Official Global Warming thread (merged)

[Obsessed]

Haven't you learned OB? All scientists are incredible unless Bart says so.

Were you able to read the link?

I don't have the fancy degrees and knowledge to understand all the in' sand out's on this matter. I try and take all I can from all the posts on this matter from all of you.

I find this scientist as credible as any Bart or yourself have posted or linked too.

**** you guys will have to forgive my ignorance****

 

[BartW]

Are you mentally challenged or something? You can call it denial or whatever you want but nobody cares. It's that simple. And by nobody I mean the entire planet. The planet has undergone changes for a few billion years that had nothing to do with man. Talking about something without a feasible solution that's impossible to execute is a waste of time. If this is what your "education" has consisted of then you wasted your time.

Again, if you don’t care, why post? This thread is approaching 3000 posts in 3 years so obviously some people care. Carbon pricing is a feasible solution already being employed around the world. And the “climate has changed before” argument is a non sequitur.

Haven't you learned OB? All scientists are incredible unless Bart says so.

Butthurt much? You shouldn’t need my help to figure out that guy is full of crap. Denying that CO2 levels have increased is like denying the existence of cheese.

Were you able to read the link?

I don't have the fancy degrees and knowledge to understand all the in' sand out's on this matter. I try and take all I can from all the posts on this matter from all of you.

I find this scientist as credible as any Bart or yourself have posted or linked too.

**** you guys will have to forgive my ignorance****

Breitbart pointing out that Woodcock is a NASA retiree is an attempt at appeal to authority, but it fails as he doesn’t have any authority. Woodcock (like many BOT et al. have linked) doesn’t have a degree in or any research related to climate science. And it's disappointing that he doesn't know about infrared gas analyzers, being a chemist and all.

I do forgive y’all for your ignorance. I don’t mean to be condescending but it’s just tiring to see the same old recycled denialist trash. Like I said, there’s a lot of mis and disinformation out there that for non-scientists can be difficult to recognize. You don’t earn the title of denier simply by posting a denialist argument. A lot of people get suckered in by denialist arguments and benefit from having the record corrected or being shown how to recognize good scientific debate versus unsound denialist debates. But for some it’s not an honest mistake -- it’s a habit.

 

[govols/cc]

We post to make fun of you.

 

[W.TN.Orange Blood]

We post to make fun of you.

Yeah, so much for Settled Science & end of story. It first started off as Global Cooling. Then it went to Global Warming. Then they (scientist) came up w/Climate Change. Now, this time, they (scientist) have a new name for this & have come up w/what's being called as Climate Disruption. What they (scientist) need to call it is "Weather". This just shows they (scientist) don't know jackchit.

 

[Weezy]

"Corporate and special interest" funding is not so different than government funding. Try applying for a grant doing something that doesn't fit the green energy narrative. And I don't doubt the scientists conclusions. They might want to get paid like the rest of us, but they aren't liars. Although if it leads to more funding, a new study is always needed.

I just don't trust the political mouthpieces and their solutions. Cap and trade will absolutely increase peoples electric bills. That's the only end game to a solution that punishes more cost-effective solutions. And that's in an ideal world. Once government gets their hands on something, it inevitably leads to the worst case scenario (vote buying and corruption).

 

[Obsessed]

....

 

[VolsNSkinsFan]

Denver is about to get a historic snow storm with never seen before cold temps. Models are forecasting temps as low as 13 with 9 inches of snow.

 

[W.TN.Orange Blood]

All of this Climate Disruption theory crap is pretty scary sounding to some folks I suppose. But it's designed to distract us from topics that the President & the Democrats do not want to talk about: Obamacare, the IRS scandals, Benghazi, a host of foreign policy failures & still horrible jobless & workforce participation rates plus not to forget an abysmal 0.1% first quarter GDP growth rate that hearkens back to the Great Depression.

 

[BigOrangeTrain]

All of this Climate Disruption theory crap is pretty scary sounding to some folks I suppose. But it's designed to distract us from topics that the President & the Democrats do not want to talk about: Obamacare, the IRS scandals, Benghazi, a host of foreign policy failures & still horrible jobless & workforce participation rates plus not to forget an abysmal 0.1% first quarter GDP growth rate that hearkens back to the Great Depression.

