Way off "Target"ting

[Aerie Vol]

I tried to search for a thread, merge if needed:

Why do we seem to be the target, pardon the pun, of such crap targetting calls? [not Randolph], Moseley, JRM, it's all such a worthless rule as currently implemented. I recall flipping the TV to the next game on the day [edit - NOT Randolph] Moseley was ejected and seeing a DB launch into a WR streaking down the sideline, placing the crown of his helmet in the side of the WR's head, and the announcers praised what a great hit it was. No flag, no review.

Now JRM gets tossed for hitting a guy whose head is below chest level with a glancing blow at best, but the Texas DB puts crown into the facemask of an Irish receiver on one of the biggest plays, in the biggest game, on the biggest stage the nation has....and nada. Irish WR has a concussion. Crap rule needs flushed down the crapper.

AV

Edited: I mistakenly put Randolph when I meant Moseley on his epic hit against KY, which was in no way targetting. I think Randolph was an idiot on his targetting play, if I remember correctly.

 

[VolFreakJosh]

JRM shouldn't have been ejected. Plain and simple.

 

[ReaderVol]

I tried to search for a thread, merge if needed:

Why do we seem to be the target, pardon the pun, of such crap targetting calls? Randolph, JRM, it's all such a worthless rule as currently implemented. I recall flipping the TV to the next game on the day Randolph was ejected and seeing a DB launch into a WR streaking down the sideline, placing the crown of his helmet in the side of the WR's head, and the announcers praised what a great hit it was. No flag, no review.

Now JRM gets tossed for hitting a guy whose head is below chest level with a glancing blow at best, but the Texas DB puts crown into the facemask of an Irish receiver on one of the biggest plays, in the biggest game, on the biggest stage the nation has....and nada. Irish WR has a concussion. Crap rule needs flushed down the crapper.

AV

The rule doesn't allow for the changing of levels by the offensive player. JRM is a perfect example. When JRM lowered to hit the guy he was standing as JRM made contact the guy sunk down to make the catch thus resulting in a "by the rule" targeting.

 

[SaintLouisVol]

While the "refs hate us" narrative is always a fun one, I don't think it's true in this case. I probably watch 3-4 CFB games, at lease in part, every week, and it seems to me that maybe as many as half of the targeting calls are B.S, and many more are missed altogether.

It's a difficult rule to enforce and a bunch of team have gotten hosed by it.

 

[Boca Vol]

The rule doesn't allow for the changing of levels by the offensive player. JRM is a perfect example. When JRM lowered to hit the guy he was standing as JRM made contact the guy sunk down to make the catch thus resulting in a "by the rule" targeting.

This. :good!:

Had the returner stayed upright it would have been a textbook tackle. Since he bent his knees it resulted in targeting. JRM did nothing wrong, but by the rule it was head to head.

 

[LargeOrange1]

Lets just be glad the ejection occurred in the first half.....otherwise, we are without JRM for the entire first half on Saturday. Lets go Vols.....WAX THEIR @$$!! :dance2:

 

[Skullbone]

It's just an incremental step towards two hand touch if you ask me. Now people aren't allowed to hit receivers when they catch the ball, but instead have to allow them to turn around, look them in the eye, and take two or three steps.

 

[SaintLouisVol]

The rule doesn't allow for the changing of levels by the offensive player. JRM is a perfect example. When JRM lowered to hit the guy he was standing as JRM made contact the guy sunk down to make the catch thus resulting in a "by the rule" targeting.

This is the biggest problem with it by far. If they want to enforce the 15 yards anyway, I guess I can live with it. It's no different than an accidental face mask.

But, in the cases where the offensive player re-directs himself after the defensive player commits to the hit, it is ridiculous to eject the player.

 

[ReaderVol]

This is the biggest problem with it by far. If they want to enforce the 15 yards anyway, I guess I can live with it. It's no different than an accidental face mask.

But, in the cases where the offensive player re-directs himself after the defensive player commits to the hit, it is ridiculous to eject the player.

I agree. The rules committe really needs to look at it. But do to media pressure they won't.

 

[CoaxialOrange]

If you're talking about Randolph targeting from last year that one was a stupid boneheaded play.

 

[m1al]

It's just an incremental step towards two hand touch if you ask me. Now people aren't allowed to hit receivers when they catch the ball, but instead have to allow them to turn around, look them in the eye, and take two or three steps.

Been saying it for a while now.. The game is in the process of being ruined so we might as well get rid of the pads, put flags on them and be done with it..

We'll have NCAAFFB and the NFFL...

 

[vollygirl]

It's just an incremental step towards two hand touch if you ask me. Now people aren't allowed to hit receivers when they catch the ball, but instead have to allow them to turn around, look them in the eye, and take two or three steps.

We got a penalty last, was it against UGA?, and the scenario happened exactly like that. Receiver turned, took two steps, and we got a penalty for hitting a defenseless player.

 

[wtmvol]

I tried to search for a thread, merge if needed:

Why do we seem to be the target, pardon the pun, of such crap targetting calls? Randolph, JRM, it's all such a worthless rule as currently implemented. I recall flipping the TV to the next game on the day Randolph was ejected and seeing a DB launch into a WR streaking down the sideline, placing the crown of his helmet in the side of the WR's head, and the announcers praised what a great hit it was. No flag, no review.

Now JRM gets tossed for hitting a guy whose head is below chest level with a glancing blow at best, but the Texas DB puts crown into the facemask of an Irish receiver on one of the biggest plays, in the biggest game, on the biggest stage the nation has....and nada. Irish WR has a concussion. Crap rule needs flushed down the crapper.

