'16 Turkey C Omer Yurtseven

#326
#326
buzz4tennessee said:
I'm ready to hear all of your pluses to show why he should be considered for HOF honors. I guess that you believe he is more worthy than Ray Mears, who still has not made it.
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Barnes is 1st ballot HOF because of his accomplishments in the NCAAT and his W/L record while competing in the three best basketball conferences over his career... he didn't ever pad his record as the big fish in small ponds. Mears isn't in because he coached when making the NIT was as big of an accomplishment in his era as making it to the 2nd weekend of the NCAAT (Sweet16) is today. Those with votes don't know their asses from gopher holes and only know of Mears as Ernie and Bernie's coach and not the guy that went .500 versus KY and their legendary coach Adolph.
 
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#327
#327
It's extremely weird seeing someone so obsessed with a coach that only coached at UT for less than a year. He has to be related or something, or maybe he's just a chubby chaser? We'll never know...
 
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#328
#328
Thunder Good-Oil said:
Barnes is 1st ballot HOF because of his accomplishments in the NCAAT and his W/L record while competing in the three best basketball conferences over his career... he didn't ever pad his record as the big fish in small ponds. Mears isn't in because he coached when making the NIT was as big of an accomplishment in his era as making it to the 2nd weekend of the NCAAT (Sweet16) is today. Those with votes don't know their asses from gopher holes and only know of Mears as Ernie and Bernie's coach and not the guy that went .500 versus KY and their legendary coach Adolph.
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True statement!

I cannot see Barnes being a peer of John Wooden, Dean Smith, Coach K, Adolf Rupp, or numerous others like them. Getting to the NCAA tournament these days for a power 5 school is not a big deal compared to getting to the NCAAs in Mears day. Only teams that won their conference championships in the biggest conferences in America gained that elite group.

When Rick was at Texas he didn't have any more competition to be one of the four or five invitees from the conferences that UTA was in than Mears had to finish number 2 in the SEC. There was no conference tourney then or he may have had us in several times.

The tournament championship that Providence won under Barnes marks the only one he has ever won. In 29 years, he has only won one regular season championship outright and has shared 2 others. If he makes it to the HOF, it is my contention that it will all be politics...just like when Charles Woodson got the Heisman instead of Peyton.
 
#329
#329
buzz4tennessee said:
True statement!

I cannot see Barnes being a peer of John Wooden, Dean Smith, Coach K, Adolf Rupp, or numerous others like them. Getting to the NCAA tournament these days for a power 5 school is not a big deal compared to getting to the NCAAs in Mears day. Only teams that won their conference championships in the biggest conferences in America gained that elite group.

When Rick was at Texas he didn't have any more competition to be one of the four or five invitees from the conferences that UTA was in than Mears had to finish number 2 in the SEC. There was no conference tourney then or he may have had us in several times.

The tournament championship that Providence won under Barnes marks the only one he has ever won. In 29 years, he has only won one regular season championship outright and has shared 2 others. If he makes it to the HOF, it is my contention that it will all be politics...just like when Charles Woodson got the Heisman instead of Peyton.
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There are not numerous other coaches like Wooden, Rupp, K, and Dean Smith. In fact there are hardly any. Bobby Knight... Izzo... That's probably about it this side of Rupp.

I'm sure that the HOFs are loaded with lesser coaches than CRB.
 
#330
#330
buzz4tennessee said:
The only success that I have seen from CRB leaves me with the impression that he is overrated, even though some here have a budding love affair with mediocrity.
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That didn't really address any of what I had to say. Actually, it only furthers the idea that you have an ax to grind with Barnes (seemingly because he isn't Donnie Tyndall) because you once again minimize his successes, or outright ignore them in this case.

Rick Barnes was 108-76 (.587) in his first 6 seasons as a D1 head coach, mostly spent in the Big East, with two NCAA Tournament appearances.

Donnie Tyndall was 114-84 (.576) in his first six seasons as a D1 head coach, all in the OVC, with two NCAA Tournament appearances.

Pretty even comparison of modest, early career success, but it's what they did next that will forever separate them in the annals of college basketball history. We know how the next several years went for both coaches, though you remain unimpressed with what Barnes did at Clemson (3 NCAA appearances and a Sweet 16) and Texas (16 NCAAs, 5 Sweet 16s, 3 Elite 8s and a Final Four appearance) where he basically put them on the national landscape. All the while, you find little trouble extolling the virtues of Donnie Tyndall's miracle-working in Hattiesburg under the guise of NCAA compliance.

