Will Jalen Hurd make an All SEC Team?

#201
#201
orangetd88 said:
OK, so I was wrong. I didn't think he was as heavy or tall as Hurd, but he is pretty dang close.

I stand corrected.
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He looks like he is bigger overall (twss). But I think jalen is a little more athletic overall. Jalen has speed, power, and quickness. Henry does too but im taking jalen everyday and twice on sunday. Pun intended
 
#202
#202
MikeVol44 said:
Look up the sack yardage....it will enlighten you....

Henry had 28 attempts for 143 yards....

As a team--we had 39 attempts for 132 yards....

oops!
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If memory serves me correctly, both quarterbacks were sacked five times. Josh simply generated enough positive yardage to finish with 19 yards rushing on 16 carries, whereas Coker had -26 yards on 7 carries. Consequently, Alabama finished with 117 yards rushing on 42 carries. Oops!
 
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#203
#203
Derek Henry is a very good back but he has reached his potential. He is a lesser Eddie lacy. Jalen Hurd is a very very special football player. He is a gifted running back. Right now Derek Henry is better than Hurd statistically because of his experience and an offensive line that opens great gaps. No knock on Henry, because he will make a solid NFL running back, not great, but solid....now jalen is much faster, and when he learns to get his pad level a little lower he is going to be unstoppable. He runs a little high at times still, and needs to not hesitate which comes with better awareness, and trust with his offensive line, which understandably has been hard to do when you get hit in the back field often. All those things will be fixed, he is young. Jalen has elite speed, big hips and legs. He is a perfectly built running back. He reminds me of Erik Dickerson. He is the most gifted running back Tennessee has had, and I have played with a couple great backs here. I don't just say that. This is his first significant year with this offense, wait til next year......
 
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#204
#204
Almost 30 percent of jalen's yardage is coming after initial contact. He has to cut more in the backfield than most other sec running backs like Chubb, fournette, Henry, etc. I will guarantee Hurd is a better rb in the NFL than Henry. I do think we could help him with some changes in scheme but ultimately I think this team has a mediocre oline right now so it doesn't matter what scheme or set we use IMO. This will get a lot better next year IMO and Hurd will have a better year because of it. Sitting out a year would just be idiotic IMO. Play your junior year then go pro if your frustrated.
 
#205
#205
DaddyChad said:
Almost 30 percent of jalen's yardage is coming after initial contact. He has to cut more in the backfield than most other sec running backs like Chubb, fournette, Henry, etc. I will guarantee Hurd is a better rb in the NFL than Henry. I do think we could help him with some changes in scheme but ultimately I think this team has a mediocre oline right now so it doesn't matter what scheme or set we use IMO. This will get a lot better next year IMO and Hurd will have a better year because of it. Sitting out a year would just be idiotic IMO. Play your junior year then go pro if your frustrated.
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How does that 30% compare to henry and fournette?
 
#206
#206
VFL34 said:
Derek Henry is a very good back but he has reached his potential. He is a lesser Eddie lacy. Jalen Hurd is a very very special football player. He is a gifted running back. Right now Derek Henry is better than Hurd statistically because of his experience and an offensive line that opens great gaps. No knock on Henry, because he will make a solid NFL running back, not great, but solid....now jalen is much faster, and when he learns to get his pad level a little lower he is going to be unstoppable. He runs a little high at times still, and needs to not hesitate which comes with better awareness, and trust with his offensive line, which understandably has been hard to do when you get hit in the back field often. All those things will be fixed, he is young. Jalen has elite speed, big hips and legs. He is a perfectly built running back. He reminds me of Erik Dickerson. He is the most gifted running back Tennessee has had, and I have played with a couple great backs here. I don't just say that. This is his first significant year with this offense, wait til next year......
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Agree with you on Henry.. I remember being roasted for saying Lacy would be a better pro than Richardson.. Hurd is special.. He can do things that Henry can't do, IMO. He made a spin move earlier this year (don't remember the game) that was downright freakish for someone his size.. I don't think Henry can move like that..
 
