Recruiting Forum Football Talk XXXVI

[Ron Swanson]

This week, the Vols are looking to go 3-0 in back to back years for only the second time since the SEC went to divisional play starting in 1992. The only other time it's happened was 2003-2004. Since divisional play started the Vols have started 3-0 six times but only once in back to back seasons.

-Hubbs

 

[McGeesPub]

meh. Year 4 (last year) was his first year with all his players. I'm not saying he had three "year zeros", I'm just saying the standard (in my eyes) wasn't that he must win the SECE until last year.

His first year was "year zero" from a "who cares what happens on the field, just recruit and get better." (accomplished)

Year 2 was get bowl eligible. (accomplished)

Year 3 was get to a better bowl, set yourself up to compete next year. (accomplished)

Year 4 - win SECE (failed)

Year 5 win SECE (in progress)

Year 6 win SECE

That is the only minimum standard from here on out for him.

Again, JMO, but that is how I see things big picture for him.

I think your year 3 is miscalibrated. Maybe in a vacuum it would be a tall task to win an SEC division in year 3, but the East was horrible that year, and the only way to describe what he did in Gainesville is absolutely blowing it. Year 3 started the clock.

 

[VolinArizona]

Why is everyone pumping up Bentley? I just watched every throw he made against NCST and I'm not worried.

Here's what I counted:

•*1 "WOW" throw
•*4-5 solid/standard throws
•*7-8 off target or bad throws
•*1 INT
•*2 dropped, sure fire INTs

He has very good pocket awareness and moves well. He seems pretty heady. Roper is doing a good job with him and as far as our defense goes, they will probably score 24+.

However, Bentley didn't wow me at all. He's also 19, so I know he'll get better. But so far, he isn't better than QD imo.

 

[BigZiti09]

I think your year 3 is miscalibrated. Maybe in a vacuum it would be a tall task to win an SEC division in year 3, but the East was horrible that year, and the only way to describe what he did in Gainesville is absolutely blowing it. Year 3 started the clock.

Everyone talks about CBJ not going for two in that game. That's not why we lost though. Just easier to point the finger at Butch that way.

Jancek's defense couldn't get a stop.

The gameplan in that game was great. We pulled out all the stops to put points on the board against a great defense when we had very little offense at the time.

Defense lost that game.

 

[BruinVol]

Why is everyone pumping up Bentley? I just watched every throw he made against NCST and I'm not worried.

Here's what I counted:

•*1 "WOW" throw
•*4-5 solid/standard throws
•*7-8 off target or bad throws
•*1 INT
•*2 dropped, sure fire INTs

He has very good pocket awareness and moves well. He seems pretty heady. Roper is doing a good job with him and as far as our defense goes, they will probably score 24+.

However, Bentley didn't wow me at all. He's also 19, so I know he'll get better. But so far, he isn't better than QD imo.

Shurmur is the QB getting overlooked. Vandy beats KState his week and he keeps up the hot play.

 

[Catbone]

Defense has been the reason for pretty much every one of our losses since Butch arrived

 

[McGeesPub]

Everyone talks about CBJ not going for two in that game. That's not why we lost though. Just easier to point the finger at Butch that way.

Jancek's defense couldn't get a stop.

The gameplan in that game was great. We pulled out all the stops to put points on the board against a great defense when we had very little offense at the time.

Defense lost that game.

I agree- the mistake with the two point conversion is not the only reason we lost that game. There were also poorly called timeouts, and as you mentioned, the defense. Which, given the inability to field an SEC defense in Year 5, is troubling past the point of compartmentalizing it with whoever is the DC at the time.

 

[BruinVol]

Defense has been the reason for prettt much every one of our losses since Butch arrived

Speaking of that I see a very different approach under Scott. Would love to see how many snaps have been played with 2 TEs.

Younger Wolf getting hurt isn't good for that. Any reports on him?

