Who benefits more from a Lady Vol / Uconn game?

[glv98]

Way past that now, all upside.

Agree to disagree. We are far, far from past the lovable loser image, and esp won't be if we continue to disappoint. Exactly like w Kellie, CKC is going to have to win these games by doing more w less to change the narrative.

 

[Rooster1]

Agree to disagree. We are far, far from past the lovable loser image, and esp won't be if we continue to disappoint. Exactly like w Kellie, CKC is going to have to win these games by doing more w less to change the narrative.

Glv, are you advocating the Mulkey cream puff schedule? Has it come to that for you? Because I don’t think a weak OOC schedule will help the LV’s tourney hopes this season. Mulkey has been able to pull it off by also being #2 in the conference, not an easy task for CKC in her first season. Had Mulkey ended up around middle of SEC pack in conference play her weak OOC schedule would have made them a bubble team like Vandy etc….Better to go play the big dogs, wins and losses be damned….thats how UT go their seed this past season…

 

[Rooster1]

BTW, I bet CKC wants to test her team against others like UConn in the season, makes her and her players better, and improves their SOS rankings. Oh, and what if the LV’s win the game? Have you considered that or do you think that is impossible? Huge upside in recruiting if they did that deed, no downside in a loss imo. You should not want the LV’s to run from competition, esp in first season of a new regime, it’s all upside glv.

 

[glv98]

Glv, are you advocating the Mulkey cream puff schedule? Has it come to that for you? Because I don’t think a weak OOC schedule will help the LV’s tourney hopes this season.

I don't think CKC had much control over the OOC sched this year.

There's so much ground btw Mulkey cream puff and playing UConn finally at full strength with a new team in a new system. We need as few televised humiliating losses as we can possibly manage. Have to remake the image. Tough games aren't going to help the tourney resume if we don't win them.

 

[glv98]

BTW, I bet CKC wants to test her team against others like UConn in the season, makes her and her players better, and improves their SOS rankings

That just hasn't proved true the last few years. The tough early losses have hurt way more than helped. The SOS helped slightly.

Oh, and what if the LV’s win the game? Have you considered that or do you think that is impossible?

I don't think a win is likely enough to justify the damage yet another big loss would do. Future years, yes, but not yet.

And that's where we differ, I do see big downside. We have to stop digging in the loser of big games hole we are currently in. I want it to be as easy as possible for CKC to be successful, esp early on while things are coming together.

 

[Rooster1]

That just hasn't proved true the last few years. The tough early losses have hurt way more than helped. The SOS helped slightly.

I don't think a win is likely enough to justify the damage yet another big loss would do. Future years, yes, but not yet.

And that's where we differ, I do see big downside. We have to stop digging in the loser of big games hole we are currently in. I want it to be as easy as possible for CKC to be successful, esp early on while things are coming together.

Here we can disagree on friendly terms as always glv, thx for your input, I have thought on it, value your thoughts always, but I have to say I disagree politely on this one point. I don’t know the personal feelings of your new coach, I do suspect she relishes the opportunity to play Uconn, but I’m guessing. She seems like a fighter ready to take down the giants.

 

[glv98]

Here we can disagree on friendly terms as always glv, thx for your input, I have thought on it, value your thoughts always, but I have to say I disagree politely on this one point. I don’t know the personal feelings of your new coach, I do suspect she relishes the opportunity to play Uconn, but I’m guessing.

I’m sure that’s what she’ll say. Doesn’t have much choice.

 

[Rooster1]

I’m sure that’s what she’ll say. Doesn’t have much choice.

It’s a home game, and she might just show everyone, recruits included, that she can play with the big dogs even at less than full strength. That would be a good thing. A loss will not hamper her progression in year one, imo, I just don’t see downside. Her year one story will be written against her contemporaries in the SEC, not against Uconn in OOC. A chance to shock the world? Can’t be done unless you try. What a trophy it would be, has to be attempted. Legends are made so.

Look no further than Bobby Bowden early in his career, or even if I may, Dawn Staley, both with the mantra of play anyone anywhere at anytime while building their programs…(Staley scheduled Uconn and Stanford in year one and was smoked by both) ,CPS was likely just like that also. Those types seek it, the great competition. Nobody remembers their early losses against top teams, but they remember when the worm turned.

You don’t run from the competition, you run into them full steam when you know you can build it. Your coach believes she can build it. Let CKC do the same as she shows her mettle building her program going fwd. I’m thinking it’s just what she wants, she has that fire and she could be the one. Don't relegate her to cupcake schedules even before she begins, let her build and grow fast by learning early. Let her be a Bobby Bowden..