#207
#207
VFL34 said:
Derek Henry is a very good back but he has reached his potential. He is a lesser Eddie lacy. Jalen Hurd is a very very special football player. He is a gifted running back. Right now Derek Henry is better than Hurd statistically because of his experience and an offensive line that opens great gaps. No knock on Henry, because he will make a solid NFL running back, not great, but solid....now jalen is much faster, and when he learns to get his pad level a little lower he is going to be unstoppable. He runs a little high at times still, and needs to not hesitate which comes with better awareness, and trust with his offensive line, which understandably has been hard to do when you get hit in the back field often. All those things will be fixed, he is young. Jalen has elite speed, big hips and legs. He is a perfectly built running back. He reminds me of Erik Dickerson. He is the most gifted running back Tennessee has had, and I have played with a couple great backs here. I don't just say that. This is his first significant year with this offense, wait til next year......
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A hypothetical question for you, Travis. If you could take the offensive line you ran behind in 1998 and you could start either Jamal Lewis, Chuck Webb or Jalen Hurd at tailback, who would be the most productive player at that position and why? Also, to the best of your knowledge, what was Jamal's top-end speed? I am curious since it has been reported that Jalen was laser-timed at 4.37 for the 40.
 
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#208
#208
BruinVol said:
How does that 30% compare to henry and fournette?
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Can't check from work but Dalvin Cook is number one in that category. Statistically a better indicator would be yards before contact to evaluate the Olines each back is running behind but I don't that anyone has that stat available right now. When you watch film of Hurd, Fournette, Henry, Cook, Chubb, etc and all of these gold standard backs, Hurd makes more cuts to avoid contact and breaks more tackles in the backfield than any of those other backs. He is great in pass protection and a decent receiver out of the backfield. Statistically it may not support him being better than this RB or that RB but on tape he looks as good or better than anyone except Fournette. People get caught up in the stats too much at times though; does anyone legitimately believe Henry is a better RB than Fournette? Because if so they need their head examined.
 
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#210
#210
DaddyChad said:
Can't check from work but Dalvin Cook is number one in that category. Statistically a better indicator would be yards before contact to evaluate the Olines each back is running behind but I don't that anyone has that stat available right now. When you watch film of Hurd, Fournette, Henry, Cook, Chubb, etc and all of these gold standard backs, Hurd makes more cuts to avoid contact and breaks more tackles in the backfield than any of those other backs. He is great in pass protection and a decent receiver out of the backfield. Statistically it may not support him being better than this RB or that RB but on tape he looks as good or better than anyone except Fournette. People get caught up in the stats too much at times though; does anyone legitimately believe Henry is a better RB than Fournette? Because if so they need their head examined.
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Good stuff.

Would love to know those stats
 
#211
#211
DaddyChad said:
Can't check from work but Dalvin Cook is number one in that category. Statistically a better indicator would be yards before contact to evaluate the Olines each back is running behind but I don't that anyone has that stat available right now. When you watch film of Hurd, Fournette, Henry, Cook, Chubb, etc and all of these gold standard backs, Hurd makes more cuts to avoid contact and breaks more tackles in the backfield than any of those other backs. He is great in pass protection and a decent receiver out of the backfield. Statistically it may not support him being better than this RB or that RB but on tape he looks as good or better than anyone except Fournette. People get caught up in the stats too much at times though; does anyone legitimately believe Henry is a better RB than Fournette? Because if so they need their head examined.
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The yards before contact stat is kept. I heard them talking about it on ESPN before the UA/LSU game in reference to Fournette.. They were saying he averaged something like 110 YPG before contact.. Well, at least he was before Bama...
 
#212
#212
m1al said:
The yards before contact stat is kept. I heard them talking about it on ESPN before the UA/LSU game in reference to Fournette.. They were saying he averaged something like 110 YPG before contact.. Well, at least he was before Bama...
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Yeah. It's actually broken down to right, middle, left runs as well to evaluate Oline play for scouts and coaches. I just have a hard time finding it online for college. Sometimes they will do breakdowns at the end of the year for college but in season I haven't found a site that has it. If you find it let me know. Going by eye though Fournette and Henry get a lot of yards before contact, they do get plenty after contact as well because they are at full speed by then. Bama showed just what happens when an elite back has to cut in the backfield and then generate yardage on his own versus Fournette though.
 