I am curious as to what the next new term will be. I mean climate disruption does sound a little cryptic.

 

[BartW]

Yeah, so much for Settled Science & end of story. It first started off as Global Cooling. Then it went to Global Warming. Then they (scientist) came up w/Climate Change. Now, this time, they (scientist) have a new name for this & have come up w/what's being called as Climate Disruption. What they (scientist) need to call it is "Weather". This just shows they (scientist) don't know jackchit.

....

All of this Climate Disruption theory crap is pretty scary sounding to some folks I suppose. But it's designed to distract us from topics that the President & the Democrats do not want to talk about: Obamacare, the IRS scandals, Benghazi, a host of foreign policy failures & still horrible jobless & workforce participation rates plus not to forget an abysmal 0.1% first quarter GDP growth rate that hearkens back to the Great Depression.

I am curious as to what the next new term will be. I mean climate disruption does sound a little cryptic.

I’ve addressed these tired denialist talking points at least half a dozen times. It never "started out as global cooling." Global warming and climate change are related but not interchangeable terms, and both have been used for several decades. The term climate disruption is interchangeable with climate change, and has been advocated since at least the 90s. Scientists didn’t recently invent these terms to scare you. Ironically this myth grew out of GOP political strategist Frank Luntz’s 2002 memo:


The scientific debate is closing [against us] but not yet closed. There is still a window of opportunity to challenge the science.

Voters believe that there is no consensus about global warming within the scientific community. Should the public come to believe that the scientific issues are settled, their views about global warming will change accordingly.

“Climate change” is less frightening than “global warming.” As one focus group participant noted, climate change “sounds like you’re going from Pittsburgh to Fort Lauderdale.” While global warming has catastrophic connotations attached to it, climate change suggests a more controllable and less emotional challenge.

We should be “conservationists,” not preservationists” or “environmentalists.” The term “conservationist” has far more positive connotations than either of the other two terms. It conveys a moderate, reasoned, common sense position between replenishing the earth’s natural resources and the human need tomake use of those resources.

Emphasize the importance of 'acting only with all the facts in hand'


Sound familiar? Remember the Kehoe paradigm?

Have you ever considered that maybe things like the IRS scandal, Benghazi, gay marriage, abortion, war on drugs, etc. might be distracting people from the more pressing issue of climate change? There's so much frivolous partisan bickering it's no wonder congress never gets anything done.

And climate =/= weather :banghead2: c'mon guys we’ve been over this stuff. Repeating the same thoroughly debunked talking points just shows that you “don’t know jackchit."

 

[BartW]

"Corporate and special interest" funding is not so different than government funding. Try applying for a grant doing something that doesn't fit the green energy narrative. And I don't doubt the scientists conclusions. They might want to get paid like the rest of us, but they aren't liars. Although if it leads to more funding, a new study is always needed.

I just don't trust the political mouthpieces and their solutions. Cap and trade will absolutely increase peoples electric bills. That's the only end game to a solution that punishes more cost-effective solutions. And that's in an ideal world. Once government gets their hands on something, it inevitably leads to the worst case scenario (vote buying and corruption).

The vast majority of scientific research has no relation to the “green narrative”. There are plenty of grants related to the oil industry and our government hands out billions in oil subsidies each year.

I prefer the carbon tax to cap and trade, but I will point out that cap and trade was originally a GOP idea introduced to combat acid rain. Back then anti-environmentalists were also b!tching and moaning that cap and trade would destroy the economy, but lo and behold the program was successful at only a fraction of the projected cost. The same fundy libertarian (un)think tanks also said the same things about lead, DDT, asbestos, tobacco, CFCs, etc…

Carbon pricing is a market-based solution, which is why fiscal conservatives should (and many do) support it. Increasing energy costs can be offset by tax cuts elsewhere, like the income tax. There is no need to grow the government sector.

 

[BartW]

Denver is about to get a historic snow storm with never seen before cold temps. Models are forecasting temps as low as 13 with 9 inches of snow.