Metal sharpens metal. Uconn be damned, go for it. DW is going to give her time to build, he hired her, let her get started fast by playing the best and shorten her learning curve. The faster the better if she is the one.

 

[madtownvol]

It’s a home game, and she might just show everyone, recruits included, that she can play with the big dogs even at less than full strength. That would be a good thing. A loss will not hamper her progression in year one, imo, I just don’t see downside. Her year one story will be written against her contemporaries in the SEC, not against Uconn in OOC. A chance to shock the world? Can’t be done unless you try. What a trophy it would be, has to be attempted. Legends are made so.

Look no further than Bobby Bowden early in his career, or even if I may, Dawn Staley, both with the mantra of play anyone anywhere at anytime while building their programs…(Staley scheduled Uconn and Stanford in year one and was smoked by both) ,CPS was likely just like that also. Those types seek it, the great competition. Nobody remembers their early losses against top teams, but they remember when the worm turned.

You don’t run from the competition, you run into them full steam when you know you can build it. Your coach believes she can build it. Let CKC do the same as she shows her mettle building her program going fwd. I’m thinking it’s just what she wants, she has that fire and she could be the one. Don't relegate her to cupcake schedules even before she begins, let her build and grow fast by learning early. Let her be a Bobby Bowden..

Metal sharpens metal. Uconn be damned, go for it. DW is going to give her time to build, he hired her, let her get started fast by playing the best and shorten her learning curve. The faster the better if she is the one.

If one metal is steel and the other is aluminum, there is not much sharpening only dismantling.

As the podcast posted on another thread highlights, Uconn is stacked with 5 star ranked talent, at least one superstar player, and the best freshman recruit in the country whereas the LVs have a bunch of players who are going to achieve much higher than they have at any point in their career. If the LVs make a game of it (sorry moral victory crowd), that would be a big positive but a blowout does not help matters. Having said that, this game is a flashy media event but the substance will be the conference schedule. Let's imagine a hypothetical world where the LVs pull off the miracle upset and beat Uconn but then have a losing record in conference and miss the tournament. The narrative around the program would not be great.

As Cora Hall suggested the game casts a nice spotlight on the LVs history and the days when WCBB was defined by this rivalry but right now it is comparable to a nostalgia tour by over the hill rockers. It means more to the fading legion of old guard fans but not that much in the contemporary scene.

If CKC overachieves with this roster, then this game could have a marginal benefit to the program. If all the less favoravble projections pan out, this game will just be one more piece of evidence that the LVs have faded and have a long way back.

 

[gladiator06]

Agree to disagree. We are far, far from past the lovable loser image, and esp won't be if we continue to disappoint. Exactly like w Kellie, CKC is going to have to win these games by doing more w less to change the narrative.

wow...refreshing...a freethinker, who has their own opinion and continues to stand on it. only time will tell where the program stands, but right now, our position is not good. some of the same ones who thought CKH checked all boxes, now think CKC checks them all. Uconn is loaded and will likely be a blowout, and there will be other blowouts. How many blowouts does one need to break a team's morale (if they have any). Remember Kim Mulkey's schedule that everyone called "cupcake?" IMO it was clever. You give a team of kids who haven't played together an opportunity to experience winning together, vs losing a lot and blaming each other and transferring, to grow into the team you want, and also set the stage maybe, so that top recruits see you winning. The SEC will be plenty tough, don't need to prove anything else.

 

[gladiator06]

Wrong, all the glory and benefit could be to UT, no downside.

means the opposite is also true

 

[TrumpedUpVol]

Remember Kim Mulkey's schedule that everyone called "cupcake?" IMO it was clever. You give a team of kids who haven't played together and opportunity to experience winning together, vs losing a lot and blaming each other and transferring, to grow into the team you want, and also set the stage maybe, so that top recruits see you winning. The SEC will be plenty tough, don't need to prove anything else.

I get what you're saying, but the SEC being tough is precisely the reason that going from 0 to 100 when entering the SEC slate isn't a great idea (though I do recognize that UConn will likely come to Knoxville during January/February as opposed to mid-December). I'd rather see the Lady Vols play a variety of programs so Kim can accurately gauge the strengths/weeknesses of the team and adjust accordingly as opposed to playing nothing but sub-200 RPI fodder before playing South Carolina and Texas in back-to-back weeks.

LSU could get away with that schedule because they were the defending national champs and returning the core of said team plus Van Lith, while Tennessee is definitely not in the same boat.