#213
#213
DaddyChad said:
Yeah. It's actually broken down to right, middle, left runs as well to evaluate Oline play for scouts and coaches. I just have a hard time finding it online for college. Sometimes they will do breakdowns at the end of the year for college but in season I haven't found a site that has it. If you find it let me know. Going by eye though Fournette and Henry get a lot of yards before contact, they do get plenty after contact as well because they are at full speed by then. Bama showed just what happens when an elite back has to cut in the backfield and then generate yardage on his own versus Fournette though.
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When they referenced the stat they eluded that it was not a common one out there for the general public.. Not that it's some closely guarded secret, it just sounded like you'd have to really dig to find it.
 
#214
#214
Volosaurus rex said:
A hypothetical question for you, Travis. If you could take the offensive line you ran behind in 1998 and you could start either Jamal Lewis, Chuck Webb or Jalen Hurd at tailback, who would be the most productive player at that position and why? Also, to the best of your knowledge, what was Jamal's top-end speed? I am curious since it has been reported that Jalen was laser-timed at 4.37 for the 40.
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It would be Travis Henry. He was a bowling ball that no one could tackle with a quick acceleration. Jamal ran a 4.49 the best i saw. His every day speed was 4.6 range.
 
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#216
#216
gobraves101035 said:
I see this all the time but honestly how? We're still going to have the same offensive line with Richmond starting.
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That's true, but let's look at two things:

1. We'll have an oline that is one year stronger, with a better grasp of the blocking schemes (a big deal when some of the starters are currently freshmen).

2. Our opponents will lose some of their defensive linemen and linebackers to graduation or leaving early for the draft, so the front 7's we face next year will presumably be less experienced.
 
#217
#217
Volosaurus rex said:
If memory serves me correctly, both quarterbacks were sacked five times. Josh simply generated enough positive yardage to finish with 19 yards rushing on 16 carries, whereas Coker had -26 yards on 7 carries. Consequently, Alabama finished with 117 yards rushing on 42 carries. Oops!
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Sacks are NOT rushing attempts.....and Dobbs earned his yardage to negate his sacks on DESIGNED runs....Just how many designed runs did Coker have???

some of you on here just lack any concept of footballl IQ.....all you know is how read a list of numbers instead of using your brain to actually evaluate what happened in the game....

For the box score--statistically speaking--We outrushed Alabama....IF you did not watch the game....

From ACTUAL reality--and game performance--Alabama was more effective running the ball than we were....and Henry gained more yardage than our entire team....it's just that simple. Coker got sacked a lot--not because of our outstanding rushing defense--but becuase Barnett and Vereen went into beast mode against Bama's tackles...

If you can't see that--I just can't fix dumb....OOPS!

Here endeth the lesson..:salute:
 
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#218
#218
MikeVol44 said:
Sacks are NOT rushing attempts.....and Dobbs earned his yardage to negate his sacks on DESIGNED runs....Just how many designed runs did Coker have???

some of you on here just lack any concept of footballl IQ.....all you know is how read a list of numbers instead of using your brain to actually evaluate what happened in the game....

For the box score--statistically speaking--We outrushed Alabama....IF you did not watch the game....

From ACTUAL reality--and game performance--Alabama was more effective running the ball than we were....and Henry gained more yardage than our entire team....it's just that simple. Coker got sacked a lot--not because of our outstanding rushing defense--but becuase Barnett and Vereen went into beast mode against Bama's tackles...

If you can't see that--I just can't fix dumb....OOPS!

Here endeth the lesson..:salute:
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Doesn't the nfl use sack yards against the passing totals?


