Charlottesville white nationalists riots

#2,451
#2,451
CNN is about to stroke out over this thing. Bannon calls white supremacists a bunch of clowns and they frame the story as if this is controversial and off message for the WH.

How low are they going to go?
 
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#2,452
#2,452
1972 Grad said:
Like the Roach Motel?
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Apparently so. I mean, according to BB, the Constitution, specifically the 14th Amendment, is a suicide pact.

Of course, not even realizing the United States became a nation because we broke off from the UK in the same manner the Confederate States of America did...

Oh, irony.
 
#2,456
#2,456
DynaLo said:
Soooooo...an Amendment ratified 3 years after the war ended would have been instrumental in precluding both of them from supporting their home states in legal succession from the union? Two men that fought against tyranny, and assisted in the creation of foundation documents that assigned more weight to states rights to govern themselves over a centralized governmental rule would not have been sympathetic to their home states. That's your position?
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My position, simply stated in the post you quoted, is that two men who were instrumental in the founding of the United States of America would not have later been complicit in it's destruction.

Now, can either one of us say 100% what the hell they would have done? Of course not. This is a pointless exercise. The Civil War represented a different era in American history than the Revolutionary War. My greater point before this went off in a tangent is that Washington and Jefferson should not be conflated with Lee as Trump did on Tuesday. Washington and Jefferson were nation builders while Lee was a nation divider.
 
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#2,457
#2,457
I guess its completely cool to have a statue of one of the biggest mass murders in history. That doesnt seem to bother anyone. But a confederate general? Oh man. That is downright offensive.

9b1a7619fa9fe9bceeeb1e4ac2a1560a.jpg
 
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#2,460
#2,460
BigOrangeTrain said:
I guess its completely cool to have a statue of one of the biggest mass murders in history. That doesnt seem to bother anyone. But a confederate general? Oh man. That is downright offensive.

9b1a7619fa9fe9bceeeb1e4ac2a1560a.jpg
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Lenin was not a good guy and should be reviled in my opinion, but I think you may be getting him confused with Stalin.
 
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#2,465
#2,465
lawgator1 said:
If they are marching through the streets, making Nazi salutes, chanting slogans from the Third Reich, carrying shields and baseball bats, screaming racial epithets at everyone else, punching people in the face or bashing them with bats if they dare speak out, sure.
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Do you argue your cases in court like you argue here?
 
#2,466
#2,466
carlos86 said:
There's a profound difference between the Confederate traitors to the Union who fought to leave it over slavery and the Founders of the Union. If you can't tell the difference that's your problem.
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Thomas Jefferson would have had a lot in common with the Southern slaveholding aristocracy that wanted to leave the Union.

It isn't a stretch at all to conclude that if Jefferson were alive in 1860, he at the very least could have had Confederate sympathies. He was an Anti-Federalist plantation and slaveowner from Virginia. Take a look at comments he made about secession and the Missouri Compromise during his lifetime. He had a hell of a lot more in common with Southern aristocrats (because he was one) that made up the Confederacy than Northern industrialists who made up the Union, I guarantee you that.
 
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#2,468
#2,468
05_never_again said:
Thomas Jefferson would have had a lot in common with the Southern slaveholding aristocracy that wanted to leave the Union.

It isn't a stretch at all to conclude that if Jefferson were alive in 1860, he at the very least could have had Confederate sympathies. He was an Anti-Federalist plantation and slaveowner from Virginia. Take a look at comments he made about secession and the Missouri Compromise during his lifetime. He had a hell of a lot more in common with Southern aristocrats (because he was one) that made up the Confederacy than Northern industrialists who made up the Union, I guarantee you that.
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He doesn't see any similarities between "confederate traitors to the Union" and colonial traitors to the Crown. It won't be long before others see the similarities between many of our founding fathers and the confederate plantation owners.

Wait, it won't be long because it already is:

https://www.google.com/amp/chicago....ton-park-protest-presidents-slave-owners/amp/
 
#2,471
#2,471
Madscientistvol said:
He doesn't see any similarities between "confederate traitors to the Union" and colonial traitors to the Crown. It won't be long before others see the similarities between many of our founding fathers and the confederate plantation owners.

Wait, it won't be long because it already is:

https://www.google.com/amp/chicago....ton-park-protest-presidents-slave-owners/amp/
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This is what I've been thinking all along. You go after easier targets (because of the obvious Confederate association) first. It's easier to remove a Robert E. Lee plaque in NYC than it is to remove Jefferson's name from something. But once you do the first, it is much easier to do the other.

If they are consistent, they'll need to go after more contemporary figures, like Woodrow Wilson (who is a progressive icon despite being a virulent racist) next.
 
#2,472
#2,472
Madscientistvol said:
Lenin was not a good guy and should be reviled in my opinion, but I think you may be getting him confused with Stalin.
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Stalin was far worse, but Lenin didn't have clean hands either. Check out the Red Terror and Lenin's Hanging Order for a taste of what deaths he ordered.
 
#2,473
#2,473
Grand Vol said:
Stalin was far worse, but Lenin didn't have clean hands either. Check out the Red Terror and Lenin's Hanging Order for a taste of what deaths he ordered.
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No doubt and absolutely correct. My statement was more a reply that "one of the biggest mass murders in history" sounded more like Stalin. Not to say Lenin wasn't one too.
 
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