. These aren't new money programs- in fact, they are fellow members of of the top 10 all time in wins and winning percentage. I'm not sure if fans of those schools are as reluctant to acknowledge their rightful place as our own seem to be, but to me, it shows that history and resources DO mean something.

 

[Nash_Vol97]

Can we get pressure without blitzing Saturday?

I'm not so confident leaving our corners/safeties out on the edges with the athletes they have. If we bring the blitzes, the better hit or we could give up some big plays.

Taylor, Kongbo, and Phillips have to step up and get pressure

I think we will get pressure and hopefully it’s consistent. UF OL looked terrible. If we can’t get pressure against that line then we have some trouble. Gotta hope the secondary can hold up, they really haven’t been tested yet.

 

[Nash_Vol97]

Agree 100%. They did the same thing last year and burnt Martin

Same thing with the UM game too. Took that one deep shot on first drive. Got the offense their only points of the day.

 

[GoBigOrange86]

There is nothing that would give me greater pleasure than the Vols dominating Florida this weekend and shutting everyone up.

Butch Jones hasn't been a perfect coach by any means. But he's made Tennessee relevant again. He, and his team, deserve this win. I'll be there in Gainesville happily losing my voice. Go Vols!

 

[HankHill]

We won the SEC in 1989 (tied) and 1990 (outright). Hard to pose an argument about those 2 years. 91 and 93 were as good as several seasons in the range you referenced except for blow out losses to Penn State in bowls. 92 saw us beat Georgia and Florida, but was a bit derailed due to the coaching turmoil. So I think it's an elite period.

I will admit that UT's history is streaky, but it is still elite. But to your point about what it means, I look at the top 10 today, and I see names like Alabama, Oklahoma, USC, Penn State, Michigan, and Ohio State. These aren't new money programs- in fact, they are fellow members of of the top 10 all time in wins and winning percentage. I'm not sure if fans of those schools are as reluctant to acknowledge their rightful place as our own seem to be, but to me, it shows that history and resources DO mean something.

History is more important to fans than recruits tbh. A good chunk of power 5 schools are also at least comparable in facilities. In fact, until this current renovation...we were the only SEC school without 2 full size outdoor practice fields we had basically 1.5. Schools like Washington who were once great, then basically hit rock bottom, are back to "elite" in no time with the right guy at the helm, which imo, is more important than any past trophies as long as your faculties/recruiting budget are comprable.

 

[fearsvols]

Definitely have to jump on their heads QUICK.
Get it 17-3 or so.

None of this 3 and out **** early.

Impose our will with Kelly. And turn their garbage offense over . Make that swamp start emptying early 4th quarter

far from being negative but through 2 games there have been way to many negative plays and 3 and outs. There seems to be a lack of consistency on the offense. I get some of the inaccurate throws, new qb and young wr.

 

[BJWeeks]

Agree 100%. They did the same thing last year and burnt Martin

Keys to victory
Run the football
Leave Justin Martin in Knoxville

 

[McGeesPub]

History is more important to fans than recruits tbh. A good chunk of power 5 schools are also at least comparable in facilities. In fact, until this current renovation...we were the only SEC school without 2 full size outdoor practice fields we had basically 1.5. Schools like Washington who were once great, then basically hit rock bottom, are back to "elite" in no time with the right guy at the helm, which imo, is more important than any past trophies as long as your faculties/recruiting budget are comprable.

I agree with a lot of this, history isn't going to move the needle too much for the majority of recruits. It's not a magic bullet. There is still something to be had in the perception in recruiting, and an offer from a historical powerhouse will carry some weight with some kids, but certainly not all.

And I could not agree more about the right coach being in place. All of the programs in that group I mentioned went through dips to some degree that were only corrected (and corrected quickly) once they got the right guy to come. But I don't think it's an accident that these schools are in the top 10 historically as well as at present.

 

[ChattaTNVol]

We won the SEC in 1989 (tied) and 1990 (outright). Hard to pose an argument about those 2 years. 91 and 93 were as good as several seasons in the range you referenced except for blow out losses to Penn State in bowls. 92 saw us beat Georgia and Florida, but was a bit derailed due to the coaching turmoil. So I think it's an elite period.

I will admit that UT's history is streaky, but it is still elite. But to your point about what it means, I look at the top 10 today, and I see names like Alabama, Oklahoma, USC, Penn State, Michigan, and Ohio State. These aren't new money programs- in fact, they are fellow members of of the top 10 all time in wins and winning percentage. I'm not sure if fans of those schools are as reluctant to acknowledge their rightful place as our own seem to be, but to me, it shows that history and resources DO mean something.

We're doing pretty good from a 247 composite team talent perspective. We still need a bit in some position groups but with the class coming in next year our team talent may crack the top 10. We were 12 in 2015, dropped to 14 last year and are back up to 12 this year so onward and upward.

http://247sports.com/Season/2017-Football/CollegeTeamTalentComposite

 

[Darth_Shiveman]

far from being negative but through 2 games there have been way to many negative plays and 3 and outs. There seems to be a lack of consistency on the offense. I get some of the inaccurate throws, new qb and young wr.

I've kinda felt like Scott was trying more to get Dormady and the WRs settled in the last two games than he was trying to score at times.

Hopefully this week and moving forward we lean more on our RBs. I think we're pretty solid with our top 4 backs. Jakob has impressed me as a run blocker. The OL is better at run blocking than pass blocking right now.

Unless they just completely stuff everything we try to do on the ground the first few drives, I'm hoping we see a 25-30 carry day for JK and Chandler or CFA getting another 10-15 combined carries.

If we get the ground game rolling right off the bat, the passing game should open up for Dormady and the receivers just fine.

 

[tomq_123]

I think UF feels they will be able to throw on us, test the CBs and Safties.

I think they take a shot right away - first or second play. Trying to give themselves a shot in the arm.

I just hope we are ready and don't help them.

I want to see us break their spirits early and often.

That team will straight give up if we start boat racing them.

I think they run the jet sweep with Powell and Hammond and the QB keeper until we prove we can stop the run.

 

[Darth_Shiveman]

Keys to victory
Run the football
Leave Justin Martin in Knoxville

Honestly my two biggest keys are to not turn the ball over and to win the field position battle.

UF might hit some plays for chunk yardage against us, but if we make them drive the field like we did GT, I don't see them scoring very many points.