2016 Election

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#4,026
#4,026
n_huffhines said:
Treason is the only crime defined by the constitution.

"Treason against the United States, shall consist only in levying War against them, or in adhering to their Enemies, giving them Aid and Comfort. "

He didn't do anything like that. He gave the world information so that Americans and their allies would know the United States government betrayed them. If you consider the American people the enemy, then yes...Edward Snowden aided the enemy and is a traitor.
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You don't think Snowden aided our enemy? smh
 
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#4,031
#4,031
carlos86 said:
Ted Cruz with the flip flop on his official website.
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The Snowden deal was not a flip flop by Cruz. It is a non issue.

Cruz most definitely has flip-flopped on immigration. Cruz denying he has is ludicrous. Of course Cruz can always claim the videos of him stating a different stance was altered by the G OP Establishment
 
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#4,032
#4,032
Vol8188 said:
Agreed! Nothing pisses me off more than knowing about illegal activity within my government!

I don't have a need to know that government is spying on me!
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It's one thing to tell the American people and another to steal confidential info and give it to other governments. .... Don't be a dimwit all your life
 
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#4,034
#4,034
Gramps said:
The Snowden deal was not a flip flop by Cruz. It is a non issue.

Cruz most definitely has flip-flopped on immigration. Cruz denying he has is ludicrous. Of course Cruz can always claim the videos of him stating a different stance was altered by the G OP Establishment
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Lol I love how Fox News has even ripped into Cruz in interviews over his flip flopping and his lies. Damn liberal media!
 
#4,035
#4,035
IBlvNTmWrk said:
You don't think Snowden aided our enemy? smh
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Intent is a part of English law. The intent was not to aid enemies. The intent was to help the American people. If you want to go strictly off letter of the law, every modern president has sent foreign aid to enemies. Are they traitors? They "aided enemies".
 
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#4,036
#4,036
carlos86 said:
Snowden gave Russia top secret signals intelligence on the U.S. and NATO which allowed Russia to evade U.S. and NATO satellite imaging and move an entire Corps (60,000 troops and invade Ukraine without anyone knowing that they had mobilized their forces. Or maybe your forgot about that happening.
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The problem with this theory, even if you can prove it, is Russia is not an enemy and the US government is not willing to say they are just to prosecute Snowden.
 
#4,037
#4,037
Gramps said:
I would agree this is not the issue to show Cruz has flip-flopped.

He was careful on his wording early on, from what I have read, which was a wise move. (Man I hate to say that)

:)

One of the major problems in politics is too many jump on a specific side of an issue before knowing what the facts are or what the facts appear to be simply because their side of the aisle is for or against.
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haha... that's why I enjoy many of your posts Gramps. Even though we may disagree on occasion, your posts are usually well reasoned.

(edit: note how I left myself an out above so in the future if I disagree with you it won't be considered a flip-flop.)
 
#4,038
#4,038
Whelp, that's it. He will be the nominee and lose to Hillary.

imrs.php


https://www.washingtonpost.com/news...ning-poll-number-on-donald-trump-i-have-seen/
 
#4,039
#4,039
n_huffhines said:
The problem with this theory, even if you can prove it, is Russia is not an enemy and the US government is not willing to say they are just to prosecute Snowden.
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Espionnage with intent or not is an act of treason.

Islamic State using Edward Snowden leaks to evade U.S. intelligence: NSA official - Washington Times

https://www.washingtonpost.com/world/national-security/officials-alert-foreign-services-that-snowden-has-documents-on-their-cooperation-with-us/2013/10/24/930ea85c-3b3e-11e3-a94f-b58017bfee6c_story.html

Military spy chief: Have to assume Russia knows U.S. secrets - CNNPolitics.com

Intelligence that was leaked to Russia from Snowden documents:

•Military plans, weapons systems, or operations

•Foreign government information, intelligence activities (including special activities), intelligence sources, or methods or cryptology

•Foreign relations or foreign activities of the United States, including confidential sources

•Scientific, technological, or economic matters relating to national security

•United States government program for safeguarding nuclear materials or facilities

•Vulnerabilities or capabilities of systems, installations, infrastructures, projects, plans, or protection services relations to national security

•The development, production, or use of weapons of mass destruction
 
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#4,040
#4,040
n_huffhines said:
Intent is a part of English law. The intent was not to aid enemies. The intent was to help the American people. If you want to go strictly off letter of the law, every modern president has sent foreign aid to enemies. Are they traitors? They "aided enemies".
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I see. Potentially exposing US secrets to our enemy is only treason if intent can be proven. I am absolutely flabbergasted that Hillary has not used that logic regarding her emails.

And, I might add, how do you know what Snowden's intent was?
 
