I think some of you seriously misunderstand Butch

#26
#26
Butch reminds me more and more of our outgoing President in his efforts to control the narrative through the media, and to spin in an effort to cover his deficiencies. Nothing he says anymore seems genuine, but more and more contrived.
 
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#27
#27
'Boro-vol said:
Butch reminds me more and more of our outgoing President in his efforts to control the narrative through the media, and to spin in an effort to cover his deficiencies. Nothing he says anymore seems genuine, but more and more contrived.
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Pretty good comparison.
 
#28
#28
CountVolcula said:
2-2 vs Vandy

1-3 vs Florida

2-2 vs Georgia

0-4 vs Bama

0-4 vs rest of West division

14-18 SEC record


Dropped in recruiting rankings

Not even in top 5 recruiting in the SEC

The writing is on the wall
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But, but, but....

He is 3-0 vs the big 10 in bowls!
 
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#29
#29
NC takes near perfection and/or a lot of breaks going your way. I don't "expect" that in a given year, no one (minus bama of late) has a reasonable expectation of achieving that year in and year out. I do expect to whoop the hell out of teams like Vandy, USCe, etc. I expect to split years with FL, though that obviously is based on wishful thinking given past performances. We should be no worse than top 1-2 in the SEC-E as routine.

We want BETTER. Butch does too I am sure, but he is the one who has to make it happen.
 
#31
#31
volfannbama said:
The main issue here is that there is no middle ground, either you are a sunshine punter telling everyone to shut up and color or your are negavol that wants Butch fired.
Just because you are always thinking positive doesn't mean you are always right. Most reasonable people can be happy about the wins and things CBJ has done with the program and can also express the opinion of doubt that he will take the vols any further, while providing logical thinking to back it up. And they should be able to do so without begin called silly, stupid, and having their character and fanhood questioned.
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Shut up so we can fire Butch!😬
 
#32
#32
Butch's main problem, is that he truly believes that his system, is infallible if executed properly. He really does believe that he can take the same system that he used at Cincinnati, and it will work flawlessly in the SEC. The last 4 seasons have proven otherwise. That's why the context of this season is so important to the record.

That old adage of "if you look around and you are the smartest amongst your group of friends, then get new friends" never seems to have taken hold on Butch.
 
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#34
#34
Currently, the impression that I get from the fanbase is that they expect to win the East every few years. If you go too long without appearing in a SECCG, you will be fired, even if that means you are winning 8-9 games/year.

This is a lower expectation than 10 years ago. Fulmer did exactly what I described above - he made appearances at regular intervals in Atlanta (1997, 1998, 2001, 2004, 2007) but that wasn't good enough. In those days, I think the expectation was more that you needed to actually win the SEC every few years. Now I think think you just have to get there.

Of course, he also had 2 losing seasons mixed in with being unable to win the SEC. That factored in too.
 
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#35
#35
'Boro-vol said:
When he stops regularly losing to teams he shouldn't lose to we'll talk.

Until then he's a career 8.7 wpy coach, who is in over his head in the SEC. The used car salesman justifications don't help his case, and just expose him as not big enough for this job.
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Completely wrong
 
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#36
#36
BeardedVol said:
Butch's main problem, is that he truly believes that his system, is infallible if executed properly. He really does believe that he can take the same system that he used at Cincinnati, and it will work flawlessly in the SEC. The last 4 seasons have proven otherwise. That's why the context of this season is so important to the record.

That old adage of "if you look around and you are the smartest amongst your group of friends, then get new friends" never seems to have taken hold on Butch.
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I think it is worth being clear that you aren't just implying this. He has said this verbatim (go to 1:54 of the video):

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=N-vHo7c4yMA
 
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#37
#37
mccrackb said:
Wow. The Negavols in this one. It's truly a who's who in the nega world
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I know right! another thread brought up by a positive guy and the negavols get bashed for bringing up a topic and just cant let it go.

Amazing that there is no common ground between expecting to win a national championship every year or Butch is fired and losing to a 5-6 Vandy team and having doubts about the coach.
 
#38
#38
05_never_again said:
Currently, the impression that I get from the fanbase is that they expect to win the East every few years. If you go too long without appearing in a SECCG, you will be fired, even if that means you are winning 8-9 games/year.