That would be a more accurate way of looking at stats IMO even if I am wrong on that
 
#219
#219
Ulysees E. McGill said:
Reading is elementary? You are a long winded balloon full of hot air. It is obvious that you want this to be a means to your end. You hate the system, and you want it changed. If Hurd screws up team chemistry by being a selfish butthole, then so be it...right? The quicker to get rid of Butch and his crappy system. I understand frustration, but I hate the selfish "whatever is best for me" nature that pervades "team" sports now...NOTHING good comes from this for the TEAM. I'm sure you will respond with another long winded monologue about how Hurd is a champion of social justice, and he is only standing up to that scumbag, totalitarian coach because it is the right thing to do, but I'm done, that is all I to say about that...have a nice day. ��
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Straw man much????[/I][/B]

Look--

1. I don't like CBJ's system...
2. I like CBJ....and want him to succeed....
3. I don't believe CBJ's system will lead us back to an SEC championship--in its current form...
4. I do think CBJ will have to swallow his pride and make necessary changes...
5. I think HURD should stay regardless.....
6. I do believe that CBJ will not be our coach in 2018....IF HE continues his current patterns of game-day decisions....he just flat out chokes in the spotlight of the SEC....

I'm done with you ..... so just chew on your own tongue if you have to or put me on block...I don't really care
 
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#220
#220
BruinVol said:
Doesn't the nfl use sack yards against the passing totals?


That would be a more accurate way of looking at stats IMO even if I am wrong on that
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I honestly don't know..but agree with you...sacks shouldn't be factored into rushing totals...
 
#221
#221
VFL34 said:
Derek Henry is a very good back but he has reached his potential. He is a lesser Eddie lacy. Jalen Hurd is a very very special football player. He is a gifted running back. Right now Derek Henry is better than Hurd statistically because of his experience and an offensive line that opens great gaps. No knock on Henry, because he will make a solid NFL running back, not great, but solid....now jalen is much faster, and when he learns to get his pad level a little lower he is going to be unstoppable. He runs a little high at times still, and needs to not hesitate which comes with better awareness, and trust with his offensive line, which understandably has been hard to do when you get hit in the back field often. All those things will be fixed, he is young. Jalen has elite speed, big hips and legs. He is a perfectly built running back. He reminds me of Erik Dickerson. He is the most gifted running back Tennessee has had, and I have played with a couple great backs here. I don't just say that. This is his first significant year with this offense, wait til next year......
Click to expand...

A few honest questions--

1. Why do you think that Henry has reached his potential?

2. Where do you think Reggie Cobb or Chuck Webb fit into the roll of UT RBs?
 
#222
#222
MikeVol44 said:
I honestly don't know..but agree with you...sacks shouldn't be factored into rushing totals...
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Looked it up. Pretty Wierd how the NFL does it

A sacks lost yards come off of the team passing yard. Not the indidual QB passing yards or rushing yards. Odd for sure
 
#223
#223
BruinVol said:
Looked it up. Pretty Wierd how the NFL does it

A sacks lost yards come off of the team passing yard. Not the indidual QB passing yards or rushing yards. Odd for sure
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Sounds like they created a new category altogether to more accurately reflect what happens in games...or they were forced to do it by the NFLPA....lol!

my point was very simple concerning this issue:

Anyone who watched the Bama game knows that we had some success running the ball...some good success at times during the game....HURD being a beast and all that....he earns every yard he gets for sure!

But Alabama had better success in the game running the ball....it's really just that simple...

thanks for looking it up...:hi:
 
#225
#225
MikeVol44 said:
A few honest questions--

1. Why do you think that Henry has reached his potential?

2. Where do you think Reggie Cobb or Chuck Webb fit into the roll of UT RBs?
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Intuition. When you look at a back like Henry, he isn't going to get much faster. He can't get much stronger. The reason why he can't get much stronger is because when your already squatting 500 pounds, coaches tend to prevent you from going to extreme weight to prevent injuries, so therefore the most I can see is him getting to 600 pounds. He isn't as thick as Eddie Lacey, Eddie is the same weight and much shorter, I think about 5'11, but possesses better shiftiness. Derek Henry will be a good back, but he won't amount to an all pro back. He is much like a bigger mark ingram.... Now fournette is an absolute freak. So now compare Henry to fournette to drive the point home. Fournette is about 6'1 and 230 and runs probably a low 4'3, and he runs to punish people but also displays the ability to juke you. Yes he bad a bad game against Alabama but as a running back those things happen. Fournette has the ability to take his game to the next level As impossible as that seems. Jalen Hurd has all the potential possible. Cobb and Webb are the reason for UT becoming a school rich with running backs. They paved the way.
 
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