#4,041
#4,041
carlos86 said:
Espionnage with intent or not is an act of treason.

Islamic State using Edward Snowden leaks to evade U.S. intelligence: NSA official - Washington Times

https://www.washingtonpost.com/world/national-security/officials-alert-foreign-services-that-snowden-has-documents-on-their-cooperation-with-us/2013/10/24/930ea85c-3b3e-11e3-a94f-b58017bfee6c_story.html

Military spy chief: Have to assume Russia knows U.S. secrets - CNNPolitics.com

Intelligence that was leaked from Russia from Swoden documents:

•Military plans, weapons systems, or operations

•Foreign government information, intelligence activities (including special activities), intelligence sources, or methods or cryptology

•Foreign relations or foreign activities of the United States, including confidential sources

•Scientific, technological, or economic matters relating to national security

•United States government program for safeguarding nuclear materials or facilities

•Vulnerabilities or capabilities of systems, installations, infrastructures, projects, plans, or protection services relations to national security

•The development, production, or use of weapons of mass destruction
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So you agree the US government committed treason?
 
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#4,042
#4,042
IBlvNTmWrk said:
I see. Potentially exposing US secrets to our enemy is only treason if intent can be proven. I am absolutely flabbergasted that Hillary has not used that logic regarding her emails.

And, I might add, how do you know what Snowden's intent was?
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Well, he revealed it to everyone...that kinda tells you right there what his intent was. The information he shares is much more powerful to an enemy if the US government doesn't know they have that info. Snowden wasn't selling us out. Those who are supposed to protect us sold us out.
 
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#4,043
#4,043
n_huffhines said:
Well, he revealed it to everyone...that kinda tells you right there what his intent was. The information he shares is much more powerful to an enemy if the US government doesn't know they have that info. Snowden wasn't selling us out. Those who are supposed to protect us sold us out.
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Right. And Nixon said he wasn't a crook, Clinton said he did not have sex with Monica, Bush and others said there were WMD's, and Hillary said there were no confidential emails sent to/from her personal server. I guess we should always just take what someone says as the truth. Whether he shared it with only the enemy or revealed it to everyone is as irrelevant as his intent. The facts are that he provided information to our enemy which is treason.
 
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#4,044
#4,044
n_huffhines said:
Well, he revealed it to everyone...that kinda tells you right there what his intent was. The information he shares is much more powerful to an enemy if the US government doesn't know they have that info. Snowden wasn't selling us out. Those who are supposed to protect us sold us out.
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This is pure ignorance...
 
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#4,046
#4,046
IBlvNTmWrk said:
haha... that's why I enjoy many of your posts Gramps. Even though we may disagree on occasion, your posts are usually well reasoned.

(edit: note how I left myself an out above so in the future if I disagree with you it won't be considered a flip-flop.)
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Ha Ha, yes I saw that. We both know that the word "usually" should be changed to "always". LOL

Thanks for the kind words.

:hi:
 
#4,047
#4,047
Look, I'm not saying that Snowden didn't break the law. If the law must be satisfied, then he should be charged. That being said, treason is not an appropriate charge. He broke the law to "spy" on the spies who broke the law by spying on Americans.

Why is everyone so concerned with charging him with treason? Why don't they give a rat's ass about the original offenders getting punished?
 
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#4,048
#4,048
n_huffhines said:
Look, I'm not saying that Snowden didn't break the law. If the law must be satisfied, then he should be charged. That being said, treason is not an appropriate charge. He broke the law to "spy" on the spies who broke the law by spying on Americans.

Why is everyone so concerned with charging him with treason? Why don't they give a rat's ass about the original offenders getting punished?
Click to expand...

I've been saying on here for a long time that the officials who authorized this program should be the ones charged with treason.
 
#4,049
#4,049
n_huffhines said:
Look, I'm not saying that Snowden didn't break the law. If the law must be satisfied, then he should be charged. That being said, treason is not an appropriate charge. He broke the law to "spy" on the spies who broke the law by spying on Americans.

Why is everyone so concerned with charging him with treason? Why don't they give a rat's ass about the original offenders getting punished?
Click to expand...



Snowden was entrusted with government classified information. He released part of that information to the world to see. That makes him guilty of treason.

As far as those "original defenders getting punished", that is a separate legal case.
 
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#4,050
#4,050
Vol8188 said:
I've been saying on here for a long time that the officials who authorized this program should be the ones charged with treason.
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The program was legal!!!! It was approved by the FISA Court which has 2 supreme Court Justices on it. When someone tried to sue the government over it the courts turned it down. It was was appealed to the Circuit courts who turned it down and then appealed to the supreme Court who refused to take the case. The program was only stopped because of public outrage not legality.
 
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