Do you really not see the one-sided appearance of your argument?
 
#331
#331
cncchris33 said:
That didn't really address any of what I had to say. Actually, it only furthers the idea that you have an ax to grind with Barnes (seemingly because he isn't Donnie Tyndall) because you once again minimize his successes, or outright ignore them in this case.

Rick Barnes was 108-76 (.587) in his first 6 seasons as a D1 head coach, mostly spent in the Big East, with two NCAA Tournament appearances.

Donnie Tyndall was 114-84 (.576) in his first six seasons as a D1 head coach, all in the OVC, with two NCAA Tournament appearances.

Pretty even comparison of modest, early career success, but it's what they did next that will forever separate them in the annals of college basketball history. We know how the next several years went for both coaches, though you remain unimpressed with what Barnes did at Clemson (3 NCAA appearances and a Sweet 16) and Texas (16 NCAAs, 5 Sweet 16s, 3 Elite 8s and a Final Four appearance) where he basically put them on the national landscape. All the while, you find little trouble extolling the virtues of Donnie Tyndall's miracle-working in Hattiesburg under the guise of NCAA compliance.

Do you really not see the one-sided appearance of your argument?
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What had Barnes done this decade? He is cashing out at Tennessee. Texas wasn't stupid enough to fall for it.
 
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#332
#332
Defaultuser said:
What had Barnes done this decade? He is cashing out at Tennessee. Texas wasn't stupid enough to fall for it.
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Barnes has taken his teams to 19 of the last 21 NCAATs. Who are the other coaches that have done that? Shaka had gone to 5 of 6 NCAATs when he was hired by Texas. Two one and dones and two two and dones after taking VCU to a FF in his second year.
 
#333
#333
Thunder Good-Oil said:
There are not numerous other coaches like Wooden, Rupp, K, and Dean Smith. In fact there are hardly any. Bobby Knight... Izzo... That's probably about it this side of Rupp.

I'm sure that the HOFs are loaded with lesser coaches than CRB.
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Can you name a HOF coach of recent vintage(last 30 years) who has not won a single national championship. I think this would be a pre-requisite to making the list. There are plenty of coaches who have had multiple trips to the NCAAs that are not on the list and will never be on the list.

Please add Al McGuire, Jim Calhoun, Jim Boeheim, Roy Williams, Jim Valvano, Guy Lewis, Jay Wright, John Calipari, Billy Donovan, and the list goes on. Many who have had a more sterling record than Rick Barnes. If Barnes has many more seasons like the last one, then he will be rocking away.
 
#334
#334
buzz4tennessee said:
Can you name a HOF coach of recent vintage(last 30 years) who has not won a single national championship. I think this would be a pre-requisite to making the list. There are plenty of coaches who have had multiple trips to the NCAAs that are not on the list and will never be on the list.

Please add Al McGuire, Jim Calhoun, Jim Boeheim, Roy Williams, Jim Valvano, Guy Lewis, Jay Wright, John Calipari, Billy Donovan, and the list goes on. Many who have had a more sterling record than Rick Barnes. If Barnes has many more seasons like the last one, then he will be rocking away.
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I suppose if Barnes would have been in the 2016 NCAAT it would been because he had Coach Butterbean's recruits.
 
#335
#335
buzz4tennessee said:
Can you name a HOF coach of recent vintage(last 30 years) who has not won a single national championship. I think this would be a pre-requisite to making the list. There are plenty of coaches who have had multiple trips to the NCAAs that are not on the list and will never be on the list.
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Lou Carnesecca, Guy Lewis, Gene Keady, Dale Brown, Lefty Dreisel... all are HOFers without Nattys.
 
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#338
#338
Defaultuser said:
What had Barnes done this decade? He is cashing out at Tennessee. Texas wasn't stupid enough to fall for it.
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I'd suggest you understand the context of my post before commenting. I'm not going to bat for Barnes, I wasn't a big fan of the hire to bring him here, and I'm not overly impressed with what he's done to this point.

