Is Peyton The GOAT

You're right! MAYBE, but not likely

Why? They lost to the eventual SB champ Ravens in 2012 on a fluke. Manning's arm was a wet noodle at the end of that game. Ravens crushed the Colts and the Pats.

Manning had a fairly good game against the Seahawks in 2013, but mounting a large comeback was impossible with his limited arm strength.

The next year's playoff loss, he threw 46 times for 211 yards against the Colts. His arm was dead by the end of the season. In the first 11 games he had a passer rating of over 110 eight times and only did 86+ one time in the last 6 games.

In 2015, they embraced his limitations and won a SB.
 
Why? They lost to the eventual SB champ Ravens in 2012 on a fluke. Manning's arm was a wet noodle at the end of that game. Ravens crushed the Colts and the Pats.

Manning had a fairly good game against the Seahawks in 2013, but mounting a large comeback was impossible with his limited arm strength.

The next year's playoff loss, he threw 46 times for 211 yards against the Colts. His arm was dead by the end of the season. In the first 11 games he had a passer rating of over 110 eight times and only did 86+ one time in the last 6 games.

In 2015, they embraced his limitations and won a SB.

:birgits_giggle:

That Super Bowl was over in the first quarter. Seattle's defense was too much for Denver's offense. Manning had the "deer in the headlight" look from the very first snap. Regardless of any stats that he might have built that day, he played poorly. Mostly because of Seattle's defense. They had no chance of coming back in that game
 
:birgits_giggle:

That Super Bowl was over in the first quarter. Seattle's defense was too much for Denver's offense. Manning had the "deer in the headlight" look from the very first snap. Regardless of any stats that he might have built that day, he played poorly. Mostly because of Seattle's defense. They had no chance of coming back in that game

Manning only made like 2 bad plays all game.

This is a joke and there are still 2 other seasons.
 
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Manning only made like 2 bad plays all game.

This is a joke and there are still 2 other seasons.

I think you and me must have watched two completely different games. There is no way anyone who is halfway informed could say Manning had a good game with a straight face. Face it. There were times in his career where the pressure got to him. You could always see it in his eyes
 
I think you and me must have watched two completely different games. There is no way anyone who is halfway informed could say Manning had a good game with a straight face. Face it. There were times in his career where the pressure got to him. You could always see it in his eyes

Why talk about othet games? Maybe because you don't have anything to support your argument. I stand by my two bad plays comment. His entire team was falling apart around him and he managed 280 yards and 69% completion against the best D ever.
 
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Well I'm sorry guys, but the players have voted Brady #1 in the league... again, at 39. I don't even know why this argument is still going on to be honest.
 
Brady never won a natty while at Michigan and Stabler never won one at Bama

Brady was the back-up to Griese when Michigan won in 1997, and Stabler won one as a backup in '65 and should have won it as the starter in in '66, they were 11-0 and crushed Nebraska in the Sugar Bowl, but they were robbed by the polls that year.
 
I'll get flamed of course, but Peyton is not the greatest to ever play the position. Top 5 easy, perhaps even top 3, but not the GOAT.
 
I think you and me must have watched two completely different games. There is no way anyone who is halfway informed could say Manning had a good game with a straight face. Face it. There were times in his career where the pressure got to him. You could always see it in his eyes

...and his body-language, especially in this game.
 
Brady, and it ain't close. Brees will surpass many of the records you posted in the next 3 years anyway, and he ain't close to Brady either.

At this point, it's a battle for number two and Manning is in the discussion with Montana... for now.
 
Brady, and it ain't close. Brees will surpass many of the records you posted in the next 3 years anyway, and he ain't close to Brady either.

At this point, it's a battle for number two and Manning is in the discussion with Montana... for now.

Brees is a first ballot HOFer, but he ain't touching any of them outside the stat sheet.

Rodgers could potentially enter the discussion at some point, but he missed out on a lot of bulk stats sitting behind Favre so long. Plus, he really needs some more hardware.

IMO Rodgers is this generation's Steve Young. Incredibly skilled and efficient, maybe even the best QB in the league when his game is on, but issues outside his control might keep him from ever even touching the GOAT discussion.

In Young's case it was an early career with the piss poor Bucs + sitting behind Montana in San Fran, which led to a relatively short prime. In Rodgers' case it has been an early career behind Favre and an organization that has let the talent level around him slip, effectively wasting a good chunk of his prime.

In response to the OP, I would say no, Manning is not the GOAT, but he is firmly in my top 3.
 
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If you add the refs, then yeah, Brady is the GOAT. But without all the help he gets, even rules named after him, then no. On talent alone. Brady is NOT the GOAT.
 
Of course Manning is the GOAT.

I've never really understood why quarterbacks are judged by different metrics than any other position in football. Football players should be judged by what they themselves accomplish on the field, and nothing more. That's the only way that makes sense. Using the "rings" argument, you can change 2-3 plays in Brady's career (or Manning's for that matter) that occurred with neither of them on the field, and that would cause some so-called pundits to elevate or demote Manning / Brady in the GOAT discussion. Which is ridiculous.

For instance, just having Vinatieri miss one of his many game winning kicks (pulling a Vanderjagt, if you will), having the Seahawks run the ball on the goal line, and having the Atlanta Falcons offense take a knee the entire second half (all events that very probably could have occurred) and you have Brady sitting at 2 rings. Sad thing is, we all know that Brady's standing in the eyes of the media as the "GOAT" would change drastically in this scenario, even though he himself would have done nothing at all differently on the football field.

Brady is obviously a great quarterback, but it is undeniable that he has gotten incredible support from his coaching staff (arguably the greatest coach of all time), front office, and supporting players who have come through clutch in big moments, time after time, with a great deal of luck thrown in for good measure. Those early 2000s Patriots defenses were just stifling, and were loaded with talent.

Manning had none of those advantages. Manning had a veritable clown car of support for many years of his career, and it's hard to pin most of his playoff losses on him after those early run-ins with the Patriots. When I think of Manning losses in the playoffs, I think about the 07 Chargers loss (INT off of Kenton Kieth's hands at the goal line + defense allowing Billy Voleck to march down the field), 08 Chargers loss (occurred in OT without Manning getting the ball), '10 Jets loss (Manning puts team up with ~1 minute left, but special teams + Caldwell timeout snatch defeat from the jaws of victory), and the '12 Ravens loss (Hail Flacco).

All of this to say, if you actually take the time to consider what both players physically accomplished on the field, it's hard to argue against Manning as the GOAT. By almost any metric (advanced or otherwise) but the "rings" argument, Manning performed better and added more value to his team than Brady.
 
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#1 HS Recruit
#1 Pick NFL Draft
Turned perennial doormat (Colts) into SB winners
Turned underachieving Broncos into SB winners
About 20 NFL records**
About 10 unbreakable NFL records
5 NFL MVPs (only 3 guys have 3)*
Had only 2 really good Defenses in 18 years (i.e., he took a lot of average to bad Ds to the playoffs)
3-1 v Belichik in Championship Games [3-2 in all playoffs]
#1 in Career Earnings -$244 million

If a guy had any one of these NFL accomplishments he's probably headed to the HOF. Manning has them ALL.

* This one alone makes him GOAT.

** (Upon 2016 retirement)
NFL career passing touchdown record: 539
Most passing yards, career: 71,940
Single season touchdown record (2013): 55
Most passing yards, season (2013): 5,477
Most wins (including playoffs): 200 [NE QB now has more]
Most games throwing for 300+ yards: 93
Most passing touchdowns in a single game (tied, 2013): 7
Most games with a passing rating higher than 105: 97
Most games with a perfect passer rating of 158.3: 5
Most seasons with 350+ completions: 10
Most games completing 80-percent passing: 19
Most game-winning drives: 56
Most comeback wins: 45
Highest completion percentage in a postseason game with 450+ yards (2005): 81.8
Highest yards-per-game, season (2013): 342.31
Most games with 4+ touchdown passes: 25
Most seasons passing for 4,000+ yards: 14
Most consecutive seasons with 25+ touchdowns: 13
One of two quarterbacks to ever beat all 32 teams (along with Brett Favre)
First quarterback to beat 31 franchises: 2007
 
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Brady was the back-up to Griese when Michigan won in 1997, and Stabler won one as a backup in '65 and should have won it as the starter in in '66, they were 11-0 and crushed Nebraska in the Sugar Bowl, but they were robbed by the polls that year.

don't worry, i'm sure 15 years later, some poll or obscure news service retroactively awarded them a national title, and they hung a banner anyway...."got 16?".
 

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