Interesting

[vol66]

Get your head outa the sand, man. You gota call it like you see it. I been a vol fan since 1971 and mens sports are at a all time low. I've been on here saying we should keep CDS, and trust me , I'm in the minority. I dont piss and moan, I state facts. So if you cant handle it dont read it. If you feel good about the directions of our mens sports, other than football(which I agree with you) then good for you. Your expectations arent very high.

66, I been talking about the summer and fall of 2011, thats when the kids left or were run off for whatever reason. Maybe you weren't as vested then as you are now. I was and remain so.

Thats good research and true.

Hey man, he was hired in June of 2011, the guys on the roster are the guys on the roster and the guys you are talking about were either on the roster or recruits in the pipe line. He may have run the three guys and not been interested in some recruits, but that's a far cry from "gutting" the roster. And when you look at what he kept...and what moved on ....that's a bare cupboard at least in my view.

 

[31VFL]

I have a feeling over the next few weeks, months and years we are going to hear some starling rumors and stories about the 2015 team that will disturbing.

Early in conference play, the Vols were the worst defensive team I've seen since seeing games at Eagleton Little League.

The last 6 weeks, they may have been the best defensive team in conference. I don't think the injuries and replacement at the time were just a coincidence.

And from what I've heard, one of my favorite players (probably out of ignorance) may have been a complete cancer or ass that no one liked and wanted to play with.

I think the guys that kept their heads up and played out the season deserve kudos. Most worked their way through early slumps and even those who struggled until the head kept chugging.

I do not believe next season's team will be as talented. I do think they will be more coachable and tough having gone through this season from hell.

It will be interesting to see the schedule when it is put together. I do not think CDS will take any chances with weather and playing teams that will put us in an offensive slump. I bet we play a weekend tourney at that facility in Georgia that will allow us to play almost regardless of weather. I bet we play in a tourney somewhere in a dome.

Which player would that be?

 

[volforlife50]

Hey man, he was hired in June of 2011, the guys on the roster are the guys on the roster and the guys you are talking about were either on the roster or recruits in the pipe line. He may have run the three guys and not been interested in some recruits, but that's a far cry from "gutting" the roster. And when you look at what he kept...and what moved on ....that's a bare cupboard at least in my view.

They were not recruits, some of them were signees that enrolled during the summer semester. Those were the kids who were drafted and would have been big for this current team. They were shown no or little interest by CDS. Probably because he had little or no time to address the situation. Your right, they probably never made the roster but they were gona be Vols in the fall. There was also a meaningful lapse of time between Raliegh firing and Serrano hiring in which all recruiting and draft retaining came to a complete stop. That also put CDS behind the recruiting 8 ball.

The guys that were on the roster which he ran off probably deserved it with the exception of Hillis. Every guy on the roster that left had SEC experience and if I remember right Blount was leading the SEC in saves when he was dismissed. Thats wasnt CDS fault but nevertheless it gutted our team.

 

[volforlife50]

I don't know about the others you mentioned, Blount was dismissed for violating team rules, it was a bummer at the time.

As for the cabinet being empty, MLB disagrees with you. The stuff you're saying happens at every school after a coaching change. I can't judge what I didn't see. The vast majority of the roster in CDS' first season was Raleigh guys, he didn't do a complete gut until year 2, or at least that's what I recall.

Freshmen and Sophomores on the 2011 Roster

Chris Fritts
Ethan Bennett
Zach Godley
Drew Steckenrider
Carter Watson
Nick Williams
Hunter Daniel
Dalton Saberhagen
Andrew Toles - dismissed by CDS
Nick Blount - dismissed by CDS
Andy Yates - played in 3 games from 2010-12, became student assistant
Hunter Mitchem - Played in 1 game, became a student assistant

Blake Berger - Santa Fe CC - Florida Gulf Coast
Jon Reed - Walters State CC - Memphis
Andy Hillis - Lee University

The last 3 are the only guys that moved on between the end of 2011 and the 2012 season. They had good careers.

Help me here, how many of these kids were drafted? How many were all- freshman or all-sec?

 

[vol66]

They were not recruits, some of them were signees that enrolled during the summer semester. Those were the kids who were drafted and would have been big for this current team. They were shown no or little interest by CDS. Probably because he had little or no time to address the situation. Your right, they probably never made the roster but they were gona be Vols in the fall. There was also a meaningful lapse of time between Raliegh firing and Serrano hiring in which all recruiting and draft retaining came to a complete stop. That also put CDS behind the recruiting 8 ball.

The guys that were on the roster which he ran off probably deserved it with the exception of Hillis. Every guy on the roster that left had SEC experience and if I remember right Blount was leading the SEC in saves when he was dismissed. Thats wasnt CDS fault but nevertheless it gutted our team.