Even if this were true (which it isn’t; the low in Denver was 30) it wouldn’t be relevant. One cold weather event does not disprove the fact that globally Earth is warming. That common denialist talking point is another non-sequitur and calls for bumping the Cold XKCD:

 

[VolsNSkinsFan]

It's currently snowing in Denver, they are expecting up to 9 inches today. The European weather forecast was forecasting a low temp of 13 tonight for Denver. The all time low for Denver in May is 21 degrees on May 1st. You better pray hard to Al Gore that low doesn't break tonight

 

[W.TN.Orange Blood]

I"m going to start calling it "Dem/Liberal Political Disruption". AKA.....make any issue huge to take the voter's eyes off the real issues that people will vote on in November. Don't be a fool & worry w/this nonsense. Nothing can be done to slow down what's natural that's going to happen to the Earth anyway. All we need is a 6 mile wide rock to come from space & destroy life as we know it.....you going to stop that?

 

[Sandvol]

It's currently snowing in Denver, they are expecting up to 9 inches today. The European weather forecast was forecasting a low temp of 13 tonight for Denver. The all time low for Denver in May is 21 degrees on May 1st. You better pray hard to Al Gore that low doesn't break tonight

Bart's going to search far and wide where May temperatures might be at a record highs. First, he's going to check the poles, then Alaska, and then maybe the Himalayas or Northern Siberia.

 

[Sandvol]

The vast majority of scientific research has no relation to the “green narrative”. There are plenty of grants related to the oil industry and our government hands out billions in oil subsidies each year.

I prefer the carbon tax to cap and trade, but I will point out that cap and trade was originally a GOP idea introduced to combat acid rain. Back then anti-environmentalists were also b!tching and moaning that cap and trade would destroy the economy, but lo and behold the program was successful at only a fraction of the projected cost. The same fundy libertarian (un)think tanks also said the same things about lead, DDT, asbestos, tobacco, CFCs, etc…

Carbon pricing is a market-based solution, which is why fiscal conservatives should (and many do) support it. Increasing energy costs can be offset by tax cuts elsewhere, like the income tax. There is no need to grow the government sector.

THIS is what they're after. Don't believe this BS about not growing the government. If they get the Congress and the Presidency again you can bet your booty they're going to pass it. Just like Obamacare it doesn't matter what America wants or needs.

P.S.-This will be a 5000 page bill that if you want to know what's in it you'll have to pass it.

 

[VolsNSkinsFan]

oh its going to be 90 in DC this week, which is hot, but not out of the norm like snow is in middle of May. Plus Texas is about to get soaked so Im sure they will blame GW on that.

The reality is that Al Gore said the Arctic would be ice free by 2014 and it currently looks like this.

and Lake Superior is currently 31% covered in Ice

Also this

Total Great Lakes Ice Cover is at 15% on 5/9. That’s the most ice we have ever had on the Great Lakes this late in the year.

 

[Sandvol]

oh its going to be 90 in DC this week, which is hot, but not out of the norm like snow is in middle of May. Plus Texas is about to get soaked so Im sure they will blame GW on that.

The reality is that Al Gore said the Arctic would be ice free by 2014 and it currently looks like this.

and Lake Superior is currently 31% covered in Ice

Also this

But you don't understand. Global warming is causing the poles to invert and as they go through this transition the North Pole will shift to the Great Lakes area. That's in their prediction.

 

[BartW]

It's currently snowing in Denver, they are expecting up to 9 inches today. The European weather forecast was forecasting a low temp of 13 tonight for Denver. The all time low for Denver in May is 21 degrees on May 1st. You better pray hard to Al Gore that low doesn't break tonight

The low today was 30 and they had less than 2 inches, just like TWC forecasted. I don’t know what forecast you were looking at. And again, cold weather events don’t disprove global warming. Dumb argument is dumb.

oh its going to be 90 in DC this week, which is hot, but not out of the norm like snow is in middle of May. Plus Texas is about to get soaked so Im sure they will blame GW on that.

The reality is that Al Gore said the Arctic would be ice free by 2014 and Lake Superior is currently 31% covered in Ice

The annual Arctic ice maximum happened just a few weeks ago. Scientists didn’t predict an ice-free Arctic by 2014, but it’s not far off. Arctic ice loss is happening faster than IPCC projections.

Youtube - Arctic Sea Ice Minimum Volumes 1979-2012
Youtube - TimeLapse: Watch 27 Years of 'Old' Arctic Ice Melt Away in Seconds

I"m going to start calling it "Dem/Liberal Political Disruption". AKA.....make any issue huge to take the voter's eyes off the real issues that people will vote on in November. Don't be a fool & worry w/this nonsense. Nothing can be done to slow down what's natural that's going to happen to the Earth anyway. All we need is a 6 mile wide rock to come from space & destroy life as we know it.....you going to stop that?