Buzz is a huuuge Donnie Tyndall fan and is quick to note every time he farts and it doesn't smell, and then calls it a lifetime achievement. Yet, he minimizes or entirely ignores the career's worth of achievements Barnes had at Clemson and Texas.

The discussion between the two of us revolved around the careers of two coaches and the different set of standards he seemingly has for both, and not an attempt to defend Rick Barnes' current ability to coach.

Like I said, I wasn't a big fan of the hire, but I'm not actively denigrating his entire career or cheering for his failure so I can wring my hands and say "I told you so!".
 
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#340
#340
buzz4tennessee said:
Can you name a HOF coach of recent vintage(last 30 years) who has not won a single national championship. I think this would be a pre-requisite to making the list. There are plenty of coaches who have had multiple trips to the NCAAs that are not on the list and will never be on the list.

Please add Al McGuire, Jim Calhoun, Jim Boeheim, Roy Williams, Jim Valvano, Guy Lewis, Jay Wright, John Calipari, Billy Donovan, and the list goes on. Many who have had a more sterling record than Rick Barnes. If Barnes has many more seasons like the last one, then he will be rocking away.
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The way you talk about him, you'd think Tyndall was a HoFer.
 
#341
#341
cncchris33 said:
Somewhat ironic that you hold Barnes to this high standard with no regard for his former success (only pointing out his shortcomings and qualifying his successes), yet continue to make every excuse under the sun for a coach who put together a similarly bad product on the court in 1 year, and was an equally bad cheater off of it.

When Tyndall's name is brought up, do you feel uncontrollably compelled to defend his character? Are you that invested in his career and life that you must make it your personal crusade to defend him to the death?

Why can't you just cheer for Tennessee, regardless of coach, and let your Donnie Tyndall love affair go? It's no different than the people who clung to Bruce Pearl for years after he was fired. Are you a University of Tennessee fan, or a University of Donnie Tyndall fan?

I say all this as someone who isn't the biggest fan of Rick Barnes or Tyndall, but I can be objective when discussing them.
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It's Donnie himself in disguise.
 
#345
#345
Thunder Good-Oil said:
I suppose if Barnes would have been in the 2016 NCAAT it would been because he had Coach Butterbean's recruits.
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Had it not been for Adam Howard, Barnes would not have been coaching in 2016 and Donnie would have taken us to the NCAAs and maybe even have won them. Just think how great it would be to have a coach that can recruit as well as coach. Different than having a gym teacher...that's for sure!
 
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#347
#347
buzz4tennessee said:
Had it not been for Adam Howard, Barnes would not have been coaching in 2016 and Donnie would have taken us to the NCAAs and maybe even have won them. Just think how great it would be to have a coach that can recruit as well as coach. Different than having a gym teacher...that's for sure!
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Here is what Donnie Tyndall had to say about Adam Howard...

"Adam has been with me for each of the last five years," Tyndall said. "He's a young, ambitious, tireless worker. He reminds me of myself at that same stage in my career. He eats, sleeps and drinks basketball."

Do you really believe a young assistant coach who had only ever worked for Donnie Tyndall and probably had very few, if any other contacts in the coaching profession, would just roll on Tyndall and lie about a bunch of stuff to implicate him? And do you think he'd have committed any of the actions he was directly responsible for without the head coach's knowledge? Doesn't that strike you as just a little naive and sensational?
 
#348
#348
cncchris33 said:
Here is what Donnie Tyndall had to say about Adam Howard...

"Adam has been with me for each of the last five years," Tyndall said. "He's a young, ambitious, tireless worker. He reminds me of myself at that same stage in my career. He eats, sleeps and drinks basketball."

Do you really believe a young assistant coach who had only ever worked for Donnie Tyndall and probably had very few, if any other contacts in the coaching profession, would just roll on Tyndall and lie about a bunch of stuff to implicate him? And do you think he'd have committed any of the actions he was directly responsible for without the head coach's knowledge? Doesn't that strike you as just a little naive and sensational?
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Adam Howard learned it all from Dirty Donnie
 
#349
#349
Laughing about the NCAAs screwing over UT? Keep on laughing and the NCAA will continue to screw us over. Donnie should have gotten a 9 game suspension...PERIOD!

Oh, and Barnes still can't coach. He just tosses out the basketballs like a middle school gym teacher.
 
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