I have accounted for every rostered player.

These are the guys you are talking about, right...

UTSPORTS.COM - University of Tennessee Athletics - Baseball

looks like to me, CDS kept most of them...and in no way can it be said that he gutted anything.

 

[vol66]

Help me here, how many of these kids were drafted? How many were all- freshman or all-sec?

Of the guys CDS retained, Steckenrider, Godley and Williams got drafted...

Toles was drafted obviously...Bennett quit playing baseball, that was a bummer...Carter Watson moved on at some point...Hunter Daniels graduated, Saberhagen graduated, great teammate....

 

[volforlife50]

I have accounted for every rostered player.

These are the guys you are talking about, right...

UTSPORTS.COM - University of Tennessee Athletics - Baseball

looks like to me, CDS kept most of them...and in no way can it be said that he gutted anything.

Ok I'll agree to disagree. Of those players you listed I think 6 were drafted, dont have an exact number on all freshman but I think maybe 4 and I think that many all sec at some point. Thats not exactly a bad group of players. Make that 7. How in the world could I forget Williams, great guy.

 

[vol66]

Ok I'll agree to disagree. Of those players you listed I think 6 were drafted, dont have an exact number on all freshman but I think maybe 4 and I think that many all sec at some point. Thats not exactly a bad group of players.

OK.

Let me try this a different way. Vandy has 3 players going in the first round of this years draft. None of them are SEC POY, that's Benny Baseball at Arky, that's how good this league is, and the class you are talking about, wouldn't they already be gone from UT?

 

[volforlife50]

OK.

Let me try this a different way. Vandy has 3 players going in the first round of this years draft. None of them are SEC POY, that's Benny Baseball at Arky, that's how good this league is, and the class you are talking about, wouldn't they already be gone from UT?

Yes your right, my bad. But you have to admit it woulda made those first 2 years you talked about a little more bearable. I think we forgot about Zack Osborne on that roster also. I quess my point is the talent that first year is not as bad as everyone thinks, just sprinkled with some bad eggs.

 

[vol66]

Yes your right, my bad. But you have to admit it woulda made those first 2 years you talked about a little more bearable. I think we forgot about Zack Osborne on that roster also. I quess my point is the talent that first year is not as bad as everyone thinks, just sprinkled with some bad eggs.

I didn't forget him, he was retained by CDS.

I sat down with a guy I consider to be much more knowledgeable about baseball talent and roster construction, upside...those sorts of things, back in 2011 and he had a lot of info about what was going on back then.

Of course, there were all the stories but one thing he said, I've never forgotten was this...Todd Raleigh thinks he can recruit around the bat change.

The same guy said, and I can't remember exactly how he put it, Corbin and these other guys value pitching, if you can't score you can't win. Raleigh is behind the curve.

I've thought about it a lot over the past few years.

 

[VolsSportsFan]

Get your head outa the sand, man. You gota call it like you see it. I been a vol fan since 1971 and mens sports are at a all time low. I've been on here saying we should keep CDS, and trust me , I'm in the minority. I dont piss and moan, I state facts. So if you cant handle it dont read it. If you feel good about the directions of our mens sports, other than football(which I agree with you) then good for you. Your expectations arent very high.

66, I been talking about the summer and fall of 2011, thats when the kids left or were run off for whatever reason. Maybe you weren't as vested then as you are now. I was and remain so.

Thats good research and true.

If you don't think we made a major upgrade in coaching in basketball and that we aren't going in a much better direction, then you're the one that needs to remove your head from "the sand".

And yes, you do piss and moan.

 

[bowlinggreenvol]

What do you mean?

I've said this before, he's followed 2 NC level coaches in his previous 2 stops and only spent 3 years at Irvine. Assuming he didn't runoff Savage's roster his upperclassmen on the CWS team were players he would've inherited. His Fullerton team went in his 2nd season and likely had upperclassmen from the CWS team 2 years before. Once again, solid talent inherited.

Fullerton has been to the CWS under 5 consecutive head coaches (Garrido's in there 2x) and it'll be 6 if they go under Vanderhook. Is that not perhaps a product of the culture of that program overall and a testament to it and not necessarily the coach? Simpler terms; is it possible Serrano simply didn't screw up a good thing that was going? And do so with others players? We don't have much of a sample size of what he does when the program is completely his.

 

[vol66]

I've said this before, he's followed 2 NC level coaches in his previous 2 stops and only spent 3 years at Irvine. Assuming he didn't runoff Savage's roster his upperclassmen on the CWS team were players he would've inherited. His Fullerton team went in his 2nd season and likely had upperclassmen from the CWS team 2 years before.

