TrumPutinGate

#706
#706
volprof said:
I'm sorry, but it's just that you really come across as overly emotional.

:yes:
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Nah I'm actually very calm..... I just call ****, **** when I see it rather than something more socially acceptable like excrement, dung or feces.

I know I refer to you as a b**** a lot too...... I'm sorry.
I should really use "sensitive human being" or "grousing complainer".....I'll try and be more respectful and mindful of your feelings.
 
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#708
#708
Velo Vol said:
####IronyAlert#####
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No kidding.

We need to keep this thread snowflake free, unlike the rest of this board.

Hey, we were talking about Mensch. She's really been hitting Michael Cohen hard.

The two actually had a long Twitter exchange today for the first time.

The idiot actually contradicted his former claims that he was in LA during the dates in question (meeting with Russian intelligence services in Prague in late August) in the exchange.

Apparently he made tweets at the time that were geolocated to other locations.

It's amazing that the tool (Twitter) which enabled the Trump campaign may ultimately be the tool that takes down that same presidency.

You just can't get away with stuff like this anymore. Can you imagine Nixon and Watergate with Twitter and 24/7 news media? He never would have made it as long as he did.
 
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#710
#710
volprof said:
According to the Steele dossier (which, again, is the only publicly published intelligence on this matter of which we can have some confidence - since at least part of it has been corroborated), Trump and his associates have been paid by the Kremlin through Russian emigres' (particularly of Jewish origin) business and "pension" fronts. Here, I would pay close attention to individuals like Sater, Boris Epshteyn, mob-related Russian-Americans, and possibly even Cohen himself (who we know for a fact has tried establishing businesses in Ukraine before).
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I can imagine the financial trail thus far (if there is one) to be minor compared to what they intend to do. What is the validity to the notion that the big play would be for Tillerson, Trump, Putin, and Exxon working together to lift sanctions on Russia so they can make enormous profits. Is that a stretch?
 
#714
#714
Yesterday, Michael Cohen got into a long Twitter argument with Louise Mensch, one of the investigative journalists who has been on this for a year (while our MSM largely ignored it and just concentrated on Donny's ridiculous behavior and tweets instead). He further complicated his case, stupidly, I might add.

And today, Felix Sater, a name that has made Donald Trump uncomfortable for at least the past few years now - so much so he once lied (possibly under oath) about knowing him - directly contacted another one of the leading investigators into Kremlingate:

https://twitter.com/Khanoisseur/status/817505526627975168

If I were these individuals, I'd start thinking about going into hiding. The Russian mob (probably most powerful in the world) and its FSB/SVR connections are serious business.

These brave individuals should win awards and medals after all of this is over.
 
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#715
#715
Mick said:
I can imagine the financial trail thus far (if there is one) to be minor compared to what they intend to do. What is the validity to the notion that the big play would be for Tillerson, Trump, Putin, and Exxon working together to lift sanctions on Russia so they can make enormous profits. Is that a stretch?
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I can't quite figure Tillerson out. Yes, I think the Exxon thing is very likely, but I'm torn over the extent to which he's in on all of it, especially given what has come out about Kushner essentially being the shadow Secretary of State.

Regarding business deals, here's what the Steele dossier alleges:

1. Trump and associates were granted help from RIS (Russian intelligence services) with election help through Wikileaks and through other compromising material on American political opponents, like Hillary. Also paid through business fronts and "pensions" of ethnic Russian emigres, particularly of Jewish origin.

2. In return, Trump and associates agreed to hand the Kremlin over all information about dealings with Russian oligarchs in the US and abroad, the implication being that the Kremlin is concerned about these individuals domestically and wants to keep track of them.

3. Trump and associates were offered a 19 percent stake in Rosneft if they will overturn the sanctions.

On a side note, in December a 19.5 percent stake in Rosneft was sold to a mystery buyer. Later, it came out that it was a purchase through a joint Swiss (Glencore) and Qatari effort. I'm not certain how true, but I have read that this buyer refused any representation upon the Rosneft board, an exceptional refusal for a purchaser of a near-20 percent stake in a major energy company.

Admittedly, some of this could be Russian disinformation to try to throw us off the real trail.
 
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#717
#717
I've just learned, in light of the Churkin death, that he was the individual who first recruited Donny to Moscow in '86. Donny finally journeyed there in '87, afterwards reemerging with anti-Reagan ads and anti-NATO rhetoric.

