Would Pruitt replace Saban?

#102
#102
Gandalf said:
These are silly arguments. Dabo gets the first call. If he has any sense he stays put. If Pruitt is doing well, he might get the next call. If its within the next 2 years, then sure, he probably goes for $7M a year. If its 2022 and he won SECE in 2021, I am not so sure he goes anywhere. At that point, Fulmer will gladly pony up $7m a year to keep him and I think Pruitt will be "full TN" by then, its not like we are Rutgers or UCLA. He can feel the cultural pull to establish his own dynasty here like Dabo has done for Clemson.

It might be attractive to Dabo because he has already established a dynasty, whereas Pruitt has yet to prove up a first one. No sense in going after Saban. Only Dabo could do that and remain his own man because he had already proven it elsewhere first. Pruitt goes and win or fail, he gets no credit.

I think Pruitt will roll with whatever hand is dealt but is most likely to see his best interest in proving that he can create a dynasty here before going back to save the bubbas. Now if they got a lackluster replacement and after 5-6 more years, Pruitt had been dominating with 2-3 NC appearances? Maybe then just to show he too could do it anywhere - and the bubbas would be more ready for him then. As it is, Saban is a hard man to follow.
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I've always thought of it the opposite way - I think Dabo would be unlikely to follow Saban at this point precisely because he's already created something on his own. Clemson would match any offer Alabama made him (i.e., money gets taken out of the equation) and I don't know why he'd leave a place where he's already a god and has an easier path to the playoff. Now that Dabo has established a power at his school, it would make no sense whatsoever for him to leave there, unless his heartstrings got tugged too much from the phone call from "momma."

If Pruitt hasn't set up a dynasty here yet and Alabama came calling, they'd throw more money at him than Tennessee would, and he'd get a chance to come home. It'd be a very powerful call.
 
#103
#103
Iam4utalways said:
Forever? That’s a long time.

I don’t expect The Alabama State legislators to pass a law that would put Alabama football at a disadvantage. The folks in politics like getting re-elected too much.

We are still talking about Alabama Administrators? I would bet good money they will keep funding football.
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Also, there is still massive amounts of $$$$ coming from SEC network, bowl revenues, and branded fan gear. Coaching salaries are not totally subsidized by legislators even if the accounting shows salaries out of the general fund. I think high paid coaches are here to stay. I just wish there wasn’t this massive golden parachute of buyouts. If I knew I could retire in the lap of luxury by screwing up at my job......well, there would be a temptation (said the man who has lived paycheck to paycheck for 45 yrs and has two college grads to show for it). There is just something fundamentally wrong with that business model. I’ve always felt buyouts should be tied to performance somehow.
 
#105
#105
VolForLife83 said:
Not as meaty as I would have liked. But it's something we've all wondered a time or two.

How Jeremy Pruitt reportedly feels about replacing Nick Saban down the road
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All jobs are thankless in college football now especially at programs that have success for 12 yrs like Bama under Saban. Pruitt will see how thankless Vol fans are with anymore excuseless losses like last year. Hard to look back and think we should have been 10-3 realistically. He got 1 get out of jail card now so it's win or get moved out. UT is also a thankless job if you are not producing!
 
#106
#106
I honestly don't think this will be something we have to worry about for a decade plus. I think they'll have to drag Saban's corpse off the sidelines in Tuscaloosa. He strikes me as a lifer, like he still needs to be coaching. We'll see.
 
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#107
#107
tennesseeduke said:
All jobs are thankless in college football now especially at programs that have success for 12 yrs like Bama under Saban. Pruitt will see how thankless Vol fans are with anymore excuseless losses like last year. Hard to look back and think we should have been 10-3 realistically. He got 1 get out of jail card now so it's win or get moved out. UT is also a thankless job if you are not producing!
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Any job is thankless if you don't hit expectations. At Alabama, the expectations are just insanely high - post-Saban, if you go a couple years without winning a national title, they'll start chirping.

They will say until they are blue in the face that they know nobody will ever be as good as Saban, but watch how they treat the next coach, and watch to see how they behave if that new coach goes a couple years without an SEC or national title. They'll be pretty angry and start talking about looking for another coach.
 
#108
#108
Being "the guy" after "The Guy" is never easy. And while $ makes it much more appealing it can also cost you on the back end if you are a younger coach and it doesn't work.

For a somewhat similar comparison (biggest difference being one left a head gig to come home, the other was promoted already being there) is Holly Warlick.

Holly won 72% of her games and 70% of her conference games.
She wasn't bad by any stretch. She just wasn't remotely as good as Pat.
What Pat did was change the standard.