 

[DarkPhoenix]

I get what you're saying, but the SEC being tough is precisely the reason that going from 0 to 100 when entering the SEC slate isn't a great idea (though I do recognize that UConn will likely come to Knoxville during January/February as opposed to mid-December). I'd rather see the Lady Vols play a variety of programs so Kim can accurately gauge the strengths/weeknesses of the team and adjust accordingly as opposed to playing nothing but sub-200 RPI fodder before playing South Carolina and Texas in back-to-back weeks.

LSU could get away with that schedule because they were the defending national champs and returning the core of said team plus Van Lith, while Tennessee is definitely not in the same boat.

When you’re a competitor u want to play the best teams, that’s just how players like that think.

 

[creekdipper]

There can be only one.

 

[sgacock]

I get what you're saying, but the SEC being tough is precisely the reason that going from 0 to 100 when entering the SEC slate isn't a great idea (though I do recognize that UConn will likely come to Knoxville during January/February as opposed to mid-December). I'd rather see the Lady Vols play a variety of programs so Kim can accurately gauge the strengths/weeknesses of the team and adjust accordingly as opposed to playing nothing but sub-200 RPI fodder before playing South Carolina and Texas in back-to-back weeks.

LSU could get away with that schedule because they were the defending national champs and returning the core of said team plus Van Lith, while Tennessee is definitely not in the same boat.

LSU‘s schedule was worse the year they won the championship. At least they played Colorado and VaTech this past year. They played nobody OOC their championship year

 

[glv98]

When you’re a competitor u want to play the best teams, that’s just how players like that think.

Agree to disagree. They'd say that, and it's a nice locker room wall slogan, but players are smart enough to know the building process and I doubt they appreciate a mismatch, esp early when they're trying to put things together in a new system. I don't think our players enjoyed that awful stretch against top teams in the OOC last year at all. I think mostly players want to be put in the position to win.

 

[StorrsCentral]

Agree to disagree. They'd say that, and it's a nice locker room wall slogan, but players are smart enough to know the building process and I doubt they appreciate a mismatch, esp early when they're trying to put things together in a new system. I don't think our players enjoyed that awful stretch against top teams in the OOC last year at all. I think mostly players want to be put in the position to win.

I agree that when you first take over a program with players you are unfamiliar with, you can start with some mid-majors to get the ball rolling and give the team confidence. On the other hand, as she gets her own players and gets her system running, she must go back to scheduling top talent that will challenge the team so she can see the progress that she has made. Thats why I thought it was curious when many posters criticized Shea Ralph for putting together a schedule that Vandy would have a chance to win, giving them confidence that they can be in any game they play. Ralph will also start to schedule better teams once she gets her team established, and Geno has told her that UConn would play her whenever she though the team would be ready for that challenge. I know the LV fans want to see good teams playing here, but it may take time for Kim to be ready for that. I don't know how next year will turn out, but she has to be in big time for the 25 and 26 classes. Next year will be tough as she wasn't around to recruit the top 24 players, but the next classes I'm sure is her priority at this point. That will be the real starting point for the Caldwell regime, and she must show recruiting progress starting with those classes.

 

[glv98]

I agree that when you first take over a program with players you are unfamiliar with, you can start with some mid-majors to get the ball rolling and give the team confidence. On the other hand, as she gets her own players and gets her system running, she must go back to scheduling top talent that will challenge the team so she can see the progress that she has made. Thats why I thought it was curious when many posters criticized Shea Ralph for putting together a schedule that Vandy would have a chance to win, giving them confidence that they can be in any game they play. Ralph will also start to schedule better teams once she gets her team established, and Geno has told her that UConn would play her whenever she though the team would be ready for that challenge. I know the LV fans want to see good teams playing here, but it may take time for Kim to be ready for that. I don't know how next year will turn out, but she has to be in big time for the 25 and 26 classes. Next year will be tough as she wasn't around to recruit the top 24 players, but the next classes I'm sure is her priority at this point. That will be the real starting point for the Caldwell regime, and she must show recruiting progress starting with those classes.

Agree. CKC will get a pass for what happens on the court this year, but not in recruiting. She faces the same challenge as Kellie in recruiting, which is trying to do more with less in order to be attractive to the best players.

 

[DarkPhoenix]

Agree to disagree. They'd say that, and it's a nice locker room wall slogan, but players are smart enough to know the building process and I doubt they appreciate a mismatch, esp early when they're trying to put things together in a new system. I don't think our players enjoyed that awful stretch against top teams in the OOC last year at all. I think mostly players want to be put in the position to win.

Those aren’t the players I want that are scared to play someone, I’ve never been scared to play against anyone in my entire life, even when we played older teams I expected to win and would be so mad if we loss, and I’m sure if u have a team of competitors they would feel the same way, I don’t want anyone on my team thats afraid of anyone, and we can disagree on that.