If nothing else, you at least have to admire Donny for 30 years of consistency on NATO.
 
#718
#718
volprof said:
I can't quite figure Tillerson out. Yes, I think the Exxon thing is very likely, but I'm torn over the extent to which he's in on all of it, especially given what has come out about Kushner essentially being the shadow Secretary of State.

Regarding business deals, here's what the Steele dossier alleges:

1. Trump and associates were granted help from RIS (Russian intelligence services) with election help through Wikileaks and through other compromising material on American political opponents, like Hillary. Also paid through business fronts and "pensions" of ethnic Russian emigres, particularly of Jewish origin.

2. In return, Trump and associates agreed to hand the Kremlin over all information about dealings with Russian oligarchs in the US and abroad, the implication being that the Kremlin is concerned about these individuals domestically and wants to keep track of them.

3. Trump and associates were offered a 19 percent stake in Rosneft if they will overturn the sanctions.

On a side note, in December a 19.5 percent stake in Rosneft was sold to a mystery buyer. Later, it came out that it was a purchase through a joint Swiss (Glencore) and Qatari effort. I'm not certain how true, but I have read that this buyer refused any representation upon the Rosneft board, an exceptional refusal for a purchaser of a near-20 percent stake in a major energy company.

Admittedly, some of this could be Russian disinformation to try to throw us off the real trail.
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So... I'm going to ask again... What evidence is there of any of this? News stories, conspiracy theories and IC mumblings don't count.

Out of curiosity, I did a search of "Trump Russia" on Google News this morning. I was inundated with news stories, most from the major printed and online press. The MSM. Not back-alley tabloid hit pieces. It was all the big, major players.

I saw SO MANY allegations. I saw SO MANY theoretical timelines, motives, connections, etc...

I didn't see one single piece of actual material evidence presented.

What does it say to you that the press has tried and convicted our sitting President already without being able to present a single shred of verifiable evidence? What does it say that they are so free to post so many damaging theories (as fact) without presenting any evidence.

Do you think that if they had evidence, they would release it?

The IC that leaked the calls to Russia... If they are looking to damage Trump's presidency (which they obviously are and have), and they all "agree" that Russia subverted our elections--and had the evidence that formed that agreement... Don't you think they would leak that as well?

You don't fing it the slightest bit suspicious that the Washington Establishment are all foaming at the mouth to undermine this rogue President, yet none of them are able to post actual evidence to do so?

That doesn't seem the slightest bit suspicious to you? All we really have is a narrative, created by a media that has proven to be in the Democrats' pocket. It just so happens to be an extension of the narrative created to try to distract us (the Amercian Citizens) from leaked Dem dirt.

That doesn't seem the slightest bit suspicious to you? All we really have is a narrative, created by the people whose job it is to crete narratives, the very people who have proven to be in the pocket of Trump's enemies?

And then there's you... You're on here like a schizophrenic Clark Kent. In one thread, you're posting allegations. In the next, you're castigating us unconvinced crowd as merely "Trumpers". You're claiming "concrete evidence" that we should believe but don't. However, when pushed and called out, you have to admit the complete lack of concrete evidence, but you still find a way to castigate us for being unconvinced.

Then you're back to posting all the "allegations" as though they're revealing some deep plot.

The entire time, you are posting all of this as though your over-activity on a football website is saving our country.

You will be offended, and I truly apologize in advance for offending you, but I write this out of genuine concern for you, VP. As you believe everything else so easily, please believe that just as easily.

...

Have you been prescribed meds that you've stopped taking? I don't say that as an insult, or trying to bait you. I say that because you appear to be displaying all of the symptoms of paranoid delusions, including delusions of grandeur.

I pray that you are OK, and all of this is just a lot of spare time on yours hands--nothing more. But I am genuinely concerned for you.
 
#719
#719
volprof said:
I've just learned, in light of the Churkin death, that he was the individual who first recruited Donny to Moscow in '86. Donny finally journeyed there in '87, afterwards reemerging with anti-Reagan ads and anti-NATO rhetoric.

If nothing else, you at least have to admire Donny for 30 years of consistency on NATO.
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How did you learn that? Where did you learn it from? And what sort of hard, concrete evidence can you offer to support the allegation?

Thanks.
 