...yeah. We’re sure as hell gonna try. NASA has a near-Earth object program and other countries have similar spaceguard organizations. There are already multiple asteroid mining ventures underway. Asteroid impact avoidance is not far-fetched. Likewise there’s plenty we can do to mitigate AGW. Your hopelessness is weak.

And here we also see the environmentalism=dem/liberal stereotype again. Remind me, which president put conservationism on the national agenda? Who created the EPA? Which party came up with cap-and-trade?

Bart's going to search far and wide where May temperatures might be at a record highs. First, he's going to check the poles, then Alaska, and then maybe the Himalayas or Northern Siberia.

THIS is what they're after. Don't believe this BS about not growing the government. If they get the Congress and the Presidency again you can bet your booty they're going to pass it. Just like Obamacare it doesn't matter what America wants or needs.

P.S.-This will be a 5000 page bill that if you want to know what's in it you'll have to pass it.

But you don't understand. Global warming is causing the poles to invert and as they go through this transition the North Pole will shift to the Great Lakes area. That's in their prediction.

 

[Obsessed]

When all this ice melts and the ocean levels rise, will Florida be gone? What about Cuba?

Will Fukushima be completely under water? Will the radiation then leak out, killing all aquatic life?

 

[MG1968]

Is climate change making Earth 'EXPAND'? | Mail Online

don't worry about the flooding, thanks to global warming, the earth is getting larger

 

[Obsessed]

Is climate change making Earth 'EXPAND'? | Mail Online

don't worry about the flooding, thanks to global warming, the earth is getting larger

Oh hell.

She's swelling up?

 

[MG1968]

Oh hell.

She's swelling up?

Gaia is menopausal now and is getting all bloated

 

[volholio]

www.nytimes.com/2014/05/13/science/earth/collapse-of-parts-of-west-antarctica-ice-sheet-has-begun-scientists-say.html?partner=rss&emc=rss&_r=1


"The basic problem is that much of the West Antarctic ice sheet sits below sea level in a kind of bowl-shaped depression the earth. As Dr. Mercer outlined in 1978, once the part of the ice sheet sitting on the rim of the bowl melts and the ice retreats into deeper water, it becomes unstable and highly vulnerable to further melting.

Richard B. Alley, a climate scientist at Pennsylvania State University who was not involved in the new research but has studied the polar ice sheets for decades, said he found the new papers compelling. Though he has long feared the possibility of ice-sheet collapse, when he learned of the new findings, “it shook me a little bit,” Dr. Alley said.

He added that while a large rise of the sea may now be inevitable from West Antarctica, continued release of greenhouse gases will almost certainly make the situation worse. The heat-trapping gases could destabilize other parts of Antarctica as well as the Greenland ice sheet, causing enough sea-level rise that many of the world’s coastal cities would eventually have to be abandoned."

 

[Sandvol]

www.nytimes.com/2014/05/13/science/earth/collapse-of-parts-of-west-antarctica-ice-sheet-has-begun-scientists-say.html?partner=rss&emc=rss&_r=1


"The basic problem is that much of the West Antarctic ice sheet sits below sea level in a kind of bowl-shaped depression the earth. As Dr. Mercer outlined in 1978, once the part of the ice sheet sitting on the rim of the bowl melts and the ice retreats into deeper water, it becomes unstable and highly vulnerable to further melting.

Richard B. Alley, a climate scientist at Pennsylvania State University who was not involved in the new research but has studied the polar ice sheets for decades, said he found the new papers compelling. Though he has long feared the possibility of ice-sheet collapse, when he learned of the new findings, “it shook me a little bit,” Dr. Alley said.

He added that while a large rise of the sea may now be inevitable from West Antarctica, continued release of greenhouse gases will almost certainly make the situation worse. The heat-trapping gases could destabilize other parts of Antarctica as well as the Greenland ice sheet, causing enough sea-level rise that many of the world’s coastal cities would eventually have to be abandoned."

Sea Level has been rising for 18,000 years. Its going to continue rising until the next glacial.