Game Thread Lady Vols at Penn State

[LVJeff]

I just cannot understand how a player like Nunn is not contributing more. Apparently the excuse has been, she is not in playing shape. I cannot understand how any of these players would be out of shape. To me a dedicated player would be working out and in shape first and then working on shooting, etc. next.

"Out of shape" and "playing shape" are two different things to me. Out of shape refers more to overall conditioning, stamina, wind, etc. Playing shape to me means timing, when to move, where to move to, who to expect passes from and when, things like that. Just my opinion.

 

[LVJeff]

...I thought I saw some zone from Tennessee last night...

They did, briefly. They're worse at it than they are man defense. You could tell they hadn't practiced it, they were very stationary.

I don't know what Holly's practice routines are like, but whatever she is doing, stop doing it. And whatever she isn't doing, try it.

 

[ladyvosl23]

We have to address a Few areas for sure. but simply if we can't knock down certain shots then we will always struggle against a zone. we can't just pass around the perimeter we did not cut pass cut did anything of the sort, But Holly has to get it together because you can't tell me than no one on the staff can assist with an zone.

 

[Benionsopinion]

let DD play pg and let the rest rebound after she takes the 1st shot.
I'd be playing dd and MeMe, Russell, Jamie and Kortney/middleton till after new years. everyone else get's garbage minutes only.

Diamond probably should be at point guard as she is the best facilitator on the team. All the others should mold their game around her. Move around on the floor,take the open shot and hit the boards. Then on defense,move your feet and keep your arms up. Those are familiar themes,but our Lady Vols seem unaware of them. Might make marked improvement right away.

 

[gule]

the trouble with dd playing point is that on defense she is the best thing we have inside the paint. sad but true...

 

[Nuyoika]

I just cannot understand how a player like Nunn is not contributing more. Apparently the excuse has been, she is not in playing shape. I cannot understand how any of these players would be out of shape. To me a dedicated player would be working out and in shape first and then working on shooting, etc. next.

Nunn hadn't played collegiate basketball in almost 2 years (21 months to be exact) and when she was it was in the Big South conference. I am not so sure why everyone just expected her to come in and be a huge impact and better than Graves as some suggested. The girl will need time to adjust... unfortunately since she only has 1 year of eligibility she is gonna need to adjust by Dec. 1st. The Lady vols need her NOW!

 

[cwbytruckers]

the trouble with dd playing point is that on defense she is the best thing we have inside the paint. sad but true...

Russell's double double mean nothing I guess. Russell gets double teamed and still gets them. I blame the others for being lazy.

 

[mlindsay]

Russell's double double mean nothing I guess. Russell gets double teamed and still gets them. I blame the others for being lazy.

she's 6'6" she should be averaging near a triple double based on the teams we have faced so far. Kelly Cain would've averaged 10 blocks against the 3 teams we played (prior to Penn State) and she was slow.

My sister had a Double Double yesterday (14 points and 14 rebounds) in her Division II match up against a 6'1 Post and my sister is 5'10" so a double double from someone 6'6" should be expected.

 

[cwbytruckers]

she's 6'6" she should be averaging near a triple double based on the teams we have faced so far. Kelly Cain would've averaged 10 blocks against the 3 teams we played (prior to Penn State) and she was slow.

My sister had a Double Double yesterday (14 points and 14 rebounds) in her Division II match up against a 6'1 Post and my sister is 5'10" so a double double from someone 6'6" should be expected.

Russell isn't athletic enough to cover ground in this switching man to man defense to recover and protect the rim. But the problem with your statement. We play better coached teams. They know how to adjust for Russell and block out on defense and move the ball on offense. If it was me I would play a 4 man 1 Zone with Russell. Let her stand in the paint and protect. The others play a diamond man. Or a straight up man no switching.

 

[Nuyoika]

she's 6'6" she should be averaging near a triple double based on the teams we have faced so far. Kelly Cain would've averaged 10 blocks against the 3 teams we played (prior to Penn State) and she was slow.

My sister had a Double Double yesterday (14 points and 14 rebounds) in her Division II match up against a 6'1 Post and my sister is 5'10" so a double double from someone 6'6" should be expected.

Didn't Russell almost average a double double last year? That is basically the bare minimum I would think she would expect for herself at this point. She had a few nice moves vs Penn State.

** I just checked it was 9.9 PPG and 8.3 rebounds per game avg last year. So yeah, 10 & 10 for her as a minimum should be more than achievable if she has progressed at all over the summer.

 

[gule]

the next time Russell blocks out will be the first time ever.

 

[cwbytruckers]

Didn't Russell almost average a double double last year? That is basically the bare minimum I would think she would expect for herself at this point. She had a few nice moves vs Penn State.

** I just checked it was 9.9 PPG and 8.3 rebounds per game avg last year. So yeah, 10 & 10 for her as a minimum should be more than achievable if she has progressed at all over the summer.