#721
#721
hog88 said:
He saw it on twatter so it must be true.
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I'm serious. I'd like to know. If nothing else, VP finally has me digging deeper into this. I am completely willing to believe the claims, and even to follow up by calling my congressman, etc... I'm in to tech, etc. I am willing to start a "Indict trump" website if given the evidence that he is a traitor. I am adept at web technologies, mind maps, etc...

I will seriously start a website centralizing TrumPutin Gate evidence.

The problem is that there is no evidence, as I can find it, to gather and centralize.

All I see is baseless claims. More indicting against the media, all I see is a complete lack of evidence, but with the assertions that there is "concrete", "solid", etc, evidence.

For instance... I did a search for "actual evidence trump".

The results returned no evidence presented, as I can find it, but innumerable references to evidence against Trump.

(As damning, the majority of responses bring back fact checks against trump, judging his various claims--like crowd sizes, voter fraud, etc--and chastising him for the lack of evidence to support his claims! Talk about hypocrites!)

But anyway... In the MSM, I'm finding no actual evidence, lots of claims, and lots of references to the mounting evidence (which has never been presented).

Do you know what that is? It's creating a narrative. It is NOT reporting. It is NOT responsible journalism. It is propaganda.

So again... You have to ask... Who's creating the propaganda, and for what end purpose?
 
#722
#722
volprof said:
Since Sater poked his ugly head back into things yesterday with The Times article, a timely compilation from Schindler on Trump's Russian mob ties and how this all fits in very messily with the Kremlin:

https://twitter.com/i/moments/818487233439207424

P.S. If you don't read that link, you're being derelict in your civic duty.
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Trump said he had no idea who Felix Sater was.
 

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#723
#723
Orange_Crush said:
I'm serious. I'd like to know. If nothing else, VP finally has me digging deeper into this. I am completely willing to believe the claims, and even to follow up by calling my congressman, etc... I'm in to tech, etc. I am willing to start a "Indict trump" website if given the evidence that he is a traitor. I am adept at web technologies, mind maps, etc...

I will seriously start a website centralizing TrumPutin Gate evidence.

The problem is that there is no evidence, as I can find it, to gather and centralize.

All I see is baseless claims. More indicting against the media, all I see is a complete lack of evidence, but with the assertions that there is "concrete", "solid", etc, evidence.

For instance... I did a search for "actual evidence trump".

The results returned no evidence presented, as I can find it, but innumerable references to evidence against Trump.

(As damning, the majority of responses bring back fact checks against trump, judging his various claims--like crowd sizes, voter fraud, etc--and chastising him for the lack of evidence to support his claims! Talk about hypocrites!)

But anyway... In the MSM, I'm finding no actual evidence, lots of claims, and lots of references to the mounting evidence (which has never been presented).

Do you know what that is? It's creating a narrative. It is NOT reporting. It is NOT responsible journalism. It is propaganda.

So again... You have to ask... Who's creating the propaganda, and for what end purpose?
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VP is legit man. He has a friend who's sister's husband's niece's 2nd cousin is in in the IC community and gives VP the straight dope. Classified or not.
 
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#725
#725
AirVol said:
Still waiting on solid proof that Russians hacked the election.
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Note this, for whacky, whacky "reporting"... From the NYTimes, no less.

https://www.nytimes.com/2017/02/20/us/politics/donald-trump-russia.html

NY Times story reporting that Russian Deputy Foreign Minister claims that some of "them" (inferred to be Trump's inner circle in the election) were in communication with Russian officials.

The problem is, as NYT points out, that Trump has repeatedly claimed that none of his people were in communication with Russia ( as far as he knows) (and despite the fact that it's not uncommon for presidential candidates to speak to foreign countries to clarify that candidate's stance on various issues).

But... As NTY reports, it's a pretty damning article for trump at face value, since it proposes the "fact" that Russia is painting Trump as a liar on the matter.

Until...

https://www.nytimes.com/2016/11/11/world/europe/trump-campaign-russia.html

Buried deeply in yet another NYT article on the subject, we see that the actual Russian Foreign Minister says that the deputy was basically misquoted, and he was talking about other politicians, and not Trump's campaign or inner circle.

There seems to be an amazing (and sickening) amount of "Sleight of Hand" reporting going on against our sitting and (until proven otherwise) duly elected American President.

Until shown otherwise, I consider the MSM media as attempting a public gov't coup.
 
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