Fullerton went to the CWS under 5 consecutive head coaches (Garrido's in there 2x). Is that not perhaps a product of the culture of that program overall and a testament to it and not necessarily the coach? Simpler terms; is it possible Serrano simply didn't screw up a good thing that was going? And do so with others players? We don't have much of a sample size of what he does when the program is completely his.

It's kind of hard to fathom. For instance in 2009 he makes it to the super regional, didn't lose any games in doing so and has to face Louisville, who just eliminated Vanderbilt, beats them in two straight games, outscoring them 23-2.

His team didn't just win, he crushed them. Over the course of the whole regional his team outscored the other teams 64-11.

Your contention that he just inherited good teams and didn't screw it up, well against the best competition in the country he was calling the pitches, and Bergeron is running the offense and you can't tell me that Cal State Fullerton just had better players than Louisville and Vandy, that he just slept on the bench and the players played.

And we have four years of what it looks like when it's all his. you don't like the look of it, that's obvious.

 

[bowlinggreenvol]

It's kind of hard to fathom. For instance in 2009 he makes it to the super regional, didn't lose any games in doing so and has to face Louisville, who just eliminated Vanderbilt, beats them in two straight games, outscoring them 23-2.

His team didn't just win, he crushed them. Over the course of the whole regional his team outscored the other teams 64-11.

Your contention that he just inherited good teams and didn't screw it up, well against the best competition in the country he was calling the pitches, and Bergeron is running the offense and you can't tell me that Cal State Fullerton just had better players than Louisville and Vandy, that he just slept on the bench and the players played.

And we have four years of what it looks like when it's all his. you don't like the look of it, that's obvious.

What did he do that Garrido didn't, Horton didn't, Cochell didn't? Fullerton is in the most talent rich state in the country, has a top 5 baseball tradition and practically guarantees an Omaha trip in one's career (CDS said it himself this week). I'd argue Fullerton likely had talent on a similar level to both Vandy (who was a 3 seed that year) and UofL, they also had the experience of being there two seasons before as FR and So.

There's a middle ground between, saying he didn't screw it up, meaning his thumbprint on a program in 2 years wasn't enough to make much difference either way, and saying he rolled a ball and lineup card out there and let them go to town.

 

[vol66]

What did he do that Garrido didn't, Horton didn't, Cochell didn't? Fullerton is in the most talent rich state in the country, has a top 5 baseball tradition and practically guarantees an Omaha trip in one's career (CDS said it himself this week). I'd argue Fullerton likely had talent on a similar level to both Vandy (who was a 3 seed that year) and UofL, they also had the experience of being there two seasons before as FR and So.

There's a middle ground between, saying he didn't screw it up, meaning his thumbprint on a program in 2 years wasn't enough to make much difference either way, and saying he rolled a ball and lineup card out there and let them go to town.

I think we both would agree the most difficult thing Coach Serrano was going to have to do when he got this job is recruit.

I agree with you, he could throw a donut out of his car at 60 MPH and a D1 recruit would probably catch it out there.

This is not that, it never has been and it never will be.

I also agree that, at the time, compared to Holbrook, who wasn't really interested and knew he would get the job when Tanner retired, and a guy like Burke, no resume at all, that it was a no brainer to hire Serrano.

To this point, it has not worked out. There. I said it.

Let's see what the board can bring in terms of realistic names...I'll keep up a lookout...while I turn my attention to summer ball.

 

[volforlife50]

If you don't think we made a major upgrade in coaching in basketball and that we aren't going in a much better direction, then you're the one that needs to remove your head from "the sand".

And yes, you do piss and moan.

Wow, I guess i'll have to take your word thats its an upgrade. I really dont know and I never said it wasn't. Obviously you dont like the direction our baseball program is going. So now that I've pissed and moaned I'll let you continue to show your ignorance. :snoring:

 

[volforlife50]

I think we both would agree the most difficult thing Coach Serrano was going to have to do when he got this job is recruit.

I agree with you, he could throw a donut out of his car at 60 MPH and a D1 recruit would probably catch it out there.

This is not that, it never has been and it never will be.

I also agree that, at the time, compared to Holbrook, who wasn't really interested and knew he would get the job when Tanner retired, and a guy like Burke, no resume at all, that it was a no brainer to hire Serrano.

To this point, it has not worked out. There. I said it.

Let's see what the board can bring in terms of realistic names...I'll keep up a lookout...while I turn my attention to summer ball.

Its going to work out. CDS is a good person. Good things happen to good people. If you haven't met him you should try. Patience people , patience. Its a non revenue sport, filling seats is not a priority like football and basketball.