 

[Ron Swanson]

meh. Year 4 (last year) was his first year with all his players. I'm not saying he had three "year zeros", I'm just saying the standard (in my eyes) wasn't that he must win the SECE until last year.

His first year was "year zero" from a "who cares what happens on the field, just recruit and get better." (accomplished)

Year 2 was get bowl eligible. (accomplished)

Year 3 was get to a better bowl, set yourself up to compete next year. (accomplished)

Year 4 - win SECE (failed)

Year 5 win SECE (in progress)

Year 6 win SECE

That is the only minimum standard from here on out for him.

Again, JMO, but that is how I see things big picture for him.

I understand, I just couldn't help myself with the year zero Dooley comment. But the bottom line is no more excuses this fall.

Muschamp inherited a terrible roster and looks pretty good in year 2, UF clearly sucks on offense and their D isn't the same now with Muschamp's players gone and Mac's lack of quality recruiting, UGA has good talent and depth but Kirby hasn't proven he's a good HC yet and he's also in year 2. If Butch can't win this division in year 4 and 5 it's hard to think he ever will. But I'm still optimistic that things are going to go very well this season and we're going to win the East.

It starts this weekend, let's kick some gator tail!!!

 

[BJHSVol]

Why is everyone pumping up Bentley? I just watched every throw he made against NCST and I'm not worried.

Here's what I counted:

•*1 "WOW" throw
•*4-5 solid/standard throws
•*7-8 off target or bad throws
•*1 INT
•*2 dropped, sure fire INTs

He has very good pocket awareness and moves well. He seems pretty heady. Roper is doing a good job with him and as far as our defense goes, they will probably score 24+.

However, Bentley didn't wow me at all. He's also 19, so I know he'll get better. But so far, he isn't better than QD imo.

Bill Connelly mentioned in his SC season preview article that the difference last year pre- and post- Bentley was actually a lot more minimal than the hype Bentley got from it. They went from averaging 14 pts per game to 27 pts per game, but that includes 2 FCS level opponents, West Carolina and UMASS, and then 2 other opponents that had collapsing Defenses by the end of the year, us and Mizzou.

 

[GoBigOrangeVols]

I'm sure it has already been posted, but I was at the game Sat and haven't had a chance to watch the replay yet -- was there ever an answer given as to why the Indiana St. touchdown wasn't reviewed/challenged? I thought Butch clearly called the timeout to challenge it, but the ref never announced anything.

 

[BruinVol]

I'm sure it has already been posted, but I was at the game Sat and haven't had a chance to watch the replay yet -- was there ever an answer given as to why the Indiana St. touchdown wasn't reviewed/challenged? I thought Butch clearly called the timeout to challenge it, but the ref never announced anything.

I assumed it was reviewed during the TO and wasn't worth taking a longer look.

 

[Catbone]

Speaking of that I see a very different approach under Scott. Would love to see how many snaps have been played with 2 TEs.

Younger Wolf getting hurt isn't good for that. Any reports on him?

Sprained ankle last I heard. Next year we should have some more options at TE, but Ethan Wolf won't be here

 

[BigZiti09]

I agree- the mistake with the two point conversion is not the only reason we lost that game. There were also poorly called timeouts, and as you mentioned, the defense. Which, given the inability to field an SEC defense in Year 5, is troubling past the point of compartmentalizing it with whoever is the DC at the time.

Defense was good enough to get a stop. Should have gotten a stop. CBJ and the offense got the points on the board. Gave the game to the defense. Just like Oklahoma. Defense let us down.

 

[Ericvol2096]

I just want to see a disciplined, motivated and angry/physical team on the field Saturday.

Leave everything single thing we have out there on that field and I almost guarantee we win.

 

[GoBigOrangeVols]

I understand, I just couldn't help myself with the year zero Dooley comment. But the bottom line is no more excuses this fall.