This is a lower expectation than 10 years ago. Fulmer did exactly what I described above - he made appearances at regular intervals in Atlanta (1997, 1998, 2001, 2004, 2007) but that wasn't good enough. In those days, I think the expectation was more that you needed to actually win the SEC every few years. Now I think think you just have to get there.

Of course, he also had 2 losing seasons mixed in with being unable to win the SEC. That factored in too.
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the losing seasons is what did fulmer in ultimately. the program had gotten stale after 04, and though he did make it back in 07, we saw how long that lasted. throw in the losing seasons, the terrible hire at OC, the lax in recruiting, the losing streaks to GA, FL and Bama etc....and it just was what it was.

now, had fulmer continued to win 8-10 games a year, while still going to ATL every 3 or so years, he'd probably still be here, and rightfully so.

the same could be said of CBJ too. if he can ever get there. right now CBJ is our Ray Goff.
 
#40
#40
05_never_again said:
I think it is worth being clear that you aren't just implying this. He has said this verbatim (go to 1:54 of the video):

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=N-vHo7c4yMA
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Yep, he made the statement on day 1 at UT, in his first meeting with the team, and has stuck with it.

It's why I don't think it will matter who is at OC, if the only playbook they can use is Butch's then we are going to see the same results. Which will be back to watching the QB get demolished like Worley did in the system before Dobbs and his magic legs showed up.
 
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#41
#41
jakez4ut said:
the losing seasons is what did fulmer in ultimately. the program had gotten stale after 04, and though he did make it back in 07, we saw how long that lasted. throw in the losing seasons, the terrible hire at OC, the lax in recruiting, the losing streaks to GA, FL and Bama etc....and it just was what it was.

now, had fulmer continued to win 8-10 games a year, while still going to ATL every 3 or so years, he'd probably still be here, and rightfully so.

the same could be said of CBJ too. if he can ever get there. right now CBJ is our Ray Goff.
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A moot point, but if that occurred I think he would have eventually been forced out by now, a la Mark Richt. Expectations for Tennessee got reset a bit after Kiffin, IMO.
 
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#43
#43
05_never_again said:
A moot point, but if that occurred I think he would have eventually been forced out by now, a la Mark Richt. Expectations for Tennessee got reset a bit after Kiffin, IMO.
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eh, Richt didn't win a natty. had fulmer continued to go to bowls, while there would be plenty tired of FUlmer, if he did do those things, while still going to ATL every so often, that would likely mean the program was stable and still performing at a good clip.

as for the expectations after Kiffin, of course they did. they took another hit after Dooley.

the floor was reset. enter Butch Jones, and to his credit, although maybe unbeknownst to him, the floor has been reset again.

the 5 years before Butch are the best 5 years that ever happened to Butch....even though he didn't know it at the time.
 
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#45
#45
Yeah, one SEC East title in 5 years doesn't seem to be unreasonable expectations for any program that considers itself to be one of the power players in the conference. Especially when the East has been at a historically low ebb during the time Jones has been running the show. If he can't get to Atlanta in 2017, it's really hard to justify keeping him on.
 
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#46
#46
jakez4ut said:
the losing seasons is what did fulmer in ultimately. the program had gotten stale after 04, and though he did make it back in 07, we saw how long that lasted. throw in the losing seasons, the terrible hire at OC, the lax in recruiting, the losing streaks to GA, FL and Bama etc....and it just was what it was.

now, had fulmer continued to win 8-10 games a year, while still going to ATL every 3 or so years, he'd probably still be here, and rightfully so.

the same could be said of CBJ too. if he can ever get there. right now CBJ is our Ray Goff.
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Yep. Getting hammered by Urbs and Saban just added to it.

Ray Goff. Bout right.
 
#47
#47
'Boro-vol said:
When he stops regularly losing to teams he shouldn't lose to we'll talk.

Until then he's a career 8.7 wpy coach, who is in over his head in the SEC. The used car salesman justifications don't help his case, and just expose him as not big enough for this job.
Click to expand...

Funny, but Tennessee is a historical 8.7 wpy program. So what's your point?
 
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#49
#49
CountVolcula said:
2-2 vs Vandy

1-3 vs Florida

2-2 vs Georgia

0-4 vs Bama

0-4 vs rest of West division

14-18 SEC record


Dropped in recruiting rankings

Not even in top 5 recruiting in the SEC

The writing is on the wall
Click to expand...

There you go again confusing Facts with Issues....

73636297.jpg
 
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