Pruitt could go to Bama after Saban and average 10 wins a year an be considered a failure if that didn't include an NC (appearance at worse) and a SEC ring in the first 3 or 4 years. Saban changed the standard.

With Saban and Summitt types its much easier being "the guy after the first guy".

Unless UT isn't taking care of Pruitt financially and making sure what he needs to succeed is being properly funded. Its not a simple decision.
 
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#109
#109
Nasavol said:
I will say this, if a coach doesn’t want to follow a legend because he is afraid of failing, you have the wrong coach to start with.
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I like the way you think. However some of it doesn’t have a thing to do with the size of a coaches cojones, rather the expectations of the spoiled and entitled fan base. Ray Perkins was hand picked by the Bear. Probably was the kind of guy you speak of. Didn’t work out for him.

I have lived in Alabama most of my life. (1960 onwards). As a youth, the Bear was my nemesis. Between the Bear and Saban, I’ve seen Bama coaches come and go. They had a really bad run in the 90’s (even with a natty in there). They show Stallings the door, then the 3 Mikes rolled in (Price,Shula,Dubose). The problem at “the capstone” during that era was that there were plenty of Bear alumni (VFL equivalents) backseat driving on the coaching direction, and probably the most vocal was Bear Bryant ,Jr. A most difficult coaching environment existed and the program floundered.

On thing Saban cured Bama of was this. He told all those backseat drivers to kiss off and they finally had someone in there with the resume who could pull that off.

So just to be clear- the “follow the legend” effect may not JUST be the next coach. The ripple could go several coaches down the line.
 
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#111
#111
Nasavol said:
I will say this, if a coach doesn’t want to follow a legend because he is afraid of failing, you have the wrong coach to start with.
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I think some of the comments here are driven by a little naivete and orange-colored glasses. Money matters. Money might not have 100% to do with something that happens, but it never has nothing to do with something that happens. It's always a factor to a certain extent, and if somebody tells you that it isn't, they probably aren't being straight with you.

Does Pruitt want to go to Alabama just to fail? No. But if you think he'd absolutely turn down what in all likelihood would be a massive raise to go home and coach his alma mater's football team because he's afraid it might not work out, or he wants to build a legacy of his own here, or because he doesn't want to be in Saban's shadow, I think you're either naive or you've got your orange-colored glasses on.
 
#112
#112
05_never_again said:
At this point, no, Pruitt has won nowhere near enough for them. If Saban retired tomorrow, Pruitt would be waaaaay down their list. However, if Saban retires a few years from now and Tennessee has won an SEC title, he's probably their coach (assuming both Dabo and Kirby tell Alabama no, which I think they would). I think Alabama would still seriously consider Pruitt with only an East title.
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I agree. Let's hope bama wants him in 3 years. Also, it makes sense bc bama would want him now as their dc. So if he does win, he could. I really hope bama is after him after saban leaves.
 
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#113
#113
Nasavol said:
It’s partially an ego thing, it’s why successful college coaches go to the NFL, to prove that they are that good. It’s also why most fail at it, they aren’t flexible and try and fit their process in whole to a totally different dynamic. Pete Carroll and Jimmie Johnson are the exceptions rather than the rule. And it was Carroll’s second go around with the pros.
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Actually, for Pete Carroll the Seahawks and NFL success was his 3rd go around. Jets then 1 (or maybe 2) years with the 49ers, then USC before moving on to the Seahawks.

The Vol homer in me wants to think that if Pruitt truly built something back up in Knoxville that he would stay and see it through. Alabama would be extremely tough to turn down. I would hope that his desire to build his own dynasty would overcome the pull of Bama.

I think that time is own UTs side, though. He would need huge success in the next couple years for them to come calling. I personally think Saban is 2-3 years away from calling it quits.
 
#115
#115
Nasavol said:
It’s partially an ego thing, it’s why successful college coaches go to the NFL, to prove that they are that good. It’s also why most fail at it, they aren’t flexible and try and fit their process in whole to a totally different dynamic. Pete Carroll and Jimmie Johnson are the exceptions rather than the rule. And it was Carroll’s second go around with the pros.
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I don't think you'll see as much of that going forward outside of unique circumstances. The salaries today for top NFL coaches and top college coaches are basically the same. That wasn't the case when Jimmy Johnson left Miami for the Cowboys, Spurrier left Florida for the Redskins, or Saban left LSU for the Dolphins. They got significant raises to take those jobs. Was it about ego? Yes, partially, but it was also a lot about money.

Carroll went back to the NFL largely to escape an NCAA hammer that was going to come down on USC and probalby issue him a show cause penalty. If that happened, he almost surely would have been fired. Same deal with Chip Kelly leaving Oregon - he was issued an NCAA show cause and might have been fired if he didn't leave for Philly.
 
