What'll Fix 3rd Down D?

#27
#27
As most have said, it's talent and depth. Our D plays hard, but they can't handle running QBs and wear down. I also wonder if we aren't blitzing because we can't cover if we send more than 4 and will get beat over the top of we do. It seems like we hardly ever blitz and there has to be a reason for it.
 
#28
#28
madbamahater said:
What can be done from a schematic standpoint to help get the Vols off the field on 3rd down for what? Whether it's 3rd and short or 3rd and long, the defensive woes are a chronic issue. For every 3rd down converted is a drive extended and one more play they have to defend.

The offense keeping the ball for longer periods of time will help with time of possession and limit the amount of snaps by opponents. This may be something that never gets better with a coach so offensive minded, the defense suffers always.....

......see Big 12 / Pack 12 historically....
Click to expand...
Better players. It’s not like we don’t ever have players in a position to make a stop.
It’s just 1 juke step by a RB or mobile QB and they wiff 9 times out of 10.
 
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#29
#29
We've never had a good group of linebackers.

Got an even tougher game coming up in a few weeks.
 
#30
#30
madbamahater said:
What can be done from a schematic standpoint to help get the Vols off the field on 3rd down for what? Whether it's 3rd and short or 3rd and long, the defensive woes are a chronic issue. For every 3rd down converted is a drive extended and one more play they have to defend.

The offense keeping the ball for longer periods of time will help with time of possession and limit the amount of snaps by opponents. This may be something that never gets better with a coach so offensive minded, the defense suffers always.....

......see Big 12 / Pack 12 historically....
Click to expand...

It will get better going forward for at least this season because most of the plays I think you are referencing were made by three Heisman candidates, Kenny Pickett -Pittsburg, Matt Corral – Mississippi, Bryce Young - Alabama. We will not face another QB anywhere near as good as these three. JMHO
 
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#32
#32
madbamahater said:
What can be done from a schematic standpoint to help get the Vols off the field on 3rd down for what? Whether it's 3rd and short or 3rd and long, the defensive woes are a chronic issue. For every 3rd down converted is a drive extended and one more play they have to defend.

The offense keeping the ball for longer periods of time will help with time of possession and limit the amount of snaps by opponents. This may be something that never gets better with a coach so offensive minded, the defense suffers always.....

......see Big 12 / Pack 12 historically....
Click to expand...
Not playing three of the top four QBs in the country?
 
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#33
#33
Quit lining up 5 yards off line of scrimmage and stop the f____g slant play and tackle the damn quarterback. 2 times this year qb runs have made us look like fools.
 
#35
#35
So in other words according to many of you there's nothing they can do? That's just it. They can't do anything schematically? Nothing different? Just don't have talent and depth? That's literally the only answer? Not buying it. I think we finally have some good coaches hopefully they'll figure it out instead of just blaming it on lack of depth and talent
 
#36
#36
madbamahater said:
What can be done from a schematic standpoint to help get the Vols off the field on 3rd down for what? Whether it's 3rd and short or 3rd and long, the defensive woes are a chronic issue. For every 3rd down converted is a drive extended and one more play they have to defend.

The offense keeping the ball for longer periods of time will help with time of possession and limit the amount of snaps by opponents. This may be something that never gets better with a coach so offensive minded, the defense suffers always.....

......see Big 12 / Pack 12 historically....
Click to expand...
Depth. Specifically quality depth.
A hybrid LB/DB at star for 3rd down situations. 3 more quality CBs to keep legs fresh and 3 more Safeties for the same purpose. 4 more Dline guys and 3 pass rush specialist DEs for fresh legs and situational play. So 15 more guys on D either trained up already on the roster or via portal or highschool.

On O you need 2 tackles, a guard and a C, 2 more WRs, and an RB you can plug in. A QB of the future would be nice too.

15+8 puts you at 23 with 32? I believe being the max for 2022s class? So between guys already on the roster and those that will be brought in it’s doable with the portal. Still expect the real bump in year 3.
 
#37
#37
TN is the worst open field tackling team. QB running at our LB or DB has a decided advantage because our guys try and run right up to the face of the QB or other runner. A quick cut or side step and our guys are beat. It's tough to make that tackle in most cases but our guys need to learn to slow down and wait for the cut or move when they get close. You don't have to big hit everybody just get them on the ground. We miss a lot of tackles well short of the 1st down marker.
 
#38
#38
The past two weeks? Holding calls on opposing offensive tackles would have helped. Several times the difference between #6 getting home and a big play was a hold.

Not sure what the agenda is but someone in the AD needs to have a private meeting with the head of officials.