AV

I don't fault the refs for the JRM ejection. Someone else said it on here, but I agree that there needs to be a revision to make it like basketball where there is a differentiation between intentional and incidental head to head (flagrant 1 vs 2). Intentional leads to ejection while incidental is just a 15 yard penalty. I think we all would have been fine with a 15 yard penalty for JRM on that play.

Your other point is valid about the Texas/ND play. That was WAY worse than the Randolph hit.

 

[Volingatorland]

I don't necessarily hate the intent of the rule, it's there to protect the players, and that's a good thing. However, what I have a serious issue with is how inconsistently it's called. NCAA rules officials need to sit down and take a really hard look at the rule and how to properly call it, because there's so much variation in calls that it looks like "call it if you feel like it"

The Texas/ND hit was 100% targeting, without question and went uncalled. JRM's hit was certainly not kick catch interference, nor was it really targeting, yet both were called. It blows my mind.

 

[vol-un-tear]

SEC refs have been bad for a long time. They can pretty much make dumb calls and have no accountability.

 

[Volingatorland]

SEC refs have been bad for a long time. They can pretty much make dumb calls and have no accountability.

Seemed to be NCAA wide last year, and not just on targeting. Weren't there some investigations because blatantly bad calls pretty much changed the outcome of games?

 

[VolFreakJosh]

We got a penalty last, was it against UGA?, and the scenario happened exactly like that. Receiver turned, took two steps, and we got a penalty for hitting a defenseless player.

You're thinking of that game against Kentucky where Emmanuel Moseley got penalized for hitting an "defenseless" receiver after he turned and took two steps. It also resulted in an ejection and Butch Jones was pissed. Very bad call to this very day.

 

[fade route]

Been saying it for a while now.. The game is in the process of being ruined so we might as well get rid of the pads, put flags on them and be done with it..

We'll have NCAAFFB and the NFFL...

This will be a serious discussion and a very public effort to ban football altogether the next time an ex-NFL player kills himself who had a history of concussions.

 

[Volfan76]

The returner crouched down while catching the ball. JRM's total target was less than 3 ft tall. take off the head and "neck area" and you have less than 2 ft to legally tackle. Had JRM aimed his hit lower, he would have dislocated the returners knee. The rule is too ambiguous to blanketly cover every tackling situation in football. The rule, in it's current definition could be exploited by offensive players to prevent a defender from making a tackle. They are going to end up ruining the game of football.

 

[chargervol]

The rule doesn't allow for the changing of levels by the offensive player. JRM is a perfect example. When JRM lowered to hit the guy he was standing as JRM made contact the guy sunk down to make the catch thus resulting in a "by the rule" targeting.

Exactly. Except that was supposed to change this year.
Of course I'm biased but I wouldn't bother lying about this.
The new rules were supposed to allow the review to judge intent. I rewatched The play probably 10 times, and in every angle, JRM had left the ground before the guy dropped down.

It was an exact textbook case to implement the new rule. And it failed miserably. Hell, why even bother writing them.

Oh yeah, cause Bama.

 

[johnrlansford]

I tried to search for a thread, merge if needed:

Why do we seem to be the target, pardon the pun, of such crap targetting calls? Randolph, JRM, it's all such a worthless rule as currently implemented. I recall flipping the TV to the next game on the day Randolph was ejected and seeing a DB launch into a WR streaking down the sideline, placing the crown of his helmet in the side of the WR's head, and the announcers praised what a great hit it was. No flag, no review.

Now JRM gets tossed for hitting a guy whose head is below chest level with a glancing blow at best, but the Texas DB puts crown into the facemask of an Irish receiver on one of the biggest plays, in the biggest game, on the biggest stage the nation has....and nada. Irish WR has a concussion. Crap rule needs flushed down the crapper.

AV

What most people including myself (who was at the game) didn't see was the returner actually signaled for a fair catch as soon as the ball was snapped. they talked about it on the Sports Source Sunday morning. No one saw it because it was so early, the analyst on the Sports Source seem to think that played a part in the call.

 

[ButchPlz]

The fact that this discussion on what is and isn't targeting happens every single year is an indicator of just how bad the rule is.

If nobody watching and analyzing games can tell you exactly what it is, referees can't do it either. That's a problem.

 

[Volingatorland]

What most people including myself (who was at the game) didn't see was the returner actually signaled for a fair catch as soon as the ball was snapped. they talked about it on the Sports Source Sunday morning. No one saw it because it was so early, the analyst on the Sports Source seem to think that played a part in the call.

No one, I'm pretty sure not even the refs saw that fair catch in real time. I keep watching replays and don't see it still. There's gotta be a time when it's legally too early to signal.

IMO, this was designed by Appy St to draw a big penalty and possible ejection.

 

[volquest86]

We got a penalty last, was it against UGA?, and the scenario happened exactly like that. Receiver turned, took two steps, and we got a penalty for hitting a defenseless player.

I do believe it was against Kentucky. Moseley made a clean perfect tackle on the WR but was ruled targeting to a defenseless WR....this summer they made the announcement that the wrong call was made and that Moseley's tackle should have never been in question.

 

[Aerie Vol]

The rule doesn't allow for the changing of levels by the offensive player. JRM is a perfect example. When JRM lowered to hit the guy he was standing as JRM made contact the guy sunk down to make the catch thus resulting in a "by the rule" targeting.

Exactly, which is why...scary as it is to say...they have to add in the subjective determination of "did the tackler INTEND to hit helmet to helmet." Or "was the helmet to helmet contact unavoidable by the defender."

As already mentioned, JRM makes one of the prettiest form tackles ever if App guy doesn't decide to squat. Again, we move closer and closer to "if you want to avoid a penalty, destroy your opponent's knees." That's not good for the players, or the sport.

AV