She missed several shots she normally makes. She had some bad luck yesterday.

 

[gule]

we only need one coach and there's four on the squad. I'd be giving the refs a ear full about Russell getting grabbed and bumped and the ridiculous touch fouls against us until they either call games better or throw 3 coaches out with technicals.

personally, I think one of the players could sub for holly or dean and do a better job.

 

[mlindsay]

She is 6'6" why is it so excuse driven around her. You either want it or you don't Courtney Paris was 6'4 and damn near 300 pounds and found a way to get 112 consecutive double doubles as well as put points on the board and she wasn't the #1 overall recruit in her class. By now (she is essentially a senior) she should be dominating and she isn't and that is a problem and you all don't see that.

Name the last #1 overall recruit that hasn't had great success in college. She's not even on the radar to be a 1st round pick in the WNBA draft and she is the #1 recruit in her class. That is a problem folks. She is not being developed as is a lot of our players and the coach has to take most of the blame for that.

 

[th2421]

She is 6'6" why is it so excuse driven around her. You either want it or you don't Courtney Paris was 6'4 and damn near 300 pounds and found a way to get 112 consecutive double doubles as well as put points on the board and she wasn't the #1 overall recruit in her class. By now (she is essentially a senior) she should be dominating and she isn't and that is a problem and you all don't see that.

Name the last #1 overall recruit that hasn't had great success in college. She's not even on the radar to be a 1st round pick in the WNBA draft and she is the #1 recruit in her class. That is a problem folks. She is not being developed as is a lot of our players and the coach has to take most of the blame for that.

She's averaging over 17 points, 8 boards, 1.3 assists, 1.3 steals to start the season, all while getting mauled and triple and double-teamed by opponents. She's been more aggressive going to the basket and shooting 17% better at the foul line than a year ago.

Calm. Down.

 

[mike099]

we only need one coach and there's four on the squad. I'd be giving the refs a ear full about Russell getting grabbed and bumped and the ridiculous touch fouls against us until they either call games better or throw 3 coaches out with technicals.

personally, I think one of the players could sub for holly or dean and do a better job.

lol:

 

[bobkitten]

I wonder if part of the team/recruiting problem is we are recruiting too many middle-class players. I wonder if what we need are, yes, talented players, but players who have played against other teams that would mug you or break some teeth during the game, or if they didn't, their brothers would slash the tires of the team bus and punch you in the face when you stopped to look. Our young women are all, let's face it, NICE people who are good at playing a polite game of basketball or croquet. "Rebound, now, with pinkies OUT!"

I'm not saying we want the D. Taurasi of the world, but we should go after people who have played AGAINST folks like her in high school. None of our players seem to feel a burning desire to "escape the neighborhood" where playing basketball is the only way out that is legal.

That's how I account for our lack of toughness, our lack of intensity.

When they practice, perhaps the coaching staff and boys need to quit using those pads to "pretend" to make contact and actually get the team members USED to being bumped around.

Comments?

 

[mlindsay]

She's averaging over 17 points, 8 boards, 1.3 assists, 1.3 steals to start the season, all while getting mauled and triple and double-teamed by opponents. She's been more aggressive going to the basket and shooting 17% better at the foul line than a year ago.

Calm. Down.

Wow who are those numbers against? How many did she do last season against teams with players at least 6'3" or taller

Texas
Russell
6pts, 7rebs 3Blks

Boyette
11pts, 9rebs, 1Blk

Stanford
Russell
7pts, 8rebs

McCall
14pts, 10rebs, 1Blk

Oregon State
Russell
12pts, 2rebs, 2Blks

Hamblin
6pts, 12rebs, 3Blks

Notre Dame
Russell
6pts, 6rebs, 1Blk

Turner
14pts, 9rebs, 5Blks

That's just to name a few. If we are going to be great and Holly is going to demand the ball go into Russell she should be averaging 25 and 10 realistically. She is averaging 8pts and 6rebs for her career. That is unacceptable to a #1 recruit, excuse me if the bar is set high.

 

[UCMiami]

They did, briefly. They're worse at it than they are man defense. You could tell they hadn't practiced it, they were very stationary.

I don't know what Holly's practice routines are like, but whatever she is doing, stop doing it. And whatever she isn't doing, try it.

Maybe that is why their zone offense is so poor - when they practice against their own zone defense it works like clockwork. They need to practice against a better zone! :thud:

 

[mlindsay]

I wonder if part of the team/recruiting problem is we are recruiting too many middle-class players. I wonder if what we need are, yes, talented players, but players who have played against other teams that would mug you or break some teeth during the game, or if they didn't, their brothers would slash the tires of the team bus and punch you in the face when you stopped to look. Our young women are all, let's face it, NICE people who are good at playing a polite game of basketball or croquet.