Other than that... UT needs more experience and/or talent at CB. It all starts there. If you can trust those two guys to lock down outside receivers then you can do more to stop the QB run.
 
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#39
#39
Smokeyone said:
Depth. Specifically quality depth.
A hybrid LB/DB at star for 3rd down situations. 3 more quality CBs to keep legs fresh and 3 more Safeties for the same purpose. 4 more Dline guys and 3 pass rush specialist DEs for fresh legs and situational play. So 15 more guys on D either trained up already on the roster or via portal or highschool.

On O you need 2 tackles, a guard and a C, 2 more WRs, and an RB you can plug in. A QB of the future would be nice too.

15+8 puts you at 23 with 32? I believe being the max for 2022s class? So between guys already on the roster and those that will be brought in it’s doable with the portal. Still expect the real bump in year 3.
Click to expand...
If there's a place that UT is very good it is the star position. Jackson, Slaughter, and Turnage have been excellent.
 
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#40
#40
GAVol said:
We just don’t have very many difference makers in the front 6/7.
Click to expand...

I disagree.

Depth will cause missed tackles and being slower to the gap but we aren’t see that issue.

We are seeing wide open running lanes on 3rd and long multiple times when it’s clear the QB will run.

The Ole Miss game was a disaster of scheming on third down and he was normally to the sticks before our secondary even touched him. You have to keep a spy there and we weren’t.

That is not just depth.
 
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#41
#41
We've got to stop giving teams so much cushion. It's almost like our DBs eyes are everywhere but on the receivers. Always 10 users away from the play. We need to press a little more.

If we would have taken the lbs off the line against OM we stop the scramble up the middle. Only had 1 lb most of the time and he got beat in the Oklahoma dril every time, or couldn't make thre 1-1 tackle. Too many down linemen/lbs.

I noticed that when we did have more than 1 lb in the middle, they would audible, and we'd bite and lbs would move to the line, then he'd run the qb draw up the middle.

D line is good. Need to fix everything else
 
#43
#43
NEO said:
I disagree.

Depth will cause missed tackles and being slower to the gap but we aren’t see that issue.

We are seeing wide open running lanes on 3rd and long multiple times when it’s clear the QB will run.

The Ole Miss game was a disaster of scheming on third down and he was normally to the sticks before our secondary even touched him. You have to keep a spy there and we weren’t.

That is not just depth.
Click to expand...
I hate to tell you, but often we actually had a spy on Corral and he was getting absolutely toyed with. And Jeremy Banks kept just playing catch with the Center.
 
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#44
#44
The secondary is horrid, they don’t play zone well and I’m assuming they can’t cover man either because they rarely if ever run it. The lack of steady pressure from the d line is also a factor. The Vols just don’t have the horses to run with the big dogs yet unfortunately.
 
#45
#45
Bodies/ depth are problems yes. However, these 3rd down issues aren't only happening late in games where depth would come into play... they are occurring throughout the game [even early during games].
 
#47
#47
madbamahater said:
What can be done from a schematic standpoint to help get the Vols off the field on 3rd down for what? Whether it's 3rd and short or 3rd and long, the defensive woes are a chronic issue. For every 3rd down converted is a drive extended and one more play they have to defend.

The offense keeping the ball for longer periods of time will help with time of possession and limit the amount of snaps by opponents. This may be something that never gets better with a coach so offensive minded, the defense suffers always.....

......see Big 12 / Pack 12 historically....
Click to expand...
I think it's speed at linebacker. We are so slow at that position, that if a QB decides to run, our guys aren't quick enough to react to the decision the QB makes.
 
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#49
#49
MurphyVol said:
I've never understood why coaches don't blitz more when they know they're in a "we can't stop them no matter what" situation.

I'd always rather go down swinging.
Click to expand...


Two schools of thought. 1 is the more plays an offense runs the better chance they’ll screw up ( penalty, blown play, sack, etc) The other is to force play with blitzes.

Young has proven the blitz doesn’t bother him as much and Bama has improved greatly picking it up. Banks elected to make them go the long way most of the night. I don’t disagree cause Bama can hit huge plays fast. Only the 3rd & 15 really hurt as a big play.

If Tennessee had been able just to pick up first downs on the 3rd & shorts, the possessions by Bama would have been reduced. Let’s face it, the o, while it hit big plays, did nothing to help the defense all night.
 
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#50
#50
I think it’s also scheme. Since we don’t have top line talent or depth, I think Banks wants to make teams drive down the field hoping for mistakes from opposing team vs selling out to get the qb and have gash plays.
 
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