Muschamp inherited a terrible roster and looks pretty good in year 2, UF clearly sucks on offense and their D isn't the same now with Muschamp's players gone and Mac's lack of quality recruiting, UGA has good talent and depth but Kirby hasn't proven he's a good HC yet and he's also in year 2. If Butch can't win this division in year 4 and 5 it's hard to think he ever will. But I'm still optimistic that things are going to go very well this season and we're going to win the East.

It starts this weekend, let's kick some gator tail!!!

I agree with most of your sentiments, but with regard to the highlighted portion -- next year's team should be very very very good -- I think his best since he's been here.

 

[VolinArizona]

Shurmur is the QB getting overlooked. Vandy beats KState his week and he keeps up the hot play.

Agreed on Shurmur, not sure I agree on them beating KState.

Alabama A&M is really bad. MTSU's defense has been horrific for years.

Shurmur did end last season well and I think he's poised to be the East's 2nd best QB. However, their TEAM is still unknown so far.

 

[McGeesPub]

Defense was good enough to get a stop. Should have gotten a stop. CBJ and the offense got the points on the board. Gave the game to the defense. Just like Oklahoma. Defense let us down.

If you're giving CBJ the credit on offense, you have to assign the blame on the defense. JMO. I understand that he probably has more input there, but it all rolls up to the top.

No argument that the offense was great.

 

[Ron Swanson]

I agree with most of your sentiments, but with regard to the highlighted portion -- next year's team should be very very very good -- I think his best since he's been here.

I don't disagree with the talent level, Butch has recruited very well, certainly well enough to win the SEC East. But he must WIN or recruiting is wasted.

 

[BruinVol]

Agreed on Shurmur, not sure I agree on them beating KState.

Alabama A&M is really bad. MTSU's defense has been horrific for years.

Shurmur did end last season well and I think he's poised to be the East's 2nd best QB. However, their TEAM is still unknown so far.

Can't argue with that. Only thing close is Mtsu did beat a power 5 team this weekend and played solid D.

 

[nicksjuzunk]

Why is everyone pumping up Bentley? I just watched every throw he made against NCST and I'm not worried.

Here's what I counted:

•*1 "WOW" throw
•*4-5 solid/standard throws
•*7-8 off target or bad throws
•*1 INT
•*2 dropped, sure fire INTs

He has very good pocket awareness and moves well. He seems pretty heady. Roper is doing a good job with him and as far as our defense goes, they will probably score 24+.

However, Bentley didn't wow me at all. He's also 19, so I know he'll get better. But so far, he isn't better than QD imo.

Still not buying his hype. USCe is concerning though

 

[drvenner]

UT record vs. ranked opponents:

2008-2014: 2-33
2015-2016: 5-4

Last season's winning record of 3-2 against ranked opponents was the first time we've achieved this feat since 2004. Fact: we're better than we've been in over a decade.

Post of the football season so far. People tend to forget how bad it was when Butch got here. Those numbers reflect that better than anything. He is not perfect, but he had definitely elevated our program up. I think that he is capable of getting us over the next hump.

 

[BigZiti09]

If you're giving CBJ the credit on offense, you have to assign the blame on the defense. JMO. I understand that he probably has more input there, but it all rolls up to the top.

No argument that the offense was great.

Ultimately it all falls on him. I think he has much more input on the offense. It is his offense and I think special teams is his baby as well. Best special teams coach in the country in my opinion.

 

[drvenner]

ZEro shot 9-3 wins the east at this point. Only way it could have was with a loss to Ga Tech

I disagree. I think 9-3 could win the East, if we beat UF and Georgia. That would mean losses to Bama, LSU and somebody else, but it could be a matter of Tennessee, UF, Georgia, USC beating each other up and we would likely have the best record against East opponents in that scenario.

 

[nicksjuzunk]

Butch has taken the next step or two up for our program. The next two steps, conference champions and elite status are the hardest to ascend to. Unfortunately, Bama stands in the way of both, making it doubly hard... especially playing them in the regular season annually

It may take longer to get there, which is where patience is needed