#116
#116
Pruitt wins the SEC and goes to the playoffs in the next 3 years, he is going to be a top candidate. He's a Bama player from Alabama who also coached most of his career, high school and college, in ALABAMA! He ain't scared of the pressure. He would also have confidence by then from winning HERE. Plus I think we are beginning to see the decline of Bama. Over the next 3-5 years, as Georgia, Florida, Auburn, Ole Miss, and of course TENNESSEE rise up. Plus I think we start seeing more Oklahoma, Oregon, Clemson, Ohio State power struggles in the CFP. The top is gonna be real crowded and margin for error very small.
 
#117
#117
Remy said:
You've been around as have I. Seen it a million times, there's just no way the person following a legend does as well or better than the legend. CJP knows that as well. someone else will follow Saban at Bama besides Dabo and CJP.
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I agree with that as well. I really don't see a scenario where either of those two take that job. I just HOPE they want CJP because, of course, that means he's been rocking it at a high level here. I know coaching is a business and attachments don't usually run as deep as we fans think but CJP seems to really be embracing the Vols program and "owning" it. Hopefully he'll love it too much to leave. And it will be virtually impossible for ANYONE to be as successful as CNS has been.
 
#119
#119
The key here is "how do you replace a god" The first situation that comes to mind Is our own Pat, the second is UCLA's Wooden, then Bama's Bear, Fla's "ole coach" Fla St's Bowden the list can go on and on. Following a god is really tough. (to more from the past Grambling's Eddie Robinson, Tenn. St.'s John Merritt neither program has recovered. I know things have changed for both schools socially. But the change was underway before they hung it up and they were still producing winners)
 
#120
#120
I agree whole heartedly. You won't find a more avid football junkie than Jeremy Pruitt. This project is his beautiful baby; one that's just beginning to mature and make papa proud. He's just as equally fatherish with his players and associates. Also, as long as CPF is manning the helm as AD, I can't see CJP budging. Therein, however, lies the caveat. The current chemistry of our football gurus has no equal. Replace Phil and all bets are off.

For the near future ... at least ... the only way Pruitt may replace Saban is as the next cfb coaching legend. Yes?
 
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#121
#121
VolForLife83 said:
Not as meaty as I would have liked. But it's something we've all wondered a time or two.

How Jeremy Pruitt reportedly feels about replacing Nick Saban down the road
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I'm not sure Bama would offer CJP the job. Some of the Gumps' mindsets would be "he's Tennessee's head coach and was hired by Phil (they're still pi$$ed at Fulmer for turning in their cheating a$$es and going 11-5 against 'em).

There's plenty of examples out there where coaches stay at their new university and turn into a "legend." Dooley never went back to Auburn; Dye never went back to Georgia. You could argue both are the greatest at either school.
 
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#122
#122
Volinnooga said:
I believe he would go. I think Dabo would be first on the wish list, but I do not think he would leave Clemson under current conditions. If Pruitt does well at Tennessee, he'd been on the wish list too. If offered the job, I think he would have to go. If he turned them down, I doubt he gets another opportunity there and it's his home state and his alma mater. I can't see him turning down the opportunity.
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Gotta disagree. For Pruitt to be considered for the Bama job, he'd first have to win big at Tennessee. If he does that, wins big and brings Tennessee back to national prominence, why leave the powerhouse program he built to go work in Saban's shadow? I think sometimes we (fans) make more of the alma mater issue than coaches do.
 
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#123
#123
SLODAWG said:
Gotta disagree. For Pruitt to be considered for the Bama job, he'd first have to win big at Tennessee. If he does that, wins big and brings Tennessee back to national prominence, why leave the powerhouse program he built to go work in Saban's shadow? I think sometimes we (fans) make more of the alma mater issue than coaches do.
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Agree with these comments...........
 
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#124
#124
ptcarter said:
Also, there is still massive amounts of $$$$ coming from SEC network, bowl revenues, and branded fan gear. Coaching salaries are not totally subsidized by legislators even if the accounting shows salaries out of the general fund. I think high paid coaches are here to stay. I just wish there wasn’t this massive golden parachute of buyouts. If I knew I could retire in the lap of luxury by screwing up at my job......well, there would be a temptation (said the man who has lived paycheck to paycheck for 45 yrs and has two college grads to show for it). There is just something fundamentally wrong with that business model. I’ve always felt buyouts should be tied to performance somehow.
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Too much luck involved in football to base the buyout on wins and losses. When a coach “losses the team”(Try to define that in a Multi Million $ contract.) there should be a way to adjust the buyout.
 
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