I'm not saying we want the D. Taurasi of the world, but we should go after people who have played AGAINST folks like her in high school. None of our players seem to feel a burning desire to "escape the neighborhood" where playing basketball is the only way out.

That's how I account for our lack of toughness, our lack of intensity.

When they practice, perhaps the coaching staff and boys need to quit using those pads to "pretend" to make contact and actually get the team members USED to being bumped around.

Comments?

I agree with you 100 % seem to have a lot of players with a silver spoon mentality that think it's going to be given to them. We need players who are hungry and going to go out and take and I know that's what coach Law is about and that's what she went after with this recruiting class. Trust me the incoming class (alongside Green) is going to change the culture (if Holly let's them play). We need hungry/nastiness and we haven't truly had that since the Candace parker class left. (Izzy had some of it).

 

[Voltopia]

I would suggest folks stop worrying so much about Mercedes Russell being the #1 ranked recruit in her class, and just be more honest about what her strengths and weaknesses are. Recruiting rankings aren't the whole story for any player. And I wouldn't advise anyone to pin their expectations for her against an imaginary number. She didn't ask for that ranking or want that ranking, she just wanted to play at Tennessee. Evaluate her play if you want, but I'd suggest folks try to leave that mythical recruiting ranking out of it.

 

[th2421]

Maybe that is why their zone offense is so poor - when they practice against their own zone defense it works like clockwork. They need to practice against a better zone! :thud:

After the JMU game, Nared said that the team played at least three different defensive sets that they had never practiced in an attempt to shut down Precious Hall. I imagine the same could have been true last night against PSU. I think/hope a week of extended practice will help leading into the game against Virginia Tech.

 

[Pat4life]

You and I may be the only two posters who don't think Russell is this team's weak link. She's not. It would be nice if she had stronger hands, didn't miss some of her layups, and rebounded more aggressively.

But anybody that watched the LV guards in this game go 8 for 38 shooting (2 for 19 from three), have the same amount of turnovers as assists, not get to the FT line but twice, and allow the opponents guards to torch them to the tune of 55 points, cannot possibly think this is Russell's fault.

This team will go as far as the guards take them.

This team will go as far as Diamond takes em! And if she don't feel like playing, we will struggle, its simple as that, you can call it coaching.

Russell, is going to be tough, she is playing like one of the top 5 centers in the game. And I think she has the potential to be the best center in the game, once she gets in shape, I would like a lil more activity, more aggressiveness, but she's starting to understand and progressing nicely, Jordan and Middleton play well with Russell too, that's why I'm really bothered with their play.

Averaging a double/double so far this year...yea she's the problem. wuteva. Holly's the problem. wuteva. Its a team problem, players and coaches, both take ownership after a lost.

But the fact still remains some of our players took the nite off, and the ones that people are *****ing about, Nared (production did drop for two) and the most consistent player this season thus far Mercedes Russell are gettin the blame. wuteva.

Diamond, Reynolds, Meme, Alexa, Nunn, Dunbar all took the nite off. Thank YOu Mercedes and Nared, for playing like Lady Vols. So, yes as a coach, I would build my team around Mercedes, til Diamond proves she can be productive, effective, and consistent for more than one game against overmatched teams. ijs

Hate is blindin... Go Lady Vols.

 

[Pat4life]

I agree with you 100 % seem to have a lot of players with a silver spoon mentality that think it's going to be given to them. We need players who are hungry and going to go out and take and I know that's what coach Law is about and that's what she went after with this recruiting class. Trust me the incoming class (alongside Green) is going to change the culture (if Holly let's them play). We need hungry/nastiness and we haven't truly had that since the Candace parker class left. (Izzy had some of it).

Nice post.

I was excited about Cooper and Meme for the same reason, they both had the swagger on the court, and led their teams on defense.

Agreed. Glory, was a beast too. Both of our All Americans the past 8 years.

We are a finesse team, and finesse teams don't win championships. But Dean said, the team had to become tougher, if they do, they will be a very good team.

Personally, I thought Diamond was a tougher player, and that what she would bring to the team that nastiness, getting to the rim, bodied players on screens, I felt she is cocky, and abrasive, an alpha (some of the time) and talented but her game so far, to be honest, I haven't been impressed. When your star player is streaky and tempermental, yo team will struggle, when yo star player is lights out (All American) every nite, the Lady vols will win more games than the lose.

Let's go Cedes and Nared, Lady Vols. Still a lil mad at the others. I can't believe I had to watch that 2nd quarter tho!

 

[Pat4life]

After the JMU game, Nared said that the team played at least three different defensive sets that they had never practiced in an attempt to shut down Precious Hall. I imagine the same could have been true last night against PSU. I think/hope a week of extended practice will help leading into the game against Virginia Tech.

Watch the post game interviews. I love the honesty from all three.