Migration Nightmares Hitting Europe

#152
#152
n_huffhines said:
People that want current immigration law enforced are asking to deny millions the American dream. Current law will not allow them in legally.

If (rhetorical) you oppose reform then you do deny others the dream.
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I don't deny reform of immigration law is needed but that's not what our President has done. He's granted amnesty on a whim with no real reform.
 
#154
#154
theFallGuy said:
I don't deny reform of immigration law is needed but that's not what our President has done. He's granted amnesty on a whim with no real reform.
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That's basically what they did in the 80s, too. Too many people oppose real reform.

Btw, Obama hasn't granted ammesty he just isn't kicking people out.
 
#155
#155
hog88 said:
Just name one civilization who allowed open and unfettered immigration/migration that wasn't destroyed by it.
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Most of the largest empires the world has ever seen had very open and tolerant migration policies and treatment during their rise and very closed and intolerant migration policies and treatment during their fall.

So, let's begin with Persia, Athens, and Rome, for $500, Alex.

Oh, also, something to note in the history of civilizations: usually a change to a more closed migration policy is quickly followed by closing off political activity to almost everyone but the very elite in the state.
 
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#157
#157
BearCat204 said:
Are you suggesting it's a false statement?
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It's not really meaningful until you support it. What is the number you are comcerned about? If I am to respond to your point i wanna know what you are actually saying. Are you comcerned with the kids that get free lunch at school?
 
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#158
#158
therealUT said:
Most of the largest empires the world has ever seen had very open and tolerant migration policies and treatment during their rise and very closed and intolerant migration policies and treatment during their fall.

So, let's begin with Persia, Athens, and Rome, for $500, Alex.

Oh, also, something to note in the history of civilizations: usually a change to a more closed migration policy is quickly followed by closing off political activity to almost everyone but the very elite in the state.
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I missed the part in history class where the immigrants in Rome, Persia and Athens were allowed to eventually vote or hold office.

I assume in your unfettered immigration plan you mean for these people to basically be serfs and never allowed political clout?
 
#159
#159
hog88 said:
I missed the part in history class where the immigrants in Rome, Persia and Athens were allowed to eventually vote or hold office.

I assume in your unfettered immigration plan you mean for these people to basically be serfs and never allowed political clout?
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So take what the Romans did and make progress with it. Or regress, if that's what you are into.
 
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#161
#161
n_huffhines said:
It's not really meaningful until you support it. What is the number you are comcerned about? If I am to respond to your point i wanna know what you are actually saying. Are you comcerned with the kids that get free lunch at school?
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You said that Americans not willing to work a job for 9$ is "progress" right? How could you consider those people who wont work for 9$ to be on Government assistance instead? Unless I missed what you were saying.
 
#162
#162
BearCat204 said:
You said that Americans not willing to work a job for 9$ is "progress" right? How could you consider those people who wont work for 9$ to be on Government assistance instead? Unless I missed what you were saying.
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They leave the work force or get new skills and higher earnings. It creates some growing pains, but all progress does.

It's progress because our cost of living goes down. Everybody who didn't lose their job got wealthier. That's a lot of people.
 
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#163
#163
hog88 said:
I missed the part in history class where the immigrants in Rome, Persia and Athens were allowed to eventually vote or hold office.

I assume in your unfettered immigration plan you mean for these people to basically be serfs and never allowed political clout?
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My ancestors … encourage me to govern by the same policy of transferring to this city all conspicuous merit, wherever found. And indeed I know, as facts, that the Julii came from Alba, the Coruncanii from Camerium, the Porcii from Tusculum, and not to inquire too minutely into the past, that new members have been brought into the Senate from Etruria and Lucania and the whole of Italy, that Italy itself was at last extended to the Alps, to the end that not only single persons but entire countries and tribes might be united under our name.

We had unshaken peace at home; we prospered in all our foreign relations, in the days when Italy beyond the Po was admitted to share our citizenship…. Are we sorry that the Balbi came to us from Spain, and other men not less illustrious from Narbon Gaul? Their descendants are still among us, and do not yield to us in patriotism.

Everything, Senators, which we now hold to be of the highest antiquity, was once new.
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This was stated in an edict by Emperor Claudius in 48 AD. You should get a refund for your Western Civ course.

Roman citizenship was not a birth-right, it was earned. Many migrants not only earned citizenship but went on to be political officials in the Roman Empire, through the Pax Romana. Towards the end of the third century, start of the fourth century, Rome became much more exclusive and much less tolerant.
 
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#164
#164
n_huffhines said:
They leave the work force or get new skills and higher earnings. It creates some growing pains, but all progress does.

It's progress because our cost of living goes down.
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What are you seeing that suggests that this is a reality that is actually happening?
 
#167
#167
FLVOL69 said:
Sounds pretty ****ing decent for entry-level wages, you got to start somewhere.
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Yeah, it's not bad but the white girl i knew who did it quit after 1 day to earn $7 making donuts. She didn't like cleaning up used condoms and syringes.

Also, why do you want to pay $9 when to can pay $8? I'm not rich enough to act like 12.5% doesn't make a difference.
 
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#171
#171
therealUT said:
This was stated in an edict by Emperor Claudius in 48 AD. You should get a refund for your Western Civ course.

Roman citizenship was not a birth-right, it was earned. Many not migrants not only earned citizenship but went on to be political officials in the Roman Empire, through the Pax Romana. Towards the end of the third century, start of the fourth century, Rome became much more exclusive and much less tolerant.
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I would suggest you tell the WHOLE story. There were 4(?) classes of Roman citizenship each granting certain rights. So until the 3rd or 4th generation a freedman or Latini had almost zero political sway.
 
#175
#175
n_huffhines said:
Yeah, it's not bad but the white girl i knew who did it quit after 1 day to earn $7 making donuts. She didn't like cleaning up used condoms and syringes.

Also, why do you want to pay $9 when to can pay $8? I'm not rich enough to act like 12.5% doesn't make a difference.
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Because that's what the market will dictate, when you have less people competing for jobs wages rise.
 
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