 

[bowlinggreenvol]

I think we both would agree the most difficult thing Coach Serrano was going to have to do when he got this job is recruit.

I agree with you, he could throw a donut out of his car at 60 MPH and a D1 recruit would probably catch it out there.

This is not that, it never has been and it never will be.

I also agree that, at the time, compared to Holbrook, who wasn't really interested and knew he would get the job when Tanner retired, and a guy like Burke, no resume at all, that it was a no brainer to hire Serrano.

To this point, it has not worked out. There. I said it.

Let's see what the board can bring in terms of realistic names...I'll keep up a lookout...while I turn my attention to summer ball.

He had the best resume bar none, outside of McDonnell who we MIGHT have had a shot at, at the time. I don't know on paper, how we could've done any better at the time.

My opinion of Serrano today isn't what it was 4 years ago. As I look more into the UCI program rebuilding process before him and see what Savage has done at UCLA since, it jades my opinion of Serrano some. I was well aware of the Fullerton success, but didn't realize that EVERY coach in their program's history has been to a CWS, except the current one and they've never had a losing season. Those are two unbelievable feats.

Today, I'm cautiously optimistic he can turn it around. 4 years ago, I was overwhelmingly convinced he could, would and do so relatively quickly.

 

[vol66]

He had the best resume bar none, outside of McDonnell who we MIGHT have had a shot at, at the time. I don't know on paper, how we could've done any better at the time.

My opinion of Serrano today isn't what it was 4 years ago. As I look more into the UCI program rebuilding process before him and see what Savage has done at UCLA since, it jades my opinion of Serrano some. I was well aware of the Fullerton success, but didn't realize that EVERY coach in their program's history has been to a CWS, except the current one and they've never had a losing season. Those are two unbelievable feats.

Today, I'm cautiously optimistic he can turn it around. 4 years ago, I was overwhelmingly convinced he could, would and do so relatively quickly.

I just want to be competitive. I want to enjoy the game, I don't need the Vols to win to enjoy a game. I would have liked to win the game versus Arkansas, but I can appreciate what Killian and Jackson did. I appreciate what our pitching staff did to the SEC POY. I think we're closer to being where we want to be, but I understand it's not fast enough for some.

 

[bowlinggreenvol]

I just want to be competitive. I want to enjoy the game, I don't need the Vols to win to enjoy a game. I would have liked to win the game versus Arkansas, but I can appreciate what Killian and Jackson did. I appreciate what our pitching staff did to the SEC POY. I think we're closer to being where we want to be, but I understand it's not fast enough for some.

I've said all along I'm content with being a middle of the pack program that reaches regionals with a surprise season sprinkled in, much like we were under CRD. If we're recruiting at 7-8 SEC level then I expect to be that, not 12-14. If we're doing what Gaspard or Bianchi have done at Bama and OM every year I don't think many would complain. .500 league record, 35-22 type seasons and fairly consistent regional births and we can all be happy (hopefully).

 

[vol66]

I've said all along I'm content with being a middle of the pack program that reaches regionals with a surprise season sprinkled in, much like we were under CRD. If we're recruiting at 7-8 SEC level then I expect to be that, not 12-14. If we're doing what Gaspard or Bianchi have done at Bama and OM every year I don't think many would complain. .500 league record, 35-22 type seasons and fairly consistent regional births and we can all be happy (hopefully).

I think we're capable of more than that. I think CDS is capable of more than that. I think this team was capable of more than that.

I would venture to say that the fans in South Carolina, at Mississippi State, at Georgia all think they are more capable. But... this stuff happens in baseball and again, the injuries to the pitchers...I'm just blown away by the lack of empathy there.

 

[vol66]

Latest BA Mock Draft...

MLB Mock Draft 2015: Version 3.0 - BaseballAmerica.com

 

[VolsSportsFan]

Wow, I guess i'll have to take your word thats its an upgrade. I really dont know and I never said it wasn't. Obviously you dont like the direction our baseball program is going. So now that I've pissed and moaned I'll let you continue to show your ignorance. :snoring:

And I'll let you continue to be a cynical troll. Long live the ignore list.

 

[OldTimer]

I've enjoyed the bantering and all make valid points regarding the program past, present, and future. Bottom line is change is coming for the good soon and hopefully Plan B will work.....I still think CDS is the right person at UT and the most important part is he wants to be here.

 

[volforlife50]

I've enjoyed the bantering and all make valid points regarding the program past, present, and future. Bottom line is change is coming for the good soon and hopefully Plan B will work.....I still think CDS is the right person at UT and the most important part is he wants to be here.

Well said. I would like to add that every vol baseball fan should thank 66 for his passion towards the program. Thanks 